We can't mention positives of Breastfeeding for fear of offending

[Silverclasp]

Recently there was an interesting thread about a husband not wanting his wife to Breastfeed (he wanted to give formula) posters were highlighting the positives of Breastfeeding (since this was the topic) but there was a response essentially saying that by pointing out the benefits that we are shaming non bf mothers.
It got me thinking that I actively don't speak about bf for this very reason, I feel like if the person I'm talking to doesn't bf it can be seen as "shaming" like I never post anything pro Breastfeeding on SM in case I offend someone. It's kind of ridiculous.
Interested in both sides of the argument.

So say I reposted an article on SM which stated that studies have indicated that breastfed babies have a larger thymus gland than formula fed babies and more tcells as a result. Would this be unreasonable and cause offence to non bf mothers?

Any positivity is labelled as shaming, or boasting

Bit of a blanket statement. I've seen posts that are both positive and supportive. There's a way to explain a positive experience knowing not everyone has one though.

@Chichichiwawa you don't agree with science?

I think you'd have to be pretty dim to not know that the milk produced by a mammal is normally the best food for that mammals offspring. Kittens - cat milk. Puppies - dog milk. Babies - human milk.

Acknowledging that fact is not a criticism. It's not an attack on anyone. It's simply a fact

And it's also a fact that formula is perfectly fine. Better in some cases if for example the mother is taking medication that makes her milk unsuitable.

If she can't or doesn't want to breastfeed for whatever reason, we are so lucky to be able to have a good substitute. Formula gets the job done which is what matters. Baby gets fed. Mum is happy. All is good.

Puppies get adopted by cats and drink cat milk. Kittens get adopted by dogs and drink dog milk. Hell, I saw a YouTube video of a cat raising ducklings and they were latched on good and proper.

People need to stop feeling defensive or guilty about something there is no need to feel either of those things about.

[quote Silverclasp]@Tabbacus

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4556682/[/quote]
That article does not support the statement made by a previous poster that the nipple analyses the baby's saliva and adapts the milk accordingly. It says that breast mink and baby saliva interact in synergistic ways. Which is fascinating, but not the same thing.

@Throckmorton

You are just being pedantic. What the previous poster said was pretty accurate in layman's terms. Babies saliva goes back through the nipple and is essentially analysed by the woman's body and if virus etc are detected breastmilk is changed accordingly. It's amazing.

There's a way to explain a positive experience knowing not everyone has one though.

How should one do it? with a caveat after the positive experience?

@lawnotorder

There's a way to explain a positive experience knowing not everyone has one though.

How should one do it? with a caveat after the positive experience?

I had two very unremarkable births. If pregnant friends ask me about my experience I tell them but I point out how lucky I was.

If they asked about my horrendous BF experience I would tell them all about it but probably also say that they should give it a go because you never know until you try and some people find it very easy.

you don't agree with science

Oh yes. That's what i said. I said I don't think breastfeeding is important. Nutritionally it's better of course. On a national scale, there are slight population level differences between formula feeding and breastfeeding. But i bet you can't pick out the bottle fed babies from the breastfed babies in a class of 7 year olds, or 15 year olds.

In my opinion, breastfeeding is not as important as other little things, like maternal mental health. There is immense pressure to breastfeed, and when a woman can't or doesn't want to do it then she's hit with all these "breast is best, you're failing your child" messages. What's that going to do to her mental health? The pressure is being put on by other women as well. But those women are dismissed as not trying hard enough, in a system that's designed for them to fail unless theyre privileged enough to pay for help. Like you did.

Like i said, if you think there's a problem with breastfeeding rates, then lecturing individuals will do nothing to change that. If you don't want to be a peer supporter, why not start lobbying the government to improve post natal care. That would be a good place to start.

I'm not being pedantic - that article does not say that. It may well happen, but that article doesn't say it. If you're going to post science, don't call it pedantry if people expect you to post the science that supports what you say

@Sparklingbrook I had eventful births & awful pregnancies but I still feel lucky & the outcome was positive as I'm here & so are my amazing dc. I don't see what happened as negatives, it's just one of those things & I had no control over any of it. I don't feel offended or resentful if someone says they loved pregnancy & had a calm water birth which I would have liked.

[quote Silverclasp]@Frezia this is exactly it. Even if a newspaper shares a study showing breastfeeding in a positive light the comment section is just full of "stop shaming mums" "fed is best" etc.
It literally cannot be mentioned without backlash.[/quote]
I'm not being funny but you never EVER see formula feeding spoken about unless it's compared to breastfeeding to say breastfeeding is more beneficial for the baby etc. So why does there need to be focus on breastfeeding if there isn't on formula feeding?

I can see why there's comments saying 'stop shaming mums' etc because there's a lot of research around breastfeeding. If people want to do research then it's easily accessible. Having one form of feeding shoved in your face (I use that term lightly) isn't great especially as so many women can't breastfeed but may want too.

I had a traumatic birth, was in hospital for a week and had 3 surgeries. I was unable to breastfeed because I had a spinal puncture and couldn't bend my neck. Do you know how upsetting it was to go into the common room (when I could finally walk) and see ALL the posters about breastfeeding. It's so disheartening to people who aren't able too.

In regards to the post on social media, by all means share that with your friends that you know are interested/are breastfeeding. But if I saw that posted on SM I'd just think what's your reasoning behind it. Especially how no one ever shares anything regarding formula feeding.

It's already such a touchy subject and so many women are judged for not breastfeeding, surely you can see why people react in such a way

I have a facebook filter for mums who have breastfed so I can share those links without upsetting anyone.

I didn’t want to breastfeed, so I didn’t. No amount of ‘support’ would have changed that. None. Nada.

And I have experienced that the breastfeeding mothers who typically came from a middle-class socioeconomic background do think they’re superior for having done it.

[quote lawnotorder]@Sparklingbrook I had eventful births & awful pregnancies but I still feel lucky & the outcome was positive as I'm here & so are my amazing dc. I don't see what happened as negatives, it's just one of those things & I had no control over any of it. I don't feel offended or resentful if someone says they loved pregnancy & had a calm water birth which I would have liked.

[/quote]
I felt offended and resentful when a friend said she didn’t understand any of the difficulties I was having with BF.
Because she found it ‘very easy’ apparently.

That said I don’t care now but at the time when everything is raw and difficult it’s possible to take anything people say to heart.

I also only know one person who found bf easy from the off. It wasn't easy for me at all but I was lucky that family & friends were honest so I knew what to expect.

Breastfeeding rates are higher in developing countries than the developed. You don't need an expensive or elaborate healthcare support system to improve them. But you do need a culture with a positive attitude towards breastfeeding and a community you can draw knowledge and support from. All the educated midwives and accessible lactation consultants and amazing maternity/paternity benefits cannot replace that.

Breastfeeding was really difficult for me, but after a difficult pregnancy I really wanted to do it. Especially after people kept telling me to quit. So I'm proud of it as an achievement I had. But I felt super uncomfortable saying I was proud of myself, because people would then accuse me of shaming people who couldn't breastfeed. Or who decided to stop when I didn't. Which is not true. It feels like, especially as a woman, you aren't allowed to be proud of your own achievements/ to see something as a personal achievement without being told you should consider the feelings of everybody else and their brother!

@Throckmorton
Here is an article with the scientist explaining the study if you are interested.

www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/11/181108105942.htm

The pressure to breastfeed 100% of the time is causing so many women to breakdown and quit entirely. And the whole ‘breast is best’ brigade is responsible for so making so many women feel like shit. Women’s mental and physical health still matters once they become a mum and I’ve listened to enough of my friends cry over this, thanks.

This is it for me!
Breastfeeding has been scientifically proved to benefit the baby more in comparison to formula. That's honestly great. But the shame and judgement that comes with not breastfeeding your child is really the issue for me.

The amount of times a stranger has asked why I'm not breastfeeding is actually so ridiculous. Like I've had three surgeries and nearly died, my medication means I can't breastfeed. But even if I simply didn't want too, that should be enough reason in itself.

I personally don't like how so many women think they're better than others because they've breastfed. Like honestly great for you hun but it's not a competition

I understand the paper thanks. It's fascinating but doesn't say anything about the nipple sensing anything. Are you sure you understand it?

I felt offended and resentful when a friend said she didn’t understand any of the difficulties I was having with BF. Because she found it ‘very easy’ apparently.

I think thats different though as she is ignoring your experience as opposed to just talking about her own. I'd be annoyed with a friend who did that with any experience in life!

@Throckmorton

I never said the nipple sensed anything.

I find stuff like this really interesting and in no way offensive, I'd be more interested in a current article though. I follow a few science news pages and I'd think it was a bit odd if they shared an article from decades ago.

On MN though, I find it's opposite - you can't mention any negative of bf, even though the existence of some doesn't take away from the positives or mean you shouldn't do it. Literally every choice in life has pros and cons but we have to pretend bf is the one thing that doesn't.

I personally don't like how so many women think they're better than others because they've breastfed.

Is that to do with bf though or are they just dicks in general? In the same way some people think they are better because they earn more money or drive a nice car.

[quote Silverclasp]@Throckmorton

I never said the nipple sensed anything.[/quote]
Quoting you OP: "Babies saliva goes back through the nipple and is essentially analysed by the woman's body and if virus etc are detected breastmilk is changed accordingly. It's amazing."

The paper, to be clear, supports the fact breastfeeding has beneficial effects on the baby's innate immune system and microbiota. It says nothing whatsoever about nipples, viruses or changes in breastmilk.