AIBU to be fuming for DH leaving 11 yo dd alone

[Myotherface]

So I had planned to go and meet a friend for half a day. I do something like this 1-2 times a year so not exactly a lot. DH, his sister and mum decided to take the kids for a swim whilst I'd be away. Win win. Except that 11yo DD got unwell with temp and a cough. Covid pcr plus lateral flow negative so no problem with that but obviously not fit to go swimming. I offered to cancel my plans so rest of the kids could still go swimming with cousins. DH said I should be able to go as my plans had been made weeks ago unlike the last minute swimming plan. He said he'd sort it. So off I went.

I then came back 6 hours later to hear that DH, his mum and sister, 2 DS.s and their cousin had gone swimming and had left the 11 yo DD alone at grandparents house whilst they were out. Apparently she had felt much better once they got to grandparents house. She had asked to go swimming with the rest of them and when told no had suggested she'd stay behind on her own. She had said she'd felt bad that the rest of them were missing out because of her and told them she'd be fine. She said she had watched a film and only got scared once when the doorbell rang. She had hidden behind the sofa and had thought someone had come to kidnap her. She had been scared and tried calling granddad who had gone for a bike ride (bike ride more important than DD). Granddad didn't pick up but later texted to reassure her that the caller was a nice neighbour. She said after that she was fine again.

The swimming pool is an hour away. I was an hour and a half away. Granddad was miles away on his bike. Dd had only been left with mine and DH.s numbers. I was not told she was left alone. If something would have happened it would have taken us an hour to get back.

AIBU to be fuming?!!! DH is upset because I calmly stated that I wouldn't have gone to meet a friend had I known that poorly DD was going to be left alone. He thinks it's extremely hurtful for me to question his judgement around this. I can't believe I'm being made out to be the bad guy for saying I think he made a bad decision and I think leaving dd alone for the first time should have been a joint decision.

I dont think this is a big deal, leaving a secondary age child for a few hours. She sounds like she was ok with being left & the chat about worrying about kidnappers sounds like a bit of ott dramatics.

I'd be annoyed. I think being an hour away when she's not used to it is unfair.

She seems anxious about being left alone, or certainly her family being over an hour away.

YA both BU for the fact that an 11 yo is not used to being left alone but YANBU given that she is not used to being left and he has left her alone when ill.

Op speak to her about the kidnapping worry. When I was a child we had a lot of high profile kidnapping cases in quite quick succession and I was terrified of being kidnapped. Even now my dp and mum say I have an obsession with it.

I remember being about 11/12 and genuinely thinking it was a matter of if not when. I probably would have benefitted from some sort of councilling but I got it into my head that talking about it would somehow make it happen so my parents didn't know about my fears at the time.

@Bumblenums1234

Op speak to her about the kidnapping worry. When I was a child we had a lot of high profile kidnapping cases in quite quick succession and I was terrified of being kidnapped. Even now my dp and mum say I have an obsession with it.

I remember being about 11/12 and genuinely thinking it was a matter of if not when. I probably would have benefitted from some sort of councilling but I got it into my head that talking about it would somehow make it happen so my parents didn't know about my fears at the time.

**when not if. Sorry!

I think I’d be pissed if too. Not so much the leaving her alone but the circumstances of her being left alone, she was unwell, not in her own home and you weren’t aware of it. If it was my dd I’d have cancelled my plans like you were going to. If my DH had said no I will sort it I certainly wouldn’t expect the sorting to be leaving her alone. He should have told you so you could have decided if you wanted to cancel your plans or if you were comfortable leaving her alone. If you decided it was ok to leave her you would have at least had the opportunity to check up on her regularly.

Either
She’s confident and independent, has been left on her own while you go shopping. Was feeling better and told everyone to go swimming.
Or
She’s anxious, unable to sleep on her own. Is mistreated by her dad, left by grandad and was poorly.

I honestly feel like because people said 11 is ok, you now drip feed until you have everyone saying your dh is a terrible person.

@modgepodge

I don’t think leaving an 11 year old alone is bad, per se. However it doesn’t sound like she’s used to it (scared of kidnappers at the door) and an hour is a long way away to get back if she had had a problem. Plus presumably her dad was uncontactable when in the pool? I don’t think it was appropriate in this situation.

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I would be fine with this. Often leave mine when feeling convalescent as much better they curl up on the sofa and rest than get dragged out with me.

Grandad could have stayed with her? Seems nuts that so many kids should miss out on a swimming session when there's enough adults to sort it out if she really couldn't be left (but it sounds like she could).

He says the kids would be messed up from the divorce

No your children are being messed up now , every single day they ate being treated the way they are your son will grow up to think women can be treated appalling and as for your daughter, I feel.so sorry for her, a Dad treating her like she's worth less than a male and a Mum who is letting this happen.

you now drip feed until you have everyone saying your dh is a terrible person.

Yes. What a massive drip feed. Your post was about if your 11 yo DD should have been left alone (having suggested it herself). The answer is it's fine.

Your subsequent posts painted a scary picture of a dysfunctional marriage, an abusive & controlling H, and a DD wracked with anxiety. That's some drip feed with no indication of any of that in your OP.

It's hard to say what's ok having read that. It sounds like a deeply sad situation for all concerned.

I think she was probably pretty pissed off she'd been left out of swimming so dramatised the kidnapping thing so you'd be angry at her Dad. And it worked. I remember doing crafty things like that as a tween/teen.

I do agree that the adults were too far away for her to have been left alone, particularly as she'd been poorly. Although, as PP said I don't really think it's your DH's fault as it was her Grandad that left her alone.

I think the only thing wrong with this was the lack of people who she could easily contact if there was a problem. Since there's a "nice neighbour" in the equation, asking them to be a point of contact in emergencies would probably have been an easy solution.
Maybe focus on how to make you all feel more comfortable next time, rather than being angry?

I'm a bit surprised at people's reactions to the kidnapping thing. Any child with an active imagination might think this. We had one occasion when my oldest DC had the others crawling around so people ringing the bell wouldn't see them! I also remember when I was a young teenager and my parents got a babysitter, the babysitter couldn't understand why I would feel more secure with her there than being on my own late at night. It's natural to feel irrationally worried or scared sometimes, it's not always 'anxiety'. Having said that, there are obviously bigger issues going on in your family life than just leaving an 11 year old alone for a bit, which should be a non issue

YABVU to be “fuming”

Its ok for you to leave her home alone while you go to the shops, but not ok for her to be home alone while DH is taking other DC swimming? He has to consult with you first? You have a double standard going on here.

@CecilieRose

The problem isn't an 11-year-old being left home alone. As other posters have noted, most 11-year-olds are perfectly capable of being left home alone. At that age, I got myself home from school on the bus, walked 10 minutes along a country lane and let myself into an empty house.

Your DH's behaviour is not normal. He plays favourites with the kids and treats the daughter badly, she's afraid to sleep alone. At 11?! Making up illnesses to get attention and love because he doesn't give her any? In all honesty, the scenario described in your OP is the least of your problems.

Yes, this. Op it sounds like there is a lot more going on than an 11yo being left at home (which is fine btw and happens on a daily basis in homes across the country).

I don't have any answers I'm afraid but wish you well I trying to find them.

Apologies for not having planned to drip feed. I posted genuinely to ask what people thought about leaving an unwell 11 year old alone. People commented and asked clarifying questions. Maybe I'm not familiar with the unspoken rules of mumsnet posting and should have not replied with more details about our general situation.

Yes, it is a sad situation. Maybe not quite as bad as it sounds though.

Someone said she was either confident and independent or anxious and mistreated. In the world that I live in and know there are a lot of shades of grey rather than just blacks and whites. She has been alone at home before and out in town with friends. She is very confident both at school and at home apart from the nighttime and certain situations with dh. She is quite independent. Cooks and cakes at home, sorts out her homework without prompting etc. She will at times do my shopping for me in the local shop whilst I wait in the car outside. Not because I'm making her but because she asks to and enjoys it. She had said she felt better and wanted to go swimming. She was told she was too unwell yet left alone. It could be that she genuinely felt better. This is what she told me was true when she was defending her dad once I said I wasn't happy. She is a very considerate girl and could have also lied to say she felt better just not to inconvenience others.

I have never just allowed her dad to mistreat her. Whenever he is harsher or unfair on her and prioritises the boys I stand up for her. Every single time. I always point out to him when he does this. He often admits he has been in the wrong. He claims he apologises to her afterwards but I have never witnessed it and don't believe it.

People here seem to have a very black and white view of life. Many situations are a lot more complex and nuanced than that. My daughter is not being abused by her dad. She is at times being treated unfairly. I'm always addressing this when it happens and have always had conversations with her about it not being her fault. The sleeping issue, the lying and the making up of illnesses are serious issues and she needs help for those. Getting help for young people in this country isn't always easy. I'm still trying though and so far it seems like the secondary school might be a bit more responsive than the primary. Generally she is a very happy, cheerful girl who loves her family, friends and likes the person she is and feels confident in most aspects of her life. That can coincide with her also having things she feels anxious about (sleeping or being away from me) and with her having some significant problems in some areas of her life and development.

Yes at 11 should be able to be left alone at home for a few hours

Tho wouldn’t leave for 3hrs the first time at someone else’s house

Nor when poorly

Esp when has anxiety issues / thinking someone at the door is going to kidnap her …..

And of not being able to sleep alone

Do you have to stay with her till falls asleep ?

And others have said your dh treats your dd badly - possible also why anxious

Was no need to 3 adults to go swimming or grandad should have stayed with her / nor gone for long bike ride

If my Yr7 DD was off ill from school but not so ill she needed me by her bedside,I'd go out for a couple of hours yes. She'd watch a movie & play on her phone. She'd call me if needed..

To me it's weird that you haven't left her alone before. I've been able to leave DS 10 since he was 8 as long as he had a device or the TV.

@Motherhubbardscupboard

I'm a bit surprised at people's reactions to the kidnapping thing. Any child with an active imagination might think this. We had one occasion when my oldest DC had the others crawling around so people ringing the bell wouldn't see them! I also remember when I was a young teenager and my parents got a babysitter, the babysitter couldn't understand why I would feel more secure with her there than being on my own late at night. It's natural to feel irrationally worried or scared sometimes, it's not always 'anxiety'. Having said that, there are obviously bigger issues going on in your family life than just leaving an 11 year old alone for a bit, which should be a non issue

A child, like a 6 or 8 year old, yes. Not an 11 year old high schooler. That your parents got you a babysitter when you were a teenager suggests that your anxiety was created by your parents babying you. A teenager are the ones babysitting, they don't need babysitters. That any teenager needs a babysitter sans SEN, is cause for real concern. This thread/board shows that children are treated like babies when they're teenagers and not taught self-reliance or independence, and the result of that are children with severe anxieties and arrested development.

DD is in secondary school and a very independent and confident child. She has been into town with friends a couple of times on her own and has been alone at home for around 40 minutes when I've been to the shops. I'm not 100% sure she actually thought she was going to be kidnapped. She has a bit of a problem with adding quite a lot of dramatic turns to stories and I'm guessing this is one of those occasions

The problem for me was leaving a child who has not yet been alone loads on her own for 2 hours when she had temperature and wasn't feeling well. Also with doing something behind my back he knew I wouldn't be happy about.

At the point you posted this, it is fair for everyone to say YABU.
She is at secondary. You have said for 2 hours. You have said she is confident.

Of course, the all facts you have then added and changed later on, (or drip fed as is said on MN) means you are seeing things from a different place from the posters who have been replying to you.

In a normal marriage, either parent should be able to make a decision about something like this. The one who is there makes the call. On the surface, this was a perfectly reasonable call.

What you are bringing to the thread later, that you didn't tell anyone first, is that you are in a dysfunctional marriage and you dd is clearly not in a good place mentally, which is all so very far removed from the question people have been answering.

Find more ways to build her independence. Freaking out when the doorbell rings is anxious, weird behaviour. Where has she learned to be so scared of the world?

I know my husband also wouldn't dream of leaving an unwell 11 year old on her own.

But then your husband is harsh with your daughter son certainly her welfare isn't a priority.

Poor child is exhibiting signs of huge anxiety, not being able to sleep on her own.

OP, you obviously have severe MH issues, not helped by living with an emotionally abusive man threatening suicide if you leave.

Your poor daughter is collateral damage in all of this.

I think Woman's aid would be a good call for you to make, for your yourself and for your daughter.

You need support and your daughter needs protecting.

Well - parenting is a shared thing and inevitably you will not always agree. But his right to make decisions is as valid as yours.