To think The Queen should retire?

[ThinWomansBrain]

I am not a monarchist - but given that we have a Royal Family....
Given her age, understandably failing health, and the recent widowhood, is it be reasonable to think the Queen should step down and retire gracefully?
OK, maybe stay in post until the Jubillee next year, but then hand over.

I just don't understand why so many people are going to be upset about a total stranger dying of old age

Don't be so disingenuous. She's our head of state and has been for nearly 70 years. She's not a random old woman. She has been a constant presence for most of our lives.

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g

I'm an atheist so have no truck with the anointed by God stuff but it's not the oddest way the monarchy has ended up passing to an unexpected person. I don't expect anybody thought Queen Victoria would ever ascend the throne, given that her father had two older brothers and both had many children (illegitimate, so couldn't succeed, but it's odd they didn't manage to produce any legitimate heirs). In any event, if Edward had been allowed to marry Mrs Simpson, they would almost certainly have had no children, so on his death he would have been succeeded directly by his niece, assuming his brother had still died in 1952.

I'm a Christian and I've no truck with it either!

yeah but that still means her coming to the throne was all part of god's great plan. Which apparently included a divorce that prevented her uncle from becoming head of the church

I’m atheist so don’t believe in gods plan or anything like that. However for those that do believe in gods plan, they believe everything is part of his plan so yes, the divorce would have been part of that. I imagine the phrase “he works in mysterious ways” covers that one for those that believe

yeah but it's absolute bollocks innit

@Comedycook

I just don't understand why so many people are going to be upset about a total stranger dying of old age

Don't be so disingenuous. She's our head of state and has been for nearly 70 years. She's not a random old woman. She has been a constant presence for most of our lives.

I'm not being disingenuous - I genuinely don't get it.

She might be head of state but she's still a random stranger. She's had no meaningful impact on your life whatsoever.

@KeflavikAirport

yeah but it's absolute bollocks innit

Well yes, but I would say that!

I did not like the outpouring for Diana - it felt like more tourism than anything else

The Queen - her first Prime Minister was Winston Churchill ( and not just from watching the Crown ) - she has seen much.

The point of an hereditary / constitutional monarchy is stability Technically the Queen can dictate things - in practice she does not.

But when we want to forge a relationship with other countries - she does her job. She won't only be there for 4 or 8 years & then replaced.

I rather like having a head of state different from Prime Minister.

What I am in favour of is slimming down the Royal family.

I hope she continues as did her mother. Charles and William have big shoes to fill ( well the Queen has little shoes - but hope the point is taken )

@Justheretoaskaquestion91

Lol at people who think no one will care when she dies. Look at the fucking mental reaction when Diana died?!

That was different. Diana’s death was tragic, unexpected and untimely. The queen’s death at 95 or older will be none of those things.

I rather like having a head of state different from Prime Minister.

Me too - Imagine if Boris was the best we could do - or Trump.

@Justheretoaskaquestion91

Lol at people who think no one will care when she dies. Look at the fucking mental reaction when Diana died?!

Hopefully people will be a bit more measured and less pathetic when the Queen croaks it.

I rather like having a head of state different from Prime Minister.

A hereditary monarchy is not the only way or IMO the best way to have that

It's not the only way, no, but a change now would be the most enormous upheaval and we'd end up with more politics instead of having a Head of State who stands outside party politics. I have no problem with living in a constitutional monarchy. Not sure why, but I suppose I like tradition and find history fascinating, and this is a direct continuation of a tradition going back over a millennium in the British Isles.

given Charles' track record of trying to influence government policy, he's not going to be neutral in the same way that his mother appears to be.

What, you mean he'd tell Boris he's a twat sort of non-neutrality?
Bring it on

@CounsellorTroi - Fair point - not sure what I would think the best alternative would be. ( French system ? )

Still think I do not want PM being head of state.

That was different. Diana’s death was tragic, unexpected and untimely. The queen’s death at 95 or older will be none of those things

Sure but she had been on the scene for 1/9 of the time the queen has and was a lot more divisive. I will be sad when the queen dies. I won’t cry but I will be sad - I have a lot of respect for her and she’s been the queen my entire life. I know it’s clearly not “cool” on MN to say that but people seem quite gleeful saying they don’t care and they don’t see why anyone would.

Ireland manage to have a non hereditary head of state who stands outside politics. Current one is Michael D Higgins.

Also, The Queen is not 'a stranger.' Not to many MANY people

But she is, you don’t know her, you know nothing about her other than what carefully arranged publicity allows you to know. You don’t know what she thinks or feels or wants. She IS a stranger.

@CallMeNutribullet

The Queen mother had a far more leisurely life after Elizabeth took over the reigns. The Queen's schedule is far too demanding for a woman in her 90s

Do you really think her role is demanding?

She has EVERYTHING done for her. She has a cook, cleaner, chauffeur, dresser, private doctors etc. She has wealth beyond anything we can imagine. Has a choice of homes to stay in.

I have a friend is a similar age. She is suffering as she can't get a hospital appointment. She lives on her own and cooks, does her own cleaning, washing etc! She has worked hard all her life. I'm sorry but the Queen has an easy life in comparison.

@backtolifebacktoreality

But she literally feels she has the weight of the world on her shoulders. Her job isn’t just smiling and shaking hands!

@CounsellorTroi

Ireland manage to have a non hereditary head of state who stands outside politics. Current one is Michael D Higgins.

While the role stands outside politics, he was a politician, are they always ex-politicians? I’m only asking out of curiosity really. How long has Ireland had this? My main issue isn’t with that as a system, I think it sounds good. It’s with how you get from what we have now, to that. Because if this government was in charge of it, while they might say it sits outside politics they’d probably write the laws around the system and the voting in such a way that you’d always end up with a Tory (or a mate of theirs who has donated enough). If the queen dies soon, I’d far rather have Charles than have Boris and co writing the details of a new system. Which isn’t to say I think the current system is fair, but when/if we switch from it, that system will probably be in place for a long time. And it shouldn’t be sorted by Johnson. It needs sensible, non-partisan discussion amongst politicians and the public. And right now I don’t think we’d get that.

Also, The Queen is not 'a stranger.' Not to many MANY people.

Of course she's a stranger. You only know what the Royal Family allow you to know - and that's a very very carefully edited public persona. You don't know a thing about what happens behind closed doors.

I'm sure the Queen is perfectly nice lady but let's be honest here - you don't know her from Adam. You have no idea what she's actually like - you just know that she has a nice public persona and is good at appearing smiley and diplomatic in front of the camera.

She's been around your whole life so she feels like a nice constant presence but she's still someone with a job to do and who benefits hugely from putting on a nice image for the rest of the world.

[quote Justheretoaskaquestion91]@backtolifebacktoreality

But she literally feels she has the weight of the world on her shoulders. Her job isn’t just smiling and shaking hands![/quote]
What major issues is she actually responsible for that people expect her to do something about? She doesn’t govern. Her job is pretty much smiling and shaking hands, reading speeches written by her staff and royal assenting legislation.

While the role stands outside politics, he was a politician, are they always ex-politicians? I’m only asking out of curiosity really.
How long has Ireland had this?
My main issue isn’t with that as a system, I think it sounds good. It’s with how you get from what we have now, to that. Because if this government was in charge of it, while they might say it sits outside politics they’d probably write the laws around the system and the voting in such a way that you’d always end up with a Tory (or a mate of theirs who has donated enough).
If the queen dies soon, I’d far rather have Charles than have Boris and co writing the details of a new system.
Which isn’t to say I think the current system is fair, but when/if we switch from it, that system will probably be in place for a long time. And it shouldn’t be sorted by Johnson. It needs sensible, non-partisan discussion amongst politicians and the public. And right now I don’t think we’d get that..

An act of Parliament agreed by all parties would be necessary. And a written constitution to ensure one political party cannot control the process.

Johnson and his cabinet are not of sufficient calibre or integrity to tackle a divisive issue like this, nor do they have any incentive to do it given the size of their majority, so I can't see any reason why this should become a big political issue for many years to come.

Who knows what may happen after a few years of King Charles III, or whatever he decides to be called.