Men in the female changing rooms!

[ewchoc]

I know this has been done to death, but I'm sat here waiting for my children to come out of their swimming lessons and getting increasingly annoyed at the number of men in the female changing rooms.

Tiny swimming pool attached to a school with two small changing rooms, clearly marked male and female. Every week there are at least one or two men who insist on bringing their daughters (all under 7) into the female side to change before & after lessons. It's just one open space, no cubicles or individual spaces, and my DD (9) is getting more and more anxious having to change in front of these full grown men!

Am I being precious or should I ask them to use the men's? Their attitude is that it's their daughters who are getting changed, so they can't take them into the male side with all the boys!

I'd rather a man came into a room full of women and their children than forcing a young girl to be naked Infront of men and boys.

Interesting. All this talk on these types of threads about a 9 year old boy with his mum making every other female in room feel threatened and uncomfortable. And then you get some people who are cool about a grown man being in there because it makes his daughter feel more comfortable.

Mind blowing.

I work on a leisure centre. I often have to tell men they are not allowed in the ladies. They are always totally amazed. I am totally mystified by their reaction.

And then you get some people who are cool about a grown man being in there because it makes his daughter feel more comfortable.

I would rather a young girl feel safe and comfortable whilst getting changed.
I would rather a young child who is not old enough to dress themselves be accompanied by an adult.
I would rather a young child be less at risk of SA whilst getting changed.

Do I want a man in a female changing room?
No.
Would I be comfortable sending my 5 year old child alone to get changed unaccompanied with a bunch of strangers?
Definitely not.

In this situation there is no other alternative.

Definitely speak to the centre about mixed-sex cubicles.
But there’s no need to scream or make a child get changed alone etc as some posters have suggested.

This is up to the swim school to solve rather than the actual SEN school which is used. Presumably the changing room spaces work for their needs.

The swim school needs to listen to its customers and come up with a solution.

I would complain.

And I don’t understand why in this situation it is not easy to come up with a workable solution. If it is a school pool and there are children coming for lessons as the only swimmers there must be a period of time when no one is in the changing room because it’s the middle of a lesson. The dad could bring his DD early and get her ready before everyone else arrives and then wait at the end until the other girls are changed or until all the boys are finished in the boys change room. He could bring her in her bathers
He could change her pool side using a poncho
He is the one who needs to come up with a solution rather than just ignore social norms and the feelings of other children and I think the pool should be making that very clear to him.

nothingcanhurtmewithmyeyesshut

"Start screaming. He'll not do it twice."

Bit of an hysterical overreaction!

Given that the physical changing room situation is what it is and, however much we would like it to be different it's unlikely to improve in the near future, there are so many possible solutions to this.

1. He could take his DD into the male changing rooms. If it's a kid's lesson it's unlikely that there'll be naked men. Anyway, he could change her in a corner, screening with a towel. If they are posing and lunging naked he should man up and ask them to stop - it's inappropriate when there are children around, male or female.

2. He could bring her changed and put her in a poncho in the car afterwards as PP suggested.

3. He could get her into something dry in the car.

4. He could take her into a toilet cubicle and put up with cramped surroundings.

5. He could get a female friend to take her into the ladies' changing room.

6. If it's a regular class he could ask another mum to keep an eye on her in the female changing room.

7. If all of the above are unacceptable to him, he could wait until she is old enough to sort herself out before he takes her swimming.

The one unacceptable 'solution' is to make other girls and women put up with feeling uncomfortable because he has a problem.

There are no naked adults, it is only children getting changed. Some are quite young, probably none quite old enough to change independently. And parents aren't allowed poolside, you enter into a very small foyer which leads into the two changing rooms, you pick male or female and have to go through to get to the pool (children are handed to teachers at exit from changing room to pool). So the only other option for the dads would be to take their daughters into the male changing room. But there are only a few boys changing in there, all under7, and no naked adults.

I take my (young) son into the female changing room and agreed with my husband that as he gets older we'll both have to take them (DH/DS in the mens, me & DD in the woman's).

I've already emailed the swim school to ask what the policy is and to email parents to make them aware, plus improve signage.

Their attitude is that it's their daughters who are getting changed, so they can't take them into the male side with all the boys!

So are all the boys actually in the male side? If so does that means none of them need help? Or have mums gone into the male side to help them?

Well done OP, with more signage you can point to this and state that men cannot come in as there is a room full of girls getting changed. If the men say they don't want their DDs in with the boys, you can point out that men being in the girls means all the girls are having a man in with them and that's not fair and not the centre policy.

@TrishM80 Oh right, I forgot, this is MN where every lighthearted comment needs to be prefaced by a warning.

Sometimes men come into the ladies changing room where my kids swim. The staff will tell them they need to leave. I'd complain and ask for them to be removed

I think it's difficult. Obviously your daughter is uncomfortable but those younger children may also not want to get changed in front of boys.
I'm always amazed more places don't have family cubicles or just individual cubicles.
Whatever you do in this situation someone is left uncomfortable. I'd probably switch to a swimming school with proper cubicles.

I'm deeply saddened but not shocked that so many people are prioritising the mens' needs and wants here.

Not those of a 9 year old girl who feels anxious about it.

OP you're absolutely right to challenge this, and I'd be looking for an alternative if the school thinks this is acceptable.

@Rosebel shouldn't the men change and not OP, as OP is not doing anything wrong and they are?

@Icecreambythesea

It is a bit of a dilemma and while I understand where the Dad's are coming from, I would not be happy with this either.

I'm faced with the same situation when I take my 8 year old son to his swimming lessons. He's at the age where he's very curious about bodies and as I don't want the girls to feel uncomfortable, I take him into the Men's changing room. The only alternative is to stand and wait for the only unisex changing room to become free.

Has nobody picked up on this? Or is it ok because its boys? Sorry @Icecreambythesea not meaning to pick on you or anything but you are in the identical yet reversed situation that has got everyone up in arms and some pretty much calling for him to be hung drawn and quartered on the diving board yet all are letting this slip & i can only presume it is because of the role reversal (MN trope of all men baaaad).

It does sound like the venue is not suited to the needs of the swim class. A school venue is going to have a boys and a girls changing room and that's it (unless it's been woked upon and added a variety of gnc changing rooms - though to cover all the permutations i think everyone would end up with a cubicle each).
A weekend class, for children who are not self sufficient, will have fathers bringing daughters and mothers bringing sons as well as the ideal of father/son & mother/daughter. I'm sure there will also be situations of parent + son & daughter too and now that it's the fashion i'm sure we will also have to consider trans parent or trans child and all these quite realistic needs cannot be met by what the venue is currently able to offer.

As an aside:
To those saying about men doing naked pushups and lunges etc in male changing rooms, as someone who had attended an number of gyms and swimming pools over the years I have never seen anything like that & particularly when children were also using the facilities there is very minimum time spent not covered by a towel - I think there's a bit of scaremongering or wishful thinking going on there.

@user1471447863 None has mentioned it at all and there's often two or three of us in there with our sons. On the flip side, there's also one father regularly in there with his two girls. He always goes to the far corner and helps them change one at a time. I agree that school changing facilities are not really geared up for this situation and it's hard to know what to do for the best.

Those men know very well they don't belong there. They are pushing boundaries because they want to see if they can get away with it, and so far, they are getting away with it.

@user1471447863

I hadn't seen @Icecreambythesea's post but there is another thread with exactly that situation and people are saying it's definitely not okay:

Swimming changing rooms www.mumsnet.com/Talk/parenting/4401415-Swimming-changing-rooms

Boys deserve dignity and privacy just as much as girls do. No parents should be in changing rooms that don't match their sex.

It’s because as society through social media we have given people the ability to voice their views and pushed for this.

Now you have perverts, men who say they are women and vice versa everywhere you go.

It’s all beyond ridiculous.

@Clymene 100% agree.
I hadn't seen that particular thread but there was one a long time ago where a woman was sitting in the mens for the duration of her sons lesson & if i recall the pool wasn't just being used for lessons at that time.

@Itsnotallaboutyoubaby I was that little girl without a mum. I had to go into the men’s with my dad until I was old enough to sort myself out and go into the ladies independently.
It would be much better for places to have the family changing option now as we have progressed as a society… but they definitely didn’t when I was younger!
sorry about your mum, my daughters are also those little girls being brought up without a mum & thankfully society generally has progressed & most places are now family orientated/expect fathers to parent equally.

A school pool officially has no need for family changing. If it's used out of hours then I'm sure there will be (or should be) a risk assessment for exactly this scenario

I can absolutely see your point OP, but somehow a young girl getting changed infront of a bunch of grown men doesn't seem right either.

Having no cubicles should break some sort of guidelines or regulations imho. it's amazing to me that swimming facilities can exist without some cubicles available for changing.

tell men to use the male changing room
complain to the swim school, take your children elsewhere if they fail to address the issue - and make sure they know that you are leaving because of their safeguarding failure.

If the swim school is council or grant funded in anyway, make your concerns known to the funder.

@Gliderx

If the same parents go every week, then isn't it possible just to keep an eye out for each other's kids? So you keep an eye on the male parent's girls and the male parent can keep an eye on any boys coming with a female parent. Most children older than around 5/6 can change themselves so you just need someone keeping an eye and to make sure they don't mess around.

This is my thought. Maybe offer to take her in for him.