To doubt parents who say baby crying for one minute is cruel

[LoathlyLady]

Just read a few posts about sleep and frankly don’t believe some of the responses. People saying that leaving a 12 month old to cry for very short periods (1-5 mins) is cruel and they could never do it.. really??

Ofcourse I find it horrible to listen to my 1yo son get upset but there are times when I simply can’t go to him immediately (car seat!) and recently we’ve found that letting him cry for 3 mins or so at bedtime rather than feeding to sleep seems to help with his overall sleep and mood. Are these people really saying that they never let their baby cry for more than a few seconds? Or is this just bullshit to make other mums feel terrible?

@nokidshere exactly! Plenty of babies cry as you are holding them, rocking them, etc. In fact, when they turned into toddlers and I found out some of the thi9mngs that made them cry, I realised why I couldn't always stop them crying as babies.

@nokidshere

Of course it's not cruel to leave a baby crying for a few minutes, neither is it being a martyr to pick them up every time they whimper. In reality most parents do a bit of both. And sometimes it doesn't even matter, you could be holding them, soothing them, feeding them and they will still cry.

I sincerely doubt that many people are leaving their distressed baby to cry because they just think 'it will teach them' and if it's got to the point of CC or CIO they are already sleep deprived and at the end of their tether. There is no right or wrong way, just what's right for you and your children at that point in time.

People seem to be confusing normal family behaviour with malicious intent

Being sleep deprived is part of being a parent. You are told constantly that it is before they are born. Babies don't sleep like adults do, they learn to. People try to fix them, routine them and sleep train them when there is nothing wrong with them. It is a fundamental lack of understanding of child development. I have been there and been at the end of my tether with PND and several small children but I signed up for the crying and sleep deprivation. It's a period of time that eventually passes. I say this as I sit here in silence because they all sleep through the night without ever having been left to cry.

People try to fix them, routine them and sleep train them when there is nothing wrong with them.

No they don't, they do it to try to get some sleep and peace because they have to work, or look after other children, or care for older parents, and can't function effectively at any of those things if their babies are crying or not sleeping. Being sleep deprived might be part of being a parent but that doesn't mean everyone can manage it.

And just because you were able to cope doesn't mean other people are able to.

I think the sleep advice on mumsnet is bonkers. Nothing wrong with leaving a baby for a set amount of time to cry. Sleep is so important. I'm sure people do think it's cruel to let them to cry. I've had two friends tell me that it is 'child abuse' to not co-sleep. People are crazy.

I have never understood why a child and mum being massively sleep deprived is considered a better way to treat a young child.

@julieca

I have never understood why a child and mum being massively sleep deprived is considered a better way to treat a young child.

My thoughts exactly. I very small amount of crying so they can learn that this is night and this is when we sleep. Then years of 7pm bedtimes where they happily snuggle into the mattress and drop off for 12hrs.......

I wouldn't leave mine to cry. It just doesnf ait right.
I think there's a huge difference from not being able go remove a child in a moving car to leaving a child to cry in bed.

There seems to be a strange obsession with getting babies to self soothe, when in reality as adults we don't lay down and immediately go to sleep. We may cuddle a partner, we may like to listen to something, have our blankets blankets a particular way of watch some TV. But wr expect our babies to go to bed in a bard cot without anyone to hold them. When baby cries in the night they're saying 'I need you' they might be uncomfortable, lonely and in need of comfort or just struggling to sleep. When we ignore their cries eventually they'll bd quiet, but not because they've self soothed, it's because they know nobody is coming.

Really depends though doesn't it?
Watching them cry while you flick Vs at them is probably going to be considered cruel. Leaving them to cry while you go for a shit, less likely.

You can't always drop everything the second a baby cries.

Babies cry. Like my lovely mil used to say "they cry tears not blood".

Assessing whether it is cruel is about why you left them crying not that you left them crying.

YABU. If you are feeling terrible then reevaluate your own parenting decisions.

I have never left my DD to cry. The second she starts, she’s attended to. I want her to know her needs will always be met and not that I will leave her distressed because it’s more convenient for me.

(She’s nearly 1, btw.)

@julieca

I have never understood why a child and mum being massively sleep deprived is considered a better way to treat a young child.

I and DD would be more sleep deprived if she was in a cot waking every hour, than when she's beside me in my bed.

@EverdeRose

I wouldn't leave mine to cry. It just doesnf ait right. I think there's a huge difference from not being able go remove a child in a moving car to leaving a child to cry in bed.

There seems to be a strange obsession with getting babies to self soothe, when in reality as adults we don't lay down and immediately go to sleep. We may cuddle a partner, we may like to listen to something, have our blankets blankets a particular way of watch some TV. But wr expect our babies to go to bed in a bard cot without anyone to hold them. When baby cries in the night they're saying 'I need you' they might be uncomfortable, lonely and in need of comfort or just struggling to sleep. When we ignore their cries eventually they'll bd quiet, but not because they've self soothed, it's because they know nobody is coming.

Sorry but the “babies stop crying because they know nobody is coming” is just utter crap. The study that came from was a Romanian orphanage where the babies there were under prolonged neglect. Comparing that to a baby which has had months and months of love and attention who is left to cry for up to 5/10 mins at a time is really offensive. You cannot undo the bond like that.

I think it's cruel. If you can avoid leaving your child to cry, why on earth would you leave them to cry? I can't bear my children being distressed especially at night.

And I have four kids.

I do think sleep training is cruel, but there’s a difference between a minute or two of crying and letting them scream themselves to sleep. Sometimes my son fusses a bit in the night, but I don’t run upstairs straight away, I wait for a minute to see if he’s gonna go back to sleep.

What I learned from my babies was that here were different types of crying. I feel that I got to understand them really well.

A sort of grumbly, moany one maybe if they were dozing off or were tired ( no need to rush ) as opposed to the flat out choking distressed when you'd be there in a second. There were a few in between. This was important.

I hated hearing any baby cry tbh but there were times when I was more relaxed than others which was lucky as I had 4 in all and you just can't jump to it as time goes on . I learned that from my friend with twins who simply didn't have enough arms.

In my nieces's house there was only one rule " baby niece spritzing" does not cry. End of. Well that family were getting up at 4 am for years. ( They had more kids and the pattern had been set ) They were sleep deprived for years and there was lots of fuss and bother about stuff.

However all the kids from both families seem to have turned out well.

We didn’t leave our kids to cry if it was avoidable. So they were never left to cry themselves to sleep if we were at home or somewhere we could hold them. But obviously if they were crying whilst in the car or something like that, it wasn’t always possible to get to them safely so they would have to wait until we could pull over or got to our destination if it was only a few minutes.
I wouldn’t do controlled crying, it makes me uncomfortable. I think cruel might be too strong, parents are usually doing it as they’re desperate for their kids to sleep and soothe themselves as the parents are shattered. It’s not done for cruel intentions in normal loving families but I still couldn’t do it.

@EverdeRose

I wouldn't leave mine to cry. It just doesnf ait right. I think there's a huge difference from not being able go remove a child in a moving car to leaving a child to cry in bed.

There seems to be a strange obsession with getting babies to self soothe, when in reality as adults we don't lay down and immediately go to sleep. We may cuddle a partner, we may like to listen to something, have our blankets blankets a particular way of watch some TV. But wr expect our babies to go to bed in a bard cot without anyone to hold them. When baby cries in the night they're saying 'I need you' they might be uncomfortable, lonely and in need of comfort or just struggling to sleep. When we ignore their cries eventually they'll bd quiet, but not because they've self soothed, it's because they know nobody is coming.

I do lay down and immediately go to sleep. A lot of adults still seem to struggle with sleeping. I literally get into bed and within one minute I am asleep. And I know other people who are the same. It is a valuable skill to have.

@EishetChayil I said nothing about co sleeping. Do what works for you. I am glad you and your child get lots of sleep.
But I do think some parents methods simply leave a young child and mum both massively sleep deprived and it shows in both their behaviour. It makes no one happy.

I do lay down and immediately go to sleep.
A lot of adults still seem to struggle with sleeping. I literally get into bed and within one minute I am asleep. And I know other people who are the same. It is a valuable skill to have

Nothing to do with sleep training…I was apparently a terrible sleeper, and would wake up every hour until 2 and then several times a night until 5. Yet now in my 30s I easily go straight to sleep.

@BabyRace

I don't think the intention is to make other mums feel bad, but rather to make themselves feel better. My baby doesn't cry for long so I must be doing a good job sort of thing. You find what works for your babybut frankly anyone that could stop DD crying in under a minute when she was newborn would be a bloody miracle worker

I think my motivation isn't exactly this either (and it's certainly not to shame other parents) - I think my motivation in giving my opinion that, say, sleep training is cruel, is that I hope it will make the parents rethink and therefore spare the child the distress and damage.

I didn't mention sleep training at all. My mum didn't do what gets called sleep training on here.
People though do need to learn how to sleep, and not all adults do. I know a number of people who say they have insomnia and have always struggled to get to sleep.
I think learning to sleep is a developmental milestone. Some reach it naturally, others need more help to achieve it. But our society doesn't seem to recognise this at all and either thinks it will happen naturally for all, or think everyone has trouble sleeping.

@Isabellabasil I hate the one method fits all. All babies and parents are different. I think sleep training is better than a totally sleep deprived mother and child. Babies and toddlers who are sleep deprived are not happy. You are doing them no favours by not helping them to get enough sleep.

@julieca maybe it depends on the baby too - my babies don't just cry, they scream, vomit and flail around in the cot. I live in a terrace and it would literally keep the neighbours awake!

I personally went down the cosleeping, feed on demand route. My eldest transferred from this to his own bed and started sleeping through when he was around 16 months. My littlest is still in with me, he's just over a year so I plan to try the same.

If this hadn't worked for me, who knows maybe I would have ended up trying sleep training, I can't comment because I never felt the need to.

@Isabellabasil yes I agree it totally depends on the baby.
Babies arent robots, but humans with different personalities. We all have to find the best way with our own children.

We didn’t leave our kids to cry if it was avoidable.

But what different people think is avoidable varies. For us, car journeys were largely avoidable but if you're in a rural area, they probably aren't.

I suspect our kids cried less in total for the 3 nights it took us to sleep train them than some kids cry in the car but it's sleep training that gets the guilt trips