We can't mention positives of Breastfeeding for fear of offending

[Silverclasp]

Recently there was an interesting thread about a husband not wanting his wife to Breastfeed (he wanted to give formula) posters were highlighting the positives of Breastfeeding (since this was the topic) but there was a response essentially saying that by pointing out the benefits that we are shaming non bf mothers.
It got me thinking that I actively don't speak about bf for this very reason, I feel like if the person I'm talking to doesn't bf it can be seen as "shaming" like I never post anything pro Breastfeeding on SM in case I offend someone. It's kind of ridiculous.
Interested in both sides of the argument.

So say I reposted an article on SM which stated that studies have indicated that breastfed babies have a larger thymus gland than formula fed babies and more tcells as a result. Would this be unreasonable and cause offence to non bf mothers?

To be fair, that is a hell of a lot of bras! I’m not sure I’ve bought that many bras over a lifetime!

@RidingMyBike I think we are saying the same thing really. Breastfeeding support shouldn’t be there if you can afford it.

I could have bought cheaper nursing bras but they'd have been ill fitting and I already felt absolutely awful about my body that fugly unsupportive nursing bras didn't help!

I had my baby in an area with lots of support - there was an infant feeding team at the hospital with an IBCLC, I stayed in hospital for 3 days after the birth and got loads of BFing support - I got the latch and positioning checked several times just to be sure. Several IBCLCS went to the weekly BfIng support at the local children's centres (this cost £1 but I also had to pay to park near it). The IBCLC cut my baby's TT at the hospital on day 3. They were incredibly anti-formula on postnatal and didn't provide any support for mums on postnatal who'd chosen to FF.

None of that prevented my baby becoming seriously ill with dehydration and ending up being readmitted. She had to be tube fed formula to save her life.

@Magicalwoodlands

To be fair, that is a hell of a lot of bras! I’m not sure I’ve bought that many bras over a lifetime!

@RidingMyBike I think we are saying the same thing really. Breastfeeding support shouldn’t be there if you can afford it.

Like I say, I wouldn't buy anywhere near that in a normal year but breastfeeding made it necessary - I had massive oversupply which didn't settle and gone off breastmilk is a foul smell!

@DingleyDel

I assumed £1000 was a typo and they meant £100. I can understand the cost racking up if you’re paying lacto consultants and tt practitioners (which should be available on the nhs but I know the wait lists are ridiculous) but outside of that HOW?! I bought 2 nursing bras (£12 each) that were so supportive that I wore them for about 2 years after I stopped feeding, a couple of jojo nursing tops (but they are absolutely not necessary) and a pump that was about £70, and a few bottles. I would have had to buy new bras and tops anyway to fit my post birth body so don’t even count that as a specific b/f cost.

No, not a typo, that’s why I itemised everything £1000.

An IBLBC consult was £200 a pop, and how many breastfeeding issues are truly resolved in one hr-90 minute session? Any follow up, bam another £200 for another session. The woman spoke to me like dirt as well, we had an ‘older baby’ at 12 weeks that was still struggling. Then 2 tongue tie division another £500

So … what are you saying?

That formula is sometimes necessary? Agree.

That promoting breastfeeding is bad? Also agree to a point.

I don’t think even the most vocal advocates of breastfeeding would say formula is never necessary. What is being said is that all too often it is a first resort, not a last one.

I had mine in an area that only mentioned formula as 'unnecessary'. All the MWs, HVs and displays in children's centres were promoting BFing with no mention of formula at all or any negatives to BFing. (Baby Friendly level 3 area).

That set women up to fail and meant they couldn't make an informed choice about how to feed their babies. The hospital actually had a separate SCBU to take in the babies who had to be readmitted because of EBF - I was in there for four days with mine and overheard what was going on in the admitting cubicle - devastated women who'd all been told formula was 'unnecessary' now with a dehydrated baby or one with severe jaundice, most of whom ended up with babies having to be tube fed formula.

Not sure if this perspective has been covered but if I saw a post on Facebook about the positives of breastfeeding then it probably would have encouraged me to persevere when I was in the thick of it and struggling. I felt like giving up a few times in the early days as I found it hard.

People kept telling me to stop and it was my own fault they didn't sleep, I was a martyr, etc etc so positive stories and scientific info were helpful to me in terms of keeping on with it because I really did want to do it.

Everyone's reception to this kind of info will be unique to their personal experience I think.

@Yoyomelon Actually there is. (White) British women are generally of Anglo Saxon descent and Croation women are south Slavic. There are genetic differences, plus differences in lifestyle and diet. Maybe these differences affect breast milk supply, maybe not. There are actually very few global studies that have looked at how genetics and lifestyle can influence supply. It's still unknown exactly what causes low supply, there are only guesses. It's a hugely under researched area and a large % of those involved in the breastfeeding support world don't even want to acknowledge it exists.

@WorraLiberty

To be honest if you posted that, I'd wonder why you bothered?

The majority of people really don't give a shit how others feed their kids. Only a small amount of people tend to get offended by these things IME, and they're generally easy to offend anyway.

But no-one likes a preacher, especially on social media. It's just boring.

I didn't breastfeed, I was judged. Honestly when your kids are teenagers and adults no one remembers. Do what you want when you want. Just don't tell others they are wrong and get on with your own life.

Also, breastfeeding is only "free" if we don't place any value on women's time, effort and mental health. The £50 per month I spent on formula was well worth it for the peace of mind that my baby was getting enough to eat (I posted further down about difficulties with supply) and for the improvement in my mental health.
As for the dramatics of "formula companies don't care about babies and women's health", don't be ridiculous. Formula is one of the most strictly regulated products out there, to ensure it's a nutritionally complete food for babies. There are very strict laws about what ingredients can be used and in what proportion, and how it's advertised.
Yes, the companies make profit, obviously. So what, they're supplying a product that there's demand for and they aren't going to do that for no profit.
Breast pump companies, lactation consultants, supplement manufacturers etc also make a profit. In fact there's a whole cottage industry around breastfeeding that makes money out of selling hope (often false hope) to desperate women at the most vulnerable time of their life...women who've been guilt tripped by the "breast is best" messaging and are desperately trying to make BFing work at the expense of their mental health. But sure, breastfeeding is "free" and formula companies are evil

@AngelDelight28 in fairness Nestle are really evil.... even if you take the infant formula/dead babies scandal out of the equation they are still evil.

As for the dramatics of "formula companies don't care about babies and women's health

They most definitely don’t. Formula in this country is fairly well regulated but even so nothing like as regulated as people think. They can still make completely false claims on the tub. If you can be arsed, watch this lecture. Helen Crawley runs an impartial charity dedicated to infant nutrition.

Back in 2000 I used to buy Aptamil formula at a discounted rate from the GP surgery, on the advice of my Health Visitor.

Love the idea of having a ‘baby moon’ with a toddler!
When my second was born they wouldn’t let me go home until she was consuming a certain amount of milk, my milk hadn’t come in yet so that couldn’t happen through breast feeding alone, and once she was used to the bottles she didn’t what to spend time on my breast first.

@DingleyDel Lol, the Baby Friendly Initiative is literally an initiative to promote breastfeeding. So obviously they have an agenda to have a speaker like this.
False advertising claims can land companies in a lot of trouble with the Advertising Standards Authority, including hefty fines, so you can always report formula companies if you feel they've made false claims.
Its highly unlikely in this day and age, in the UK, though. The advertising of formula is now as strictly regulated as the likes of tobacco and alcohol. Even though it's not actually a harmful product.
I've found the false claims and old wives tales told to me by lactation "experts" and midwives far more damaging tbh. Lots and lots if "advice" out there that isn't evidence based.

I exclusively breastfed two babies for over a year (obviously they started eating solids, but they never had formula because they wouldn’t accept bottles). I tried very hard to pump with both of them and never ever got more than 1oz. I had a perfectly adequate milk supply but pumps had basically no effect.

I see time and time again on these threads women saying they couldn’t breastfeed because they had no milk, because they couldn’t get anything out with a pump. Of course some people do have no/low milk supply but it will be a much smaller proportion than those who thought they did, but just didn’t get on with pumping.

Before I had my first baby I thought you basically just hooked yourself up to a pump and it would all flow out, like a cow 🤣. I can imagine if I hadn’t had good support and confirmation that my baby was actually getting milk the tiny dribbles I was producing would have terrified me.

There is so little cultural knowledge/understanding about normal bf experiences these days and I think that’s a major barrier.

No pump is as effective at getting breast milk from breasts than a baby.

@AngelDelight28 the speaker is from First Steps Nutrition - they are independent, impartial and evidence-based. Whether the baby friendly initiative is impartial or not is irrelevant.

Watch the lecture and then comment. Helen Crawley and her charity provide extensive info. on formula (not the actions of someone who is anti formula). Formula companies are no ones friend.

False advertising claims can land companies in a lot of trouble with the Advertising Standards Authority

It would be nice if it did. Yet we still have formula here advertised with pre and probiotics, formula to ‘cure’ allergies. Yet..there is no evidence to back up these claims. The opposite in fact. So tell me more about how formula companies can’t possibly make false claims?

So tell me more about how formula companies can’t possibly make false claims?

Do you also get your knickers in a twist about all claims made on packaging? Or just infants’ food?

I mean I had a matcha tea for breakfast.. I’m expecting great things tomorrow, what was it the bumf said, 4 times the calories will be burnt yehaw.

Don’t make me laugh, people have been loose with the truth on packaging since packaging began. It’s not new and it’s not confined to formula.

Do you also get your knickers in a twist about all claims made on packaging? Or just infants’ food?

Generally just infants food. Because they need food to stay alive and be healthy. Infants have no voice so historically corporations haven’t given a shit what is best for them. No one died from not have 100% longer lashes, lots of infants have died from false formula marketing claims. And currently in the U.K. a lot of parents are struggling to meet the cost of formula (as cited in a gov. Report). This is a product that costs pennies to produce. When you pay £8 for a tub, you, the parent
are paying for their false advertising campaigns.

Of course human babies should drink human milk, it's full of antibodies, protects them and the mother against many illnesses. Is it easy? No. Do bf babies wake up a lot more? 100 percent.

Of course some mother's can't bf but it's a tiny minority. If the amount of mothers who say they can't bf really can't the human race would have died out years ago.
But you can't say this...

The formula lobby is so strong.