to think you can tell when someone is 'very' wealthy

[nothingbutsnow]

.....more due to how they behave, a sort of self possession than actual money signifiers like clothes, jewellery, etc?

By wealth I mean perhaps more than just well off.

It's something i thought about a few days ago in a garden centre, a family passed by us with teens and there was just something obvious yet not easily described. Clothes were sort of 'anti-mumsnet', like skinny jeans, bright tops, nothing remarkable visually. It made me realise I had observed this before but never thought much of it.
It was more a sort of looming self confidence, not especially pleasant, but noticeably interesting! Not rude or ignorant but disconnected from their surroundings enough to tread on your toes.
I've seen discussions on MN about such things in the past, and the difference in my experience has been they are rarely thin, but more buxom, tall, strident. The teen girl was in skinnies, tshirt and trainers (nothing remarkable) but she had an expression that I can't describe.

There doesn't seem to be an interest in trends at all, especially fashion.

People on here always say it is battered up old Barbour jackets, moth eaten cashmere and dog hair, but I think this is a stereotype rarely seen outside of the rural eccentric.
To me the give away is posture (not so much elegant as assertive), air of disinterest and a certain way of existing in/taking up space differently.

None of this is important, but it's something i noticed. Anyone agree that it is indefinable yet obvious?

Think it's nonsense tbh. Nobody would give Warren Buffet, Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates, Jack Ma etc ( to take extreme examples) a second glance. Money doesn't give.you some magical aura, (unless your vain enough to kit yourself out in £50ks worth of designer gear). The rich are just normal people with 3 or 4 extra zeros at the end of their bank statement.

In fact, from my own occasional and friends occasional happening upon rich people (footballers, pop/rock star, politicians, author) what really takes you back is how "small", and normal they are IRL.

They always have new and clean shoes I think

[quote LaplandLucy]@nothingbutsnow so you saw a family in a shop. You invented that they were wealthy in your head and then posted about how you can tell people who are wealthy by their demeanour. I mean can you??? You’ve no idea if those people are wealthy at all… you just decided they were [/quote]
this! But also I live is a filthy rich area, both old and new money. My late husband was in a global company who had multiple dealings with comparatively small businesses run by their owners who were weathy by anybody's standards. I met quite a few of them and some became friends. I used to work in the NHS in the community and visited many people in their own homes through their GP's. Again both old and new money. Yes you could tell who CAME from old money because they fitted the rural old money profile. Some were still minted, some were not. I knew this because I was involved in suggesting equipment and care packages. The rich ones were the ones who would pick up the phone (or an adult child would) and just order what was needed, those without wealth would apply to social services for funding.
I also worked with a woman who by MN standards would have been assessed as rich old money....attitude, clothing hobbies, voice...all fitted the profile but while she came from an old money family, the money had long gone.
You can't always tell....often you'd be wrong

@hugocat

They always have new and clean shoes I think

really obvs you don't meet them in the country then

I think your point about giving off an air of disinterestedness in their surroundings and taking up space differently is a good one. Wealthy folk presumably never have to think about how to ‘be’, or act, or interact with others, in society. They presumably have the confidence that never having to worry about money, or what other people think of them, brings to day-to-day living.

Old money you can tell by the way they speak they are likely understated, maybe careless in their dress, even drive a oldish car, some actually don’t have much cash. Yet they are sitting on £10m of property that the next generation will inherit.

New money, anything goes, maybe they have a pile, maybe it’s all borrowed, there will be clues, jewelry, car, maybe demanding.

@Crazykatie

Old money you can tell by the way they speak they are likely understated, maybe careless in their dress, even drive a oldish car, some actually don’t have much cash. Yet they are sitting on £10m of property that the next generation will inherit.

New money, anything goes, maybe they have a pile, maybe it’s all borrowed, there will be clues, jewelry, car, maybe demanding.

These properties are money pits though. They take a huge amount to maintain.

The observation that people with money have no worries is obviously crazy. There are plenty of other things to worry about. Most obviously, ill health, bereavement, your kids' drug habit.

This thread has become similar to those 'all French people are effortlessly stylish' ones

I've met fabulously wealthy individuals, and sometimes you really wouldn't know. I can think of a couple who have a very very successful business. They live in a former farmhouse (nice but nothing grand), drive a car with a value of about 15k, and have their kids in local state schools. Maybe having money gives them a certain confidence, but you wouldn't guess fabulous wealth by their material possessions. They could live a lifestyle akin to the Beckham's but don't.

I can also think of people who give the air of wealth - designer clothes, expensive homes and cars, private education, but up to their eyeballs in debt. These people have lost it all by faking it.

I think there's a type of grooming which is difficult to achieve without money, and lots of the wealthiest people I know tend to wear better quality fabrics. Plus there's an ease of appearance which comes with never having to take public transport - you can carry much less, and you don't need a super warm coat. It's something the costume department talked about when writing Succession - they never really need proper coats because it's helicopter - plane - taxi - apartment/townhouse/hotel/party.

I think it's very difficult to tell how wealthy anybody is because so many of the social cues and cultural signs we look for are normally a sign of people's upbringings and past as opposed to their current bank account or financial status.

The kind of confidence you allude to is normally a product of a private education and being brought up with privilege. I know plenty of people who act like this but aren't wealthy now because the money hasn't lasted or hasn't trickled down to them yet as adults. These people often have expensive taste and hobbies you would associate with wealthy individuals but they struggle to finance it in a way that truly wealthy people can.

Equally wealthy people from more modest backgrounds aren't necessarily interested in the things you would typically associate with the rich. They may not have the accent or the brand of confidence you describe.

There is also a third group of people that absolutely love the status symbols of wealth. In my experience, this group of people can be wealthy or indeed quite the opposite, but they will channel any money they have got into a fancy car (perhaps on finance) or jewellery (using the bulk of their pay cheque). They pump money and time into their appearance and perhaps exude a look that many people would associate with wealth. It's only when you get to know these people better that you can really tell if they are wealthy or not.

The richest person I know personally is probably worth several hundred million from a self made business, but if I met him out and about and didn't know him, I'd never guess. Wears "ordinary" clothes and drives an "ordinary" car.

Lives in a massive house in a gated community, mind. Probably for security reasons.

@RowanAlong

I think your point about giving off an air of disinterestedness in their surroundings and taking up space differently is a good one. Wealthy folk presumably never have to think about how to ‘be’, or act, or interact with others, in society. They presumably have the confidence that never having to worry about money, or what other people think of them, brings to day-to-day living.

Why would this family be worried about how to ‘be’ in society? They were in the garden centre. I don’t generally worry about how to behave in the garden centre either. I also generally don’t worry about how to take up space in the garden centre. I take up about 5 and a half feet worth of space. And my head generally sits just above my shoulders, attached by the neck.

@HeronLanyon

But havering that just means we know very different people. I know people living with their front windows full of the Heath in multi million houses and they certainly spend a lot of time in garden centres. These are ‘serving’ judges/barristers not yet retired for whom the garden is a de stress time. I myself live very central on a street with eg 9 mill pound houses and garden centres are definitely a thing. We’re all different.

I agree with this. My best friend from childhood parents live in one of those expensive houses in Hampstead and her family go to garden centres. They do have gardeners too but they’re not above shopping for plants! I suppose they’re probably not making day trips of it though 🤷🏼‍♀️ But they’re just normal people?

I live and grew up in Chelsea, a lot of wealth around here. Neighbours and friends go to garden centres.

I do think that wealthy people do have an air about them and I agree it’s confidence and not having to prove anything. I notice people who think they’re middle class mention how they shop at Waitrose and John Lewis, like they think that’s a marker of being “posh” and they’ve got a point to prove. It’s a bit try hard, if that makes sense. Someone wealthy will buy what they want because they like it and because they have the freedom to, not generally buying something because it’s the done thing? I’m not articulating myself well… but a friend at uni used to love saying how middle class she was, “ha I’m so middle class I’ve just bought my cutlery from John Lewis” she was buying them because they thought they made her middle class, not necessarily her preference, she said she wouldn’t buy a set from Sainsburys because you don’t buy cutlery from a supermarket 🤨 it was all very odd but it was like she was doing stuff to show her status. Wealthy people I know just buy what they like- they’re confident and aren’t worried if someone will judge them. I know people say genuinely rich people don’t have labels but in my experience that’s the not the case, plenty of Goyard and Chanel floating around the place!

@BehindTheFridge

If you are posh you don’t take your family to a garden centre

That's not true at all. I think you'd be surprised.

I really wouldn’t What would you need from a garden centre ?

@Gearedtoyou

If you are posh you don’t take your family to a garden centre

But if you're wealthy you do? That's why I think posh rather than wealthy. They may come from money but not actually be that wealthy themselves

No you have a gardener It is far to early to be getting a tree but if you did it would come from your grounds, tenant farmers or sent up from a friend in the country

A bag of compost?

@HeronLanyon

But havering that just means we know very different people. I know people living with their front windows full of the Heath in multi million houses and they certainly spend a lot of time in garden centres. These are ‘serving’ judges/barristers not yet retired for whom the garden is a de stress time. I myself live very central on a street with eg 9 mill pound houses and garden centres are definitely a thing. We’re all different.

I’m talking about Bishops Avenue types, but genteel old hipsters who live on the actual edge of the Heath.

NOT, not “but”.

@HaveringWavering again, the Bishops Avenue types are new money and mostly foreigners. They are not the kind of old money public school types most people here are talking about. I worked with someone who went to Eton and grew up in a stately home. He regularly showed up in hoodies with holes in and tatty jeans.

We're not talking about nouveau riche Russians who winter in Dubai.

@HaveringWavering

My dearly departed granny, who was titled, worked in a garden centre in her retirement

She was quite the sight in her MaxMara slacks and pearls. Granted it wasn’t the back of B&Q but the idea that posh people don’t go to garden centres is ridiculous

[quote megustalacerveza]@HaveringWavering again, the Bishops Avenue types are new money and mostly foreigners. They are not the kind of old money public school types most people here are talking about. I worked with someone who went to Eton and grew up in a stately home. He regularly showed up in hoodies with holes in and tatty jeans.[/quote]
I know! This has literally been my point from the beginning - the people OP is seeing and your wealthy friends who are garden-Centre-frequenters are almost certainly very rich. However, by virtue of the fact that they do anything at all themselves in relation to their gardens, they are self-defining as not really all that rich relative to people who are so obscenely wealthy that they would never have any need or interest in setting foot in a garden centre and probably would not know what one even was.

@megustalacerveza

We're not talking about nouveau riche Russians who winter in Dubai.

Says who? We can talk about any sort of Rich we like, can’t we?