To say that there is a huge amount of anti vax threads allowed on mumsnet?

[visitingagain]

I fully expect this to be taken down but I am getting completely fed up with the number of anti vax and anti mask threads on mumsnet at the moment. People should be allowed to express views but some of the misinformation is shocking.

@TisTheSeasonToBeVegan

You decided I am aggressive for saying you had issues with boundaries. I’m just stating what is clear to see. And you continue to pretend that your smily face wasn’t sarcasm after what you had written. 🤯

I’m not vaccinated, no, but I couldn’t care less what others do. You will find no misinformation in my posts so there is literally nothing to challenge me on.
And now you’re playing some sort of victim. 🙄

Your responses, overall, have been bizarrely disproportionate - and, yes, aggressive.

I'm perfectly happy not to use emojis to you if it's what you prefer (or I'll at least do my best to remember). But by definition, you can't possibly know my intent when writing earlier messages: it seems absolutely strange to insist that an emoji which I appended to a post for a normal reason must actually be there for some secret, hidden one...

I think it needs an actual statistic. Someone should count the pro and anti posts.

I don’t see any evidence of anti vaccine in mumsnet. If anything it appears to be a panic in the other direction. The few anti vaccine posts appear to be from people doing it for their own reasons ( had Covid already, don’t want side effects from the jab) rather than conspiracy theories.
You see what you want to see.

Innocenta

I don’t care if you use emojis or not. But I don’t believe for a second that your ‘so it’s not for a medical reason’ followed by a was anything other than rude and sarcastic.

If you feel it’s aggressive for me to point out you have boundary issues when you keep asking people’s vaccination status and reasons, not just on this thread, then that’s your issue. It is overstepping boundaries. It is none of your business. You should learn boundaries or people will point this out to you.

Saying that I need to be moderated for anti vax views? What anti vax views? I’m unvaccinated but have given no reason and have spread zero information at all. I have encouraged my kids to be vaccinated and although they don’t want to be, I continue to encourage them to change their mind. My partner has his booster this week.

Obviously you're allowed to think any given post is rude, TisTheSeason, it's not something anyone can stop you from thinking!

But the fact remains that using an emoji to signal tone is a normative, well-established online behaviour. It is not considered objectively rude or offensive. I didn't use any slurs, insulting language, allcaps, or similar verbal or formatting choices that would have unavoidably conveyed negativity - the reason for that is that I was, at that time, doubtful and curious, but not feeling negatively towards the poster! So it just seems a bit silly for you to keep insisting you know what was in my mind better than I do.

The impression it gives, however, is that you cannot stand to see anyone challenged if they express a viewpoint that accords with your own (i.e. they are not vaccinated). There are some good reasons not to get vaccinated! They are rare, but they exist. I'm also always happy to talk about the ethics of a situation like this. But time and again it is those coming from an anti-vaxxer standpoint who meet quite calm and civil questions with radically escalated hostility.

You asked, you had no right to. Why do you feel you have that right.

Are you ten? It is perfectly reasonable to ask someone who is pushing an agenda or repeating misinformation or clearly hostile to vaccines and actual data that displeases them (whether that hostility is overt or veiled) if they have been vaccinated. It is interesting to me that most such posters angrily refuse to answer this question. It is not an offensive question, really. I think your aggression, baiting, and snideness on this thread is very offensive, however.

You’re going to keep on insisting that your emoji and comment were perfectly innocent. Based on your comments here and other threads, o choose not to believe you. Using emojis to be sarcastic is also a well established behaviour.

I don’t like to see people questioned about their medical information. It’s rude. If the posted wanted you to know the reason, they would have told you. They said something like personal choice but this wasn’t good enough for you. So you continued. That’s unpleasant so I will point that out as that is what I don’t like to see.

I’ve already said I encourage my children to be vaccinated and my partner has had 2 vaccinations and I will he will be having his booster this week. I will be driving him as he felt unwell within 30 minutes of his last vaccine. But yes, I’m anti vax and have issues with vaccinated people. 🙄

I have no interest in talking about the ethics of the vaccine, why would I. It works, there’s not much else to say except people must be free to make the decision whether to have it or not.

My only hostility is to those who don’t respect people’s boundaries and choices on this matter, both vaccinated and unvaccinated.

So what was the reason for your post with the smiley face then? It was clear already that the poster wasn't vaccinated for any medical reason, so why did you feel the need to state it yourself for everyone to see unless as a, not so subtle, dig? Maybe we have indeed misinterpreted you though, so please set us straight.

Also implying thatTistheseason is posting with 'radically escalated hostility' is just silly. No-one here is posting with any hostility, just the usual forthright discussion you get on this kind of topic on mumsnet or most chat forums.

@LadyCampanulaTottington here you go www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/causes-of-cancer/diet-and-cancer/does-eating-processed-and-red-meat-cause-cancer

milkyaqua

I haven’t seen anything from that poster that was pushing an anti vax agenda or any misinformation from them. Yet they were asked why they weren’t vaccinated. Their answer was apparently not good enough so a response of ‘so not a medical’ with a smily face was given. It was clearly sarcastic.

I just don’t know why people think they can ask people medical info. It’s weird.

Are you ten? It is perfectly reasonable to ask someone who is pushing an agenda or repeating misinformation or clearly hostile to vaccines and actual data that displeases them (whether that hostility is overt or veiled) if they have been vaccinated. It is interesting to me that most such posters angrily refuse to answer this question.

Why is it reasonable? Of course most people who are likely to be critical of the pressure put on the unvaccinated are themselves likely to be unvaccinated. Why do you need to know that and how exactly do you think it invalidates their argument?

'You would say that, you're unvaccinated' - well duh.

I think it is a reasonable question, after a certain point of reading someone's posts. Often, I would assume from their tone of discourse that someone has not been vaccinated and/or is an anti-vaxxer, but it turns out they are just anti-masks/restrictions/mitigation measures of every sort and in fact have gone out and got themselves double-vaxxed. Or posters up in arms and all 'we weren't told we'd have to have boosters!' etc, turn out to be double-vaxxed but against boosters. I would prefer to know, rather than just receive a false impression that they deem themselves immune to all harm and have 'done their own risk assessment, thanks'.

Yes YABU

milkyaqua

But that particular poster only posted twice on the whole thread, nothing to make you think they had an anti vax agenda.

I'm talking in general.

I’m pissed off as I got told to change my name but all the anti vax stuff is allowed to stand

I'm talking in general

I’m not. This was a specific example of someone overstepping, being rude asking and then being sarcastic at their response to feel what...superior?

But in general, I don’t really think anyone should ask anyone’s vaccination status on here. In real life if someone is vulnerable, I can understand. And I think people should take an LFT before mixing, wear masks and social distance where possible, especially if they’re unvaccinated.

I’m pissed off as I got told to change my name but all the anti vax stuff is allowed to stand

Who told you to change your name? 😬

Also, which anti vax stuff is allowed to stand, can you link? I’ve seen the ‘face nappy’ 🙄 type posts get deleted.

@TisTheSeasonToBeVegan

I'm talking in general

I’m not. This was a specific example of someone overstepping, being rude asking and then being sarcastic at their response to feel what...superior?

But in general, I don’t really think anyone should ask anyone’s vaccination status on here. In real life if someone is vulnerable, I can understand. And I think people should take an LFT before mixing, wear masks and social distance where possible, especially if they’re unvaccinated.

As the posts in question were deleted, it is a little hard to understand the full story. But you have been going off like a frog in a sock ever since.

As the posts in question were deleted, it is a little hard to understand the full story. But you have been going off like a frog in a sock ever since.

All the posts are still there apart from one but even that one still exists in my quote.

It seems that when people don’t want to listen, because they’ve been called out for being rude and not respecting boundaries, they accuse posters of being hostile and now you are accusing me of going on too much because I won’t be shut down. 🤷🏻‍♀️

@milkyaqua The very fact that MNHQ deleted my innocuous and civil post only illustrates their bias against people who are post from a pro-vaccine perspective. Believe me, I have sent a further informal complaint about the lack of even-handed moderation, and will be following it up with a formal one ASAP.

*posting

@TisTheSeasonToBeVegan

I'm talking in general

I’m not. This was a specific example of someone overstepping, being rude asking and then being sarcastic at their response to feel what...superior?

But in general, I don’t really think anyone should ask anyone’s vaccination status on here. In real life if someone is vulnerable, I can understand. And I think people should take an LFT before mixing, wear masks and social distance where possible, especially if they’re unvaccinated.

I was not being sarcastic, though.

@TisTheSeasonToBeVegan

milkyaqua

I haven’t seen anything from that poster that was pushing an anti vax agenda or any misinformation from them. Yet they were asked why they weren’t vaccinated. Their answer was apparently not good enough so a response of ‘so not a medical’ with a smily face was given. It was clearly sarcastic.

I just don’t know why people think they can ask people medical info. It’s weird.

It was not sarcastic. You are not psychic.

I listened to an excellent podcast on this topic.
It's on YouTube

Well worth a listen/view because it's a very thorough scientific, but accessible discussion WITHOUT name calling and smugness.
An actual discussion.
Not a person repeatedly stating facts that cannot be disputed.
It actually provides a lot of interesting subject matter.

Search for:
A cautionary message from vaccine advocates (Dr Arditi Bhargava).
I actually watched the whole thing, and it's very interesting.

It’s only on MN that I have heard so many anti-vax opinions expressed. Everyone I know is vaccinated and happy to wear a mask to protect others. I’ve been really shocked by how misinformed people are on here and how little they are willing to put themselves out (let’s face it getting vaccinated and wearing a mask are pretty minor) to help others and get us out of this mess.