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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to loathe the people here?

735 replies

OnenessWithAllStrife · 30/11/2021 10:06

Some people say that feeling a negative emotion or having unpleasant feelings about something shouldn't define you, that you should let the thoughts flow and then let them go. OK. I hope this to be true :(

But i have lived somewhere for the past 6 years that has brought me to conclusions and created feelings in me that I am not proud of. For the first time in my life I have actually come to loathe people and feel a sense of terror about being stuck with them. This is not particularly politically 'correct' when put into words, unfortunately, but I can't think of any other way to express it.

I moved to a town6 yrs ago in which I don't have much in common with the residents. It isn't unusual, just an ordinary large town which at one time contained more diversity, but in recent years has become very insular and homogenous. Everyone is angry, anti social, or depressed. If you don't openly discuss some sort of prejudice (racism, sexism, anti-intellectualism) you're 'soft in the head' or a 'bloody weirdo'.
Wherever I go here, in any direction, you will either see kids or drunk adults destroying property, or else screaming at each other in the street. There are a few select areas that are less challenging and rough, but the vibe is somehow the same.

Education or reading is a mugs game, football is the only passion, kids are yelled at for merely existing. Any conversation with a seemingly friendly stranger results in them wishing all the foreigners to go home. There is a general air of brutality to everything, a leathery, hard resistance to any kind of sensitivity whatsoever. Art, creativity and self reflection are suspicious, and the only permissible clothing is black or sport branded. Every damned street is choked with the fumes of endlessly revved up vehicles with ear splitting exhaust modifications. The environment is filthy, full of dog shit and bordering on dereliction.

I would once have considered all of this a problem of poverty, but it isn't quite that easy to determine, having witnessed it. There is no seeming variation in behaviour across income brackets here, it looks to be more cultural than income related, although the attitude towards learning, etc will obviously have the effect of creating more poverty regardless. It is like a self perpetuating cesspit of no hope and hard hearts. I thought i was a leftie, a socialist, but when I leave here I will be fucking marked by this and hope to never exist within it ever again.

We moved here for DP's work and are set to leave this coming year. I also appreciate that the residents and I have experienced very different upbringings and we do not share much in common, but even so, I think that you have to endure this to really, really see it, to come to fear it. It is easy to sit in a comfy armchair miles from it and 'defend' this stuff because you haven't truly sampled the existential sickness of it on your own doorstep.
I wish i didn't feel it, but it is difficult to lie to oneself, and the fear has probably evolved from having felt 'stuck' in it for so long. I wfh and DP does part time (some here regard us as 'pretentious' for this and have suggested we ought to do some 'real' work). It all feels very dated and odd, to be surrounded by values that repulse me and contain so little diversity. I mean, this is the type of place where you'll get side-eyed for cooking from scratch or having the audacity to flavour a dish with pesto.

Does this mean I loathe them? I don't know. I imagine I will chill with it when we have moved, as it all becomes a distant memory, but it has certainly left a mark. It feels wrong to state these feelings and observations, but I bet I am not the only one who has thought them....

OP posts:
lazylinguist · 30/11/2021 13:25

It's weird how defensive so many people get when someone says they don't want to live in a depressing shithole full of racists.

Indeed. Well summed up! Nobody actually wants to live somewhere like that, but apparently it's not ok to say so.

Sn0tnose · 30/11/2021 13:25

Oh dear. It must have been a bit of a culture shock for you, coming from a nice middle class area. Did you tell them that you were left wing? Perhaps they didn’t realise? 🙄

there isnt a community. it isnt the cotswolds love. There will be a community. It won’t be inviting poets to give talks in the local hall or organising litter picking teams but it will definitely be there. You’re just too different to either see it, appreciate it or be a part of it. No fault of yours, no fault of theirs. You are the very definition of a square peg in a round hole.

The best advice I can give you is keep your head down, try not to let everyone see how much contempt you have for them and move as quickly as you can, for everyone’s sake.

Nowomenaroundeh · 30/11/2021 13:26

@TopCatsTopHat

The town I'm in now is diverese socio-economically as well as racially and it is all the better as no one single group dictates the flavour of the place. A mix is always better for a real community because we all get to see how the other lives then, it makes for better appreciation.
I hadn't realised before but you are absolutely right.
Phoebesgift · 30/11/2021 13:27

Is it Stockton on Tees?

BalladOfBarryAndFreda · 30/11/2021 13:29

@Phoebesgift

Is it Stockton on Tees?
No, it’s Wigan. The OP has mentioned it
DappledThings · 30/11/2021 13:30

@Phoebesgift

Is it Stockton on Tees?
No. It's Wigan. As has been mentioned several times. What's the point of guessing if you can't be arsed taking 2 seconds to at least read OP's posts?
Tilltheend99 · 30/11/2021 13:31

@MooseBreath whenever I go through Coventry on the National Express I think it looks really nice and that I shall have to visit properly one day!

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:31

@Sn0tnose

Oh dear. It must have been a bit of a culture shock for you, coming from a nice middle class area. Did you tell them that you were left wing? Perhaps they didn’t realise? 🙄

there isnt a community. it isnt the cotswolds love. There will be a community. It won’t be inviting poets to give talks in the local hall or organising litter picking teams but it will definitely be there. You’re just too different to either see it, appreciate it or be a part of it. No fault of yours, no fault of theirs. You are the very definition of a square peg in a round hole.

The best advice I can give you is keep your head down, try not to let everyone see how much contempt you have for them and move as quickly as you can, for everyone’s sake.

Do enlighten us what this wonderful cultural community of Wigan are in fact doing?!
Fluffymule · 30/11/2021 13:33

@sashagabadon

Isn’t Lisa Nandy the local MP? She’s pretty high profile and you would think would have more influence to get improvements / Lobby for jobs, industry etc to come and provide employment like for example Andy Burnham and Andy street and that other Tory councillor of Teeside. She was shadow foreign secretary so a position of power and influence you would think?
Wigan has been a Labour safe seat and has returned a Labour MP since 1918.

The Wigan population has also consistently voted to keep the local Council a Labour led and run authority since 1973.

So the OPs comments about these people she hates being right wing Tory loving bigots are a bit skewed.

They may be racist bigots and everything else she claims, but they aren't Tories.

inferiorCatSlave · 30/11/2021 13:34

It’s what happens when you remove industry from an area

I think it has to be more complex than that . IL area lost mining and textiles - where I grew up a massive car/manufacturing industry - they had really very hard times but have managed to move on in many ways.

Town we lived in was less prosperous than rest of county despite relatively good transport links - seemed to help people leave rather than raise wages - it did suffer with north south county divide and less poltical interest and wider investment I think.

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:40

They may be racist bigots and everything else she claims, but they aren't Tories.

Ah that's ok then. It must be so much fun to live in close proximity to racist, sexist, violent, pyromaniac druggies, and seething bitter anti-intellectuals, as long as they don't vote Tory. I'd hazard a guess that they voted for Brexit though, so I have little sympathy anymore for their predicament.

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:44

Just looked it up: 64% voted for Brexit.

You reap what you sow.

crackofdoom · 30/11/2021 13:45

Funny I feel livid that my fav cities have been destroyed by the ideas of the liberal left. Why do they take over beautiful places and run these places down? Los Angeles, San Francisco, Barcelona…

Exactly how old are you that you remember San Francisco before the Beat Generation and Barcelona before the Spanish Civil War ?? 🙄

Westerman · 30/11/2021 13:45

The OP comes across as a condescending, raging snob.

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:46

@Westerman

The OP comes across as a condescending, raging snob.
You go and live nextdoor to the drug farm then, and spend your evenings wondering if your windows will be smashed.
Bumpsadaisie · 30/11/2021 13:46

@lazylinguist

If you can't see anything AT ALL positive in your community OP then respectfully I suggest that the problem is with you.

If you have a need to see ugliness then that is what you will see.

Sorry, but what a load of trite nonsense! You see what is there in front of you. And if what you see is loads of anti-social behaviour, crime, violence, racism and sexism, then no amount of imagining a hypothetical child writing their Christmas list is going to help. Why would the OP be creating this out of a 'need to see ugliness'? Are you suggesting that she'd see the same things if she went to live in a lovely, friendly, affluent place?

Not trite at all.

What we see, what we experience, are all totally determined by our own minds and psychological make-up. You can only ever look at the world through your own particular lens.

Sometimes that view through our lenses is close to the reality of course.

But when someone has such a black and white view and nothing good whatever to say about the many individuals in her town, complex people just like you and me, good and bad just like you and me, you know that the gap between her lenses and reality is significant.

Do you really expect me to believe that nothing good ever happens in the OPs street? That there is never love not joy?

That leads to the question why is she doing that? There must be some psychological purpose to it, a need to see the world through that lens. I don't doubt that the OP is giving an authentic account of her honest experience. Doesn't mean it's necessarily the reality.

FurrFeather · 30/11/2021 13:48

You can speak “your truth” OP, as long as nobody disagrees with you! The law according to Oprah!

I’m sure many of us have lived in places we disliked - England is full of them. Why did D H Lawrence go to Mexico? Clarkson in France? Johnny Lydon in the US? I’m living in such a place now, in the South of England, complete with its big quota of grumpy bolshy chavs and scary dogs. But there are good people around too, at least one hopes. Maybe you and other posters here are even some of them! I think being at home or WFH makes it worse as you’re not mixing more widely perhaps? Anyway, personally I’d rather live in a big field in the middle of nowhere. I hope you move somewhere that makes you feel more at home. Be glad that you have those choices, unfortunately lots of us haven’t.

FreshFreesias · 30/11/2021 13:48

Perhaps you just dislike working class people OP?

Cordyceps · 30/11/2021 13:49

@ThousandsOfTulips no she definitely said people give her the side-eye for eating pesto. I can only assume she dines al-fresco in the front garden every evening because I can't understand how they'd know, otherwise.

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:49

It sounds like the OP really tried to find the good in the place but was met with high crime rates, aggression, vandalism, racial abuse, general unfriendliness and lots of dog shit.

Bit hard to see the positives in that situation.

How would she know if there is "love" behind the closed doors of the bigots who refused to let her integrate into the community, call her "posh" and make her feel unwelcome at best, threatened at worst?

Some of these comments are utterly ridiculous.

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:51

[quote Cordyceps]@ThousandsOfTulips no she definitely said people give her the side-eye for eating pesto. I can only assume she dines al-fresco in the front garden every evening because I can't understand how they'd know, otherwise.[/quote]
Perhaps they saw her buying it in a shop? I presume even in Wigan supermarkets stock it.

Cordyceps · 30/11/2021 13:51

@crackofdoom

Funny I feel livid that my fav cities have been destroyed by the ideas of the liberal left. Why do they take over beautiful places and run these places down? Los Angeles, San Francisco, Barcelona…

Exactly how old are you that you remember San Francisco before the Beat Generation and Barcelona before the Spanish Civil War ?? 🙄

I can't speak to Barcelona or even LA, but San Francisco was destroyed starting in the 90s by neo-lib technocrats, not by the Beat Generation. There is a difference between radicals and liberals. A little overlap sometimes, but very very different overall.
singingsoprano · 30/11/2021 13:52

@OnenessWithAllStrife

I would love to hear how to fix this, not feel it! If any of you have experienced this and managed to come to love it like a fucking zen master, i would welcome your helpful advice!

can people honestly say they would like it in a place like this and think themselves ignorant for noticing the rot?

We moved from 2 huge cities, then to a small city in the south, they were lovely. then we moved to a small town near the Humber, very similar in lacking 'aspirations'. We lasted 2 years as we were never going to fit in as was made quite clear to us! Leave ASAP, you will be so much happier!
ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:53

[quote Cordyceps]@ThousandsOfTulips no she definitely said people give her the side-eye for eating pesto. I can only assume she dines al-fresco in the front garden every evening because I can't understand how they'd know, otherwise.[/quote]
If the main issue you've taken from the thread was about pesto - which was clearly tongue in cheek, especially as the OP then referred back to it joking that nobody would know she sometimes makes her own (perhaps because of the stigma attached to buying such a product in a Wigan supermarket 😂) - then you have missed the point of the thread entirely.

whatstobecomeofus · 30/11/2021 13:54

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there's a lot to be said for being able to walk down the street without getting missiles lobbed at you.