Under 14s in NZ to be banned from ever buying cigarettes in their lifetime

[Shouldiwearmyhairinaponytail]

metro.co.uk/2021/12/09/new-zealand-bans-people-14-and-under-from-ever-buying-cigarettes-15743607/

Thoughts?

Not being the right age to buy fags or booze has never stopped anyone.

For the past 20 years, I have wondered why this has never been implemented in the UK. So obvious and simple. Cigs aren’t like junk food and booze. Food - well you need to eat it and there is a fine line between ok/not ok. Booze - I don’t personally care for it and wouldn’t care if it was banned tomorrow but in moderation it’s fine. Cigs are bad full stop.

Why not just ban them entirely? Disgusting habit. Anyone who smokes nowadays must truly be stupid. Literal self harm. 🤢

I don't know why cigarettes can't just be banned for general sale immediately - giving time for withdrawal programmes first. Terrible stuff. Except the government gets a lot of tax, so it won't be banned here, probably.

Tobacco industry makes a shit ton of tax. It is all about money in the end.

Well, the good news is, there may be coming available on the market for Leading the Leaders forward an absolutely fabulous, wonderful, extraordinarily magnificent many words many many words blaffff bllaffghuu

Let me give this some thought - um, er - NO THANKS!

Dear God appreciate an intelligent insightful leader when you have one

Exactly, and I for one do.

Good for them.

The tobacco industry has behaved appallingly for decades. They knew it killed for years and years. And suppressed research that concluded that it was a killer for years. Like, 20 years or something.

Actions in countries with less regulation around promoting cigarettes, and even when they did introduce laws. They had s huge focus on doing whatever they could to get children smoking, and hopefully addicted.

I was a v heavy smoker for 20+ years btw and unfortunately started again during lockdown. Anecdotally in local area, that happened to a load of people esp ex smokers.

This it's oppression, what next etc etc.

It KILLS. It is extremely addictive. It is a bastard to quit.
It's so difficult that people will keep at it even after eg having s leg amputated due to smoking.

It’s ironic when wood burners are so popular over there and cause huge pollution and health issues.

And those saying it's an affront to personal freedom, choice etc.

We have in my lifetime-

Banned smoking in shops banks etc
Banned it on buses and tube
Banned it in pubs and nightclubs
Increased the tax steeply to the point where tobacco/ packet of fags is incredibly expensive.
Early 90s about 1.80 for 20. Now over 20 quid! Base cost is really cheap.

Given it's highly addictive. And free choice! Etc.

I would say the govt raking in £££ in tax. Tax paid by a group that include plenty of people who can't quit and really can't afford it.
That's not freedom! That's shitty.

Kudos to NZ.

Never happen here because govt like the tax take.

@AlwaysLatte

I don't know why cigarettes can't just be banned for general sale immediately - giving time for withdrawal programmes first. Terrible stuff. Except the government gets a lot of tax, so it won't be banned here, probably.

I can give some reasons apart from tax.

Loads of people smoke and are addicted.
Loads of people smoke socially.

Total ban means a lot of people desperate for fags.

Black market will supply. Including fake ones containing all sorts of shit even worse than not fake.
People going continent smuggling loads back.
Illegal imports.
Buying fags if illegal would I imagine be something that drug dealers would do a lot.

Result-
People being exposed to black market/ engaging in criminal behaviour/ dodgy people with all sorts of other stuff for sale that they never had any contact with before.
Smoking becomes illicit. Makes it cool again for young people,/children,? Good chance I reckon.
In general having lots of otherwise law abiding people engaging in criminal activity has an effect of weakening the weight of the law. Looking at the police differently. Changing view in general of crime, law, that sort of thing. Because they are now one of the bad people.

All that side of it.

That's why the NZ approach is good.

@LarryTheLurker

Ardern is a fanatic who wants to impose her own values on the people of NZ regardless of what they want.

She has been a disaster and will be gone soon.

Actually she’s brilliant. We have one of the lowest death rates from COVID in the OECD. We also have one of the most highly vaccinated populations. She is measured, mature and seeks specialist advice.

I think JA is frightening. Being pleased because of course you don't want 13-year-olds to smoke makes no sense. According to the law, one day you'll have to be 30 to smoke. Then one day, 50-year-olds will be told they're too young. It's weirdly authoritarian. Rates of smoking have already decreased dramatically through educating people about the risks. If an adult still wants to do so, that's their choice.

(I've never smoked, but I respect that other people can make different choices to my own.)

@Grida

I don’t get people’s enthusiasm for banning stuff. It is as if some people would like to be school children for their entire lives and have all decisions taken away from them.

I do wonder about the consequences of telling our young people that petty authoritarian rules at school are good for them and prepare them for adult life. Both on the young people and the parents who tell them this.

Do we think you should just be able to rock up to a shop and buy heroin?? Cigarettes are worse!

Of course it's a good idea. Kudos to NZ.

I think JA is frightening

All these ridiculous comments such as the above. Do you seriously think the PM makes all these decisions, gets legislation passed etc. without a word of consulation or debate with anyone else in parliament?

"Frightening" is simply the most ludicrous word to describe her. I would be far more frightened if we had a complete buffoon for a PM (mentioning no names).

All this will do is create another black market revenue stream for the gangs to run alongside their P distribution. Roll on 2023.

Lol at those who think JA is shit.

She can string a sentence
She doesn't lie without shame (she probably lies but at least has the good grace to lie well)
She at least pretends to be human

So in my book of very low standards she beats the other wankers hands down.

Phasing out smoking is a bloody awesome idea.

What a load of hysterical bollocks on here, and a whole lot of Western privilege to boot. Did a pp really compare banning of cigarettes to - oh let's see, the mass slaughter of civilians buried in unmarked graves a-la Saddam Hussein? How about live organ harvesting from political prisoners as in China? Or the teenager sentenced to death by firing squad for smuggling in a copy of Squid Game in North Korea? I am in New Zealand and have yet to see anything remotely like this, and honestly to compare this legislation to the horrors my refugee friends have been through is just beyond the pale. The internet is just ridiculous for this equating of minor things with the worst atrocities, it only makes light of the very real suffering of people around the world. The fact you're even complaining about this shows you are privileged beyond your wildest dreams & yes, if you, unlike my friend, haven't had your entire family murdered by your govt and had to run for three days straight to get to safety, with soldiers hunting you and shooting at you and never knowing if your next breath will be your last - yes, you are unimaginably privileged. Get some perspective. You may not like JA but she's pretty damn far from a dictator.

That said - whether this policy is a good one I don't know. Prohibition is not always the best way, as the drug industry shows us. However I do note no-one is yelling about removing the prohibition on the production and distribution of child pornography (also a commodity driven by the underworld and a demand that will not cease despite legislation), or calling us a dictatorship because we make vehicles and drivers pass safety checks before they're allowed to be on the road, or because food products and medicines have to pass specific safety tests before being allowed on the market. How about regulations on baby cots to prevent unnecessary deaths? Carseat safety? Clean drinking water? The recent recall on lead-contaminated sugar? Earthquake proofing our buildings? No? Just smoking then, I guess. Because #freedom.

I detest smoking but Adern is unbearable.
I doubt very much whether this will be the end of it. She obviously enjoyed being The PM Who Make COVID Disappear (kind of) and seems to have acquired a taste for banning stuff.

@LarryTheLurker

Ardern is a fanatic who wants to impose her own values on the people of NZ regardless of what they want.

She has been a disaster and will be gone soon.

😂 😂 😂

@AlternativePerspective

I find it rather interesting that people seem to think that JA is such an inspiration for having curtailed the freedom of an entire country for the past almost two years and yet those same people seem to be up in arms when the government here suggest they should wear a mask in shops.

It’s easy to applaud the rules someone else makes when you’re not the ones being forced to follow them.

And yet she is such a popular leader. Despite your countless posts spitting vile and your claims to know her "real" agenda.

Maybe, just maybe, you don't speak for everyone? Maybe the Labour government is well supported because they are doing a good job.

But hey don't let facts and stats get in the way of your anti-Jacinda crusade.

@XenoBitch

Tobacco industry makes a shit ton of tax. It is all about money in the end.

Yes that's why it hasn't been banned in many countries.

I'm so glad it's being banned here. We have known for decades that nicotine is horribly addictive and damaging, now let's do something about it. Well done Labour.

@Enb76

Because banning stuff works so well.

Prohibition works
War on drugs etc...

This is a terrible thing - the only thing that banning stuff does is lead to criminality. Banning something gives it a power it would not otherwise have.

I agree with this. It will be interesting to see the long term results - more of other drugs??

She applauded the transwoman taking the place of a local indigenous woman - burnt her boats there as far as I'm concerned.

I’m also in NZ and as someone else pointed out, hardly any young people smoke, so this will fit in with the general trend.

As for “government control” - please. As it stands - I can’t smoke in a car with my kid in it. I can’t smack my kid. I need a licence to drive and to fish. When those things were introduced people jumped up and down too - if it was all down to “but my freedom” we would be lawless.