To be thinking about ending things because of my husband working from home?

[Opentoskychange]

I used to come on here a lot but signed up again. Been married to DH for twelve years, have two children aged 3 and nearly 1.

DH had to work from home in March 2020. It was challenging, as our eldest (2 at the time) knew he was there and would constantly want to run in and out, showing things to Daddy, not really understanding that he wasn't available. It was pretty stressful. When I had our second, it was just at the start of the second lockdown and DH was still at home. I really found my second maternity leave awful - just a constant stress of keeping children quiet and entertained and not too loud. I found it stressful when the baby cried or when the toddler left a mess everywhere. It was just him being there all the time. His office reopened back in May. However he didn't go back until recently. He's supposed to be back one day a week, I have Mondays and Tuesdays off work. He is supposed to work Monday in the office. But the thing is he often doesn't go or changes the day at the last minute and to be fair to him it is a genuine reason, it's something like someone needing a lift and they work Wednesday or whatever. But it means my two days a week, which are supposed to be for the children, are spent either high stress keeping them quiet and away from him or out and about - which is hard going when the weather's bad.

It also means I don't see much of my family, my mum visited last week but it was awKward as DH was there and she kept apologising for "making a noise" and "disturbing him" and saying "ssh" to me. I can't have any friends over to visit on my days off and I'm feeling increasingly isolated. I'm fed up and constantly stressed.

Increasingly I'm feeling like I dont want this from life but can't work out if it's just the fatigue of lockdowns or not. Any advice?

* So I am now either going to have to accept that my life is extremely difficult, *

Oh OP, really?

Hmm.... this doesn't seem to be anything that can't be fixed with a bit of sensible adult discussion.

1: DH can WFH but needs to create/stick to home office to create boundaries.

2: Try and establish the WFH days more clearly and make them set in stone.

3: Deliberately disturbing him as some PP suggested is not smart. That's deliberately destructive and if he gets in trouble/gets disciplined/gets fired, everyone loses.

4: It's really not LTB territory unless there's more going on here.

Literally all that's needed is some better boundaries.

Someone has a tantrum and he appears to ask about it. Or I say "ds was hard work today" he says "yes I know" and I die a little inside

Oh come on drama llama

Sorry OP but you need to stop being so accommodating.Your DH needs to adjust his working habits and let you and the children use the space you need at home, for whatever you need to do. HIs WFH is obviously not working for you. Is there a timescale for him to return to his office? One of my colleagues is in a similar situation and her employer has agreed to rent a workspace for her in a local shared space, so she's 'in the office' properly 2 days a week, working in the shared space for another 2 days and works at home otherwise. It means that both she and DH get one day free at home each week- at least while DCs are in school.

All that needs to change is your attitude. Which I know is very easy of me to say, but it’s true. It is most definitely NOT your job to keep the children quiet and away from him. That is HIS job. Your job is to keep happy and keep your kids nurtured and happy. If he doens’t like it, he can nurture a coffee in a cafe instead.

Having said that, it sounds like it also would be nice for you to get out and about with the kids, go to something normal like a playgroup and offload to another parent.

If you need help with this, please please get it. From family, friends and from counseling if needed. You’ve already taken quite an assertive step by identifying that this is ridiculous and putting it on MN.

My dh loves wfh, but it has put a strain on our marriage, his work dominates the house, I tried to talk to him about it to no avail

Just tell him he needs to arrange now to work in the office Monday and Tuesday( I don’t see why he can’t do both days) as it’s disrupting family life, you are the one having to sort it out on top of everything else, plus working 3 days

Moving forward you will be doing x,y and on a Monday and Tuesday and if the kids make a noise they do, you are not going to stop them from enjoying themselves when he can work in the office. In addition he needs to work from the spare room only, not wander about the house, make his lunch and take it to the skate room as you can no longer cope with the kids not understanding why daddy is not available

Then i would simply carry on as normal, let the kids make as much noise as they want, have as many visitors as you wish and leave him to it

I can't believe you are having such a hard time here, poor @Opentoskychange!! I absolutely hear you and absolutely understand.

You need to tell him he is fundamentally not welcome at home on a Monday or Tuesday and that the house is not his office. No excuses.

It isn't about the noise, the fact that he isn't in one place, or anything specific is it. It is just UNPLEASANT having someone in your home who is not engaging with you.

@Opentoskychange

I really am listening, but I don't think people are understanding that there is nothing enjoyable about being at home when someone is working there.

You are constantly aware of noise. Even if you just crack on anyway, you're aware.

Same with mess.

Someone has a tantrum and he appears to ask about it. Or I say "ds was hard work today" he says "yes I know" and I die a little inside.

Also, it's causing problems elsewhere. He doesn't go anywhere, so weekends he will actually drive around just so we're not in the house. This weekend he suddenly swung in a different direction and I asked what he was doing "oh I'll go the scenic route." Then the children fell asleep and disturbed bed time. it's seeping everywhere and it's toxic. He isn't the man I married.

But I see I jave been decided to be another poster. Thanks Mumsnet.

It sounds like you just despise him in general

This is all about how YOU feel with him there. You could do what PPs have suggested and just crack on, stop worrying about noise etc - because you are CHOOSING to worry about all that. But it sounds like you just don’t like him and don’t what him to be around and I’m not sure what the answer is to that.

@sillysmiles

I have WFH during covid and would have been furious if my DP had moaned about being quiet when his mate visited. It didn't even need mentioning it was so obvious he should

I disagree with this tbh, WFH is not the same as working in the office, And you have to understand that the primary function of a home is that - a home. And its primary role needs to be maintained.
So long as the person working from home, stays in one room then whatever is happening in other rooms is irrelevant. Very few work in a silent office without interrupts in work, why would you expect it at home.
I say this as someone who works but from home and the office.

The primary function of a home is a home, I agree. But since covid, a home has also had to take on another function, as a place where people earn the money to keep that home going. For some people this may remain in the long term, as a lot of employers are not rushing to move back to offices, so compromises in how home is viewed may be inevitable. I realise this may be hard on a person who is used to exclusive daytime use of the house as 'a home', but still think the need to make a living, during reasonable work hours, does trump the desire for socialising at home (within work hours). I don't expect silence of course, but nor would I expect disturbing levels of avoidable noise.

If you have been trying to resolve this issue with him for months but he had refused to listen and from the sounds of it has only become more erratic with behaviour that disrupts family life then I think you need to actually be very tough and hard line. He doesn’t see the need to leave the house or keep out of the way of the children but expects you to keep them out of the way and deal with them once riled up

I think you should take annual leave and take the kids to your mothers for a week and tell him the marriage won’t be continuing unless he

Returns to the office or

Sticks to going in on your days off with no exceptions or

Stays in one room with a kettle plugged in and a packed lunch and doesn’t interfere with your parenting of the kids until 5 o’clock or

Had some explanation for his bizarre behaviour like male PND

He should find at least one of these scenarios reasonable. If not he seems very controlling and you would not be unreasonable to leave him.

@GaolBhoAlba

Time to stop playing the martyr! It sounds like you're making YOURSELF feel guilty. I'd allow the kids to disturb him at will, and not feel bad about it. Toddlers are too young to understand 'do not disturb' - hopefully he starts to appreciate how unsuitable the situation is.

You would deliberately allow someone to be disturbed while they are earning money for your household, because you don't feel capable of telling your toddler no?

You need to stop thinking that he isn't doing anything wrong he is!! He is not listening to you. Unless he is stupid he is deliberately ignoring your wishes and making your life difficult.

Whilst it sounds nuts to leave over someone working from home, that's not why you would be leaving. It would be because he is disregarding your feeling. Your life changes immeasurably when you have kids anyway and with lockdown x 100, but if it's unbearable to you, no one else gets a say.

I would lay it out for him one last time and tell him the consequences of HIS actions if he doesn't start respecting your opinion and your family space.

I can’t see the issue. Why can’t you put the radio on and do messy play?! If he is in the spare room?

Sounds like you don’t like it when he pops in to say hi to the kids or see if he can help when one is having a tantrum. Why can’t the house get messy just because he is working in another room?

This honestly makes no sense to me. Surely it’s nice for the kids to see more of their dad throughout the day and to have lunch etc together?

My husband wfh full time and I have a three year old and a newborn. I love it when he comes down for a coffee as he can take the kids for five mins while I go for a wee! Sometimes it’s hard when I need help (or would like it) and he has to go back for a call etc. But we all get so much more family time.

I have struggled with this alot. My kids are older, they are at primary school, but during the first lockdowns we had them at home being homeschooled and husband working from home. It was an absolute nightmare for me. He expected complete silence from us all even though the kids were having online lessons with their teachers. He would tell me his job is the most important thing because that's the only thing bringing money in and keeping a roof over our heads!!
I put up with this for weeks until I had a complete meltdown and told him how rediculous he was being and unfair. It did get easier and he did start to go into work more. He works from home 2 or 3 times a week now and thankfully for me the kids are back in school but I still find it hard.

When I spoke to my parents for advice my dad told me we must not be compatible and how will we enjoy living together when we are both retired?? That didn't help at all
My advice echoes the others, you need to carry on as if he wasn't there. If it disturbs him you make it clear that home life is at home, work life is at work. The two shouldn't mix. In fact I would let your child keep bothering him because he will get sick of it

I get it, he needs to go bk to the office two days and stick to them. Tell them how stressful it is for you and that how having no space and room for kids and you to socialise and not noisy is impacting your mental health. If all else fails tell him you want to leave.

Upon rereading everything, I'm really confused about why OP thinks any of this is her problem. DH wants to wander all over the house while working, which means the kids run up to him wanting to interact. This apparently doesn't bother him enough for him to just stay put in a bedroom, so what's it to OP? DH can go into the office if he wants, but apparently prefers WFH with all the accompanying noise and chaos. Whatever. If and when the noise and chaos start to annoy him, he can either work from a bedroom with the door closed, or just go back to the office every day.

OP seems to think she has to keep the kids quiet and the house clean so long as he's working from home, but I don't see anywhere in her posts that he's even asked her to do that. He seems far less bothered by any of it than she is. So what gives, OP? Let him decide how much noise and distraction he can tolerate while working, and sort out his work arrangements (living room, bedroom, office, etc.) accordingly. Meanwhile, let the house get as messy as you want.

@StaringAtLightbulbs

I can't believe you are having such a hard time here, poor *@Opentoskychange*!! I absolutely hear you and absolutely understand.

You need to tell him he is fundamentally not welcome at home on a Monday or Tuesday and that the house is not his office. No excuses.

It isn't about the noise, the fact that he isn't in one place, or anything specific is it. It is just UNPLEASANT having someone in your home who is not engaging with you.

If my husband attempted to set a schedule for when I was and was not welcome in the house that my job pays for, it would not end well for him.

Kids that age will learn. But for that they need consistency. DH needs to pick a location (spare room, bedroom whatever) and stay there where possible. Yes he might need to pop down to the kitchen etc but he shouldn't be wandering around where your kids will just see him and naturally be distracted by him.

If he wants peace and quiet he needs to do his bit to try and keep out the way - the kids aren't the distraction, he is.

@PurpleOkapi

Upon rereading everything, I'm really confused about why OP thinks any of this is her problem. DH wants to wander all over the house while working, which means the kids run up to him wanting to interact. This apparently doesn't bother him enough for him to just stay put in a bedroom, so what's it to OP? DH can go into the office if he wants, but apparently prefers WFH with all the accompanying noise and chaos. Whatever. If and when the noise and chaos start to annoy him, he can either work from a bedroom with the door closed, or just go back to the office every day.

OP seems to think she has to keep the kids quiet and the house clean so long as he's working from home, but I don't see anywhere in her posts that he's even asked her to do that. He seems far less bothered by any of it than she is. So what gives, OP? Let him decide how much noise and distraction he can tolerate while working, and sort out his work arrangements (living room, bedroom, office, etc.) accordingly. Meanwhile, let the house get as messy as you want.

It’s the op that has to deal with the crying children after he comes wandering…

we will start an activity, he will walk into the midst of it, I will have to answer questions about it, he goes again, the children cry, it takes the pleasure out of it. Same for music and art and laying in the garden.

It’s not solely about him being disturbed or how much noise he’s prepared to put up with. It’s what she’s having to deal with.
And I’ll bet she had to deal with the disturbed bedtime as well.

He's not listening to you, is he? You need to sit him down and say, "You've got a choice. You either go back to the office when I'm at home with the children or I will start looking for somewhere else for you to live. I can't bear living like this. I've told you time and again how unhappy I am because you're working from home and I can't spend time with the kids without them crying for you. We can't make any noise because of you. I am not going to spend my life like this and I'm not going to let the children live like this. Now make up your fucking mind."

Can you just stop interceding altogether?

Accept (on his behalf!) that he will be interrupted and he has a choice whether to prioritise going in to the office on a Monday or not.

Going in to the office one day a week might need to feel like an attractive option.

Obviously this should be resolved by talking it through but he's not listening.

Why would bedtime be disturbed? How late is he working, and is he really so clueless as to go into a sleeping child's bedroom and wake them just so he can interact with them?

She doesn't actually have to deal with the crying children. If she's explained to DH that popping in and out makes them cry when he leaves, and he does it anyway, she's entirely within her rights to just send them back to him to deal with. If he doesn't like that situation, he can quit causing it.

But that seems to be only a small part of the problem here. She also talks a lot about noise and mess and wanting the radio to be on. She's set completely unrealistic expectations for what she "needs" to do, apparently without any indication from DH that any of this is necessary. Rather than discuss any of that with him, she's contemplating divorce because the work she's created for herself - that he never even asked her to do - is just too hard. It looks to me like she wants to leave him anyway, and she's just grasping for excuses.

The I died a little inside could be because of the way he said it rather than the actual words. He could have been grumpy, or even angry. Written down, we don't know.

This isn't particularly about noise or mess. It's that he is potentially showing who's boss by interrupting, using whichever bit of the house he fancies. And then leaves OP to pick up the pieces.

OP it's not that he's not hearing you, he's hearing it and then ignoring it. He's not showing you any respect or consideration. Because that doesn't suit HIM.

My guess would be that if he can be this much of an arse about WFH, he can be this much of an arse over other things too. So leaving him may not just be about this. Rather, this is a concrete example of his behaviour that's tipped you over the edge. And if that is the case, then probably it IS time to move on.

I'm sorry about how you're feeling and what you're going through.

There's two things you mentioned that I picked up on.
Loneliness: Having children, especially when they're so young, can be so isolating and lonely. I remember often walking home from a one hour play group session with a new born and crying. I kept going which built me up to get involved in other things & people. From there, I made a lot of parent" friends. Having children doesn't have to be lonely. It's the perfect excuse to make friends!

Your DH problem: You need to sit your DH down and tell him seriously that he can't keep interrupting your day with the children as it upsets them and its not fair on you or them. Obviously he needs to be able to go to the toilet/get to the kitchen but there's no need for him to pop his head through the door of the room that you're all in.

When it comes to noise, you simply cannot and should not try and keep the noise down. You're making yourself anxious and the whole situation worse. Firstly, your house is your home and not his office.
If he doesn't like the amount of noise, he can go back to the office or get noise cancelling equipment.

I think ending your marriage is a bit drastic. These things are easily fixed with communication. Big hugs.