Or is DH - Works on leasehold property

[MrsWarleggan]

So, DH and I have just purchased our first home. It's a leasehold flat. We knew from our lease that we would have to ask for permission to do a full re-wire on the place. In our complete and total naivety we assumed (wrongly as it now transpires) that as the works are essential due to safety issues with the existing electrics that we could do the work and then request retrospective approval. There is absolutely no way that they can refuse as the current fuse board hasn't been replaced since the 60's and there are wires hanging out of holes drilled through walls!

We have all the paperwork but as we are not legal owners until we complete on the 12th they can't entertain a request and won't be able to until deeds are transferred which can take up to a month after completion despite then being the legal owners!!

It now looks as though we can't request retrospective approval. The application form has a "retrospective approval" section asking for dates work completed and requests copies of the electrical sign off by the electrician etc. For what it's worth he is NICEIC registered and has his indemnity insurances which would provide proof off...... However in the next breath they say in their guidance notes any works completed prior to approval would put us in breach of our lease....... So here in turn is my question.

DH is incredibly and understandably frustrated. We have 2 weeks between completion and having to be out of our rental and just wants to get the work done. He is somewhat blinded by the need/desire to get the work done before we move in.

After going through the paperwork I am convinced we will have to delay a couple of months. Live in the danger zone property with two small children and await the approval then move in to parents when work goes on.

DH is adamant he wants to continue. I don't want to spend the first 6 months of homeownership waiting for a knock on the door due to unauthorised works.

We KNOW we needed permission and exchanged contracts based on this. However, it wasnt until we exchanged and submitted our works request that we were told we couldn't do anything until we were the legal owners. Even a solicitors letter to them did nothing and the current owners (probate) refused to put the request in on our behalf (approval would be transferred) despite doing all the actual paperwork.

Has anyone had any experience of this and do I need to tell my DH to get over himself and the work will get done when we can?

Sorry for the long post.... 24 hours of pure frustration typed out on a phone!!!

Are you talking about doing work in the registration gap between completion and change of ownership at the Land Registry?
Just get the transfer documentation to deal with the Gap so you have authority to ask on behalf of the registered legal owner until you are registered post completion.

I don't see why what you would need to wait until your registration was completed. You own the property legally on the date of completion, if necessary you can get a certified copy of the documents to prove this. The Land Registry is massively backed up at the moment so assuming it will be a month is a bit optimistic I think.

Registration isn't getting the deeds transferred, it is just updating the register (albeit it very important to do this). Who has told you that you need to delay for registration?

Seeing that picture I'd definitely be saying that was essential repairs, I'm with your OH on this one!

@Leftbutcameback the freeholder told us in the information pack they sent out.

@justMarriedBecca - that's incorrect. They will be the legal owners. Registration doesn't make you the legal owner, that's what completion does.

You say your DH is frustrated and sees this as an acceptable risk - I’m sure he’d argue that he doesn’t see letting children live in a fire hazard as an acceptable risk. When it’s that kind of choice I do think it would be understandable to start without permission (though putting the request in as soon as possible as PPs suggest!).

@mrsWarleggan - suggest your solicitor writes back and challenges that. They can undertake to provide a certified copy of the transfer document if you instruct them to do so. They clearly don't understand the nature of registration.

It's also a reinforced concrete ceiling that the existing wire is in so we need to lower the ceilings by 50mm to feed the new cable through.

On a non-legal note my mum just had her flat rewired including chasing through walls and a new false ceiling. Took three weeks and caused a hell of a mess, but at least it's safe now.

Also I wondered who told you registration would take a month? That's in the best case scenario, and not likely at the moment

Could our mortgage company kick off then?!! God I feel physically sick now 😔

There is a legal technicality about legal ownership not taking effect until registration is complete but I suggest you just ignore it for these purposes and get the work done by a competent person.

You're really over thinking this. You're not knocking down walls or doing anything to damage the structure are you? Or cutting off someone else's electricity supply? Assuming that is right the landlord will have no legal basis to refuse to consent so they are not going to challenge you on your right to do the works. They may have a view about making sure you do them correctly - and it would be advisable to tell them what you are doing before you start and when you are starting. But it will be fine. It's in noones interests to have a building with a genuine health and safety risk in situ.

I have sent numerous pictures to the Freeholder. I mentioned to them that the previous owner would have been in breach of their own lease for not keeping electrical wires and cabling up to a safe standard and she replied "Well, we wouldn't know that as we don't just walk into properties to check"

@JosephineDeBeauharnais
Out of curiosity, what will you do when you come to sell ? Apply for retrospective permission for the works you've done?

@Grumpycatsmum wouldn't the chasing be a structural issue in that we will be drilling into the walls?

This is bonkers. You and DP can take whatever risks you like with either your own lives or breaking the law. But you can't put your DC at risk. That's illegal. You say you can't afford rent and mortgage, but you can afford to risk dead or injured DC then? Either break the law to get the work done and deal with the consequences of that, take out a loan for a period so you can afford to cover both rent and mortgage then stay in your rental until the work is done and find some way to pay the loan back later, or find DC somewhere else to live until the work is done and the property is safe.

That picture isn't dangerous, it's shite work but not dangerous, those cables look double insulated to me, would take 5 minutes to temporarily contain them. You DH could sort out any ropey entry into a socket within minutes. Has he cleared a diary space and wants to crack on in that space?
He should be able to make short term repairs or disconnect anything that can't be easily fixed within a couple of hours. From that picture he's over playing how dangerous it is.

I would do the works regardless. No one is going to come knocking. And let's be honest, even if they did, what are they going to do? Make you rip it out there abd then? Nope. Wouldnt happen. Get the work done and Deal with the paperwork retrospectively.

Just get the work done.

You sound a bit naive when it comes to property ownership and leasehold and freehold. There are all sorts of things that you're "supposed" to get permission for, in reality no one does unless it's majorly altering the property in a way anyone else would notice.

Just crack on and get it done. You own the flat so treat it like that. Stop sending the freeholder so much stuff.

[quote DameCelia]@JosephineDeBeauharnais
Out of curiosity, what will you do when you come to sell ? Apply for retrospective permission for the works you've done?[/quote]
We’re intending this to be our last home, but should that change we’ll make a decision on advice at the time.

@Hercisback

I will readily admit that I am extremely naive!! Want to do the right thing for our family, but also don't want to get in the shit before we've even moved in!!

Who is the "they" who you need permission from? Sorry if I am being a bit of a thicko.

@FlibbertyGiblets

The Freeholder/Housing Association who own the building our flat is in.

Oh yes, I see, sorry (you are very patient).

Annoying situation. Idk what I would do tbh.