The Labour Party are unelectable. Can they turn it around? What would they need to do to gain your trust?

[flashbac]

After another week of corrupt shenanigans from the Tories (last week was allowing literal shit pumping into watercourses, this week attempting to set aside a finding of dodgy dealings) we would still be stuck with them if there was a snap election tomorrow.

The Labour brand has become far too toxic. Keir is next to useless and all of them listen to the wrong people instead of instinctively knowing what to fight for. If they can turn it around and rebuild trust it won't be a quick or easy job. They have lost all credibility.

What do they need to do to rebuild trust or is it too late?

For me they need to start with the following:

• Get a leader with charisma and strong values surrounding fairness. The current one just doesn't cut it.
• know wtf a woman is. Stop trying to erase natal women as a sex class.

What's on your wishlist for a credible alternative to the Tories?

Be grown ups
Stop with the self Id TWAW. For that alone I would vote Tory which is mortifying

@MsTSwift

Be grown ups Stop with the self Id TWAW. For that alone I would vote Tory which is mortifying

I wouldn't vote Tory. I'd rather spoil my ballot.

Get a leader with charisma

I prefer politicians with morality and intelligence to charisma but I’m clearly in the minority.

Tell us what a woman is would be a big help. I can't vote for someone who doesn't know that.

Honestly, the only way I'd now vote Labour (as a life-long supporter) is if they had a female leader who was sympathetic to GC viewpoints. I'm fed up with men being in charge, and bowing to the TRA bullies.

Maybe if Jess Phillips spoke up...

Can't see that happening any time soon.

Have some actual policies of their own.

Get rid of that personality vacuum Starmer, and the deeply unpleasant Sadiq Khan.

Likewise oust all those with anti Semitic views

Stop being so in thrall to the unions

Find someone, anyone, to be the face of their party who is neither a champagne socialist nor someone from the school of hard knocks who thinks anyone who didn't grow up on benefits is scum.

None of this will happen and if they continue on their present course in a few years the Labour Party will be as irrelevant as the Lib Dems.

Stop the petty infighting. Move on from insisting everyone has to think/believe the same - figure out how to be a broad church with common goals.
Stop living in the past whilst simultaneously thinking you're the only progressive party.

Propose viable, workable solutions to social care, education, NHS and the benefits system. You know, like labour politicians should.

Not spending their time in-fighting and acting like 4 year olds. Plus, lose the misogyny, the anti-Semitism and embrace freedom of speech - learn to engage in debate rather than close it down.

I think they are on their last legs. I think they have no presence. I read Dom Cummings recently saying they need a woman leader and Boris finds women difficult to deal with. Cummings thinks Nandy would be good. I don't like her. None of the women labour shadow bench appeal to me. And none of the men either.

I can't help thinking about stuff labour didn't do when they were in power. And stuff they did do e.g. PFI

Perhaps it's time for a new party?

If you can vote for Tory as an alternative then you don't stand for labour values. Spoil your ballot or don't vote by all means but Tories stand for everything that socialism is against. I have never understood floating voters between these two parties, they are chalk and cheese.

Mine would be, drop anything to do with Self-ID and do something on CMS. If they really care about women they should care about the crappy amount that (usually) fathers are required to pay and how hard it is to get it - something like the US system where failure to pay CM is a criminal offence. On a purely self interested basis, I'd also like them to legislate on a right for summerborn children to be educated in the year below (currently it's at the discretion of LAS, so postcode lottery). I'd want a load more effort on taxing the super rich - and a greater ability for the state to reclaim and resell homes that remain empty for years on end. Crikey, I'm more left wing than I thought....

Definitely knowing what a woman is and making it clear that women's rights will not be lost. A leader with charisma isn't absolutely necessary, but one who is prepared to be present and put his/her head above the parapet is. I've seen KS speak to a small group. He was brilliant at the stuff he'd prepared, useless when answering questions from the audience. Oh, and another disqualification requirement - I don't want anyone who has been on Have I Got News For You?

I know a lot of people have been turned off labour and I understand why. For me, the biggest issue is our voting system. There needs to be a left wing alliance on a single issue manifesto: to bring in proportional representation.

The Tories are only ever between 35 and 42% of the vote which means that in almost every constituency more people don’t want them than do. All left wing parties need to come together to oust the Tories. Whichever party has the strongest candidate in a constituency is the only party to field a candidate.

I don’t believe a single left wing party will beat the Tories for decades. I don’t think there’s anything Labour can do except make a pact with the LibDems, Greens, SNP, Plaid Cymru etc.

I'd vote Labour because of Keir Starmer, he's an intelligent man with a normal amount of integrity, decisive and responsible, looks for solutions rather than parroting soundbites

What I don't understand is why nobody else seems to feel the same.

They need to stop with the woke/TWAW shit for a start.

Then they need to come up with decent policies that are robustly and realistically costed (so that we know they’re genuinely affordable and not pie in the sky). And bloody well have an opinion of their own rather than just criticising the Tories. Because how it usually goes is:

“The Tory policy on X is wrong, it’s unfair, it’s ill thought out, etc. etc. What’s our policy? Well…erm…the Tory policy is wrong because…”

Stop living vicariously through the errors of others, rise above it and PROVE why you’d be better.

On the GC/self ID issue alone, I would genuinely consider holding my nose (politically) and voting Tory.

@HeddaGarbled

Get a leader with charisma

I prefer politicians with morality and intelligence to charisma but I’m clearly in the minority.

Me too but people vote based on how much attention leader can get and hold. I'm perhaps not phrasing this very well. The leader needs to be memorable and unboring.

I don't think Labour are on the right track to have mass appeal - they're a bit invisible aren't they?

But there is NO WAY IN A MILLION YEARS I would vote Tory as an alternative, or anything which would enable them.
I vote for whatever party is best placed to beat the Tories in my constituency - which is Labour. The Tories are destroying this country; they need to be got rid of and that is my number 1 priority.

What I don't understand is why nobody else seems to feel the same

Me too ☹️

I feel like people think ‘sod integrity, are you entertaining?’

They need to stop the craven abasement to the gender woo lobby. The Tories are the only party that's even vaguely sensible on this stuff. Which is really depressing. Labour, Lib Dem's, Greens are all lost. Lisa Nancy believes intact male rapists should be incarcerated with women if they want to be, so there's little hope that a female leader would salvage Labour.

If you can vote for Tory as an alternative then you don't stand for labour values.

Whatever “Labour values” are to you, to me they are respect and fairness, and upholding the right of people to be safe. If Labour are pursuing TWAW and are OK with male-bodied people in women’s prisons, women being told to “reframe their trauma” if they don’t want to be examined or even be around men in a rape crisis centre, women losing out/being injured in sport, and academics being hounded from their jobs in a silencing of free speech, then I don’t think they espouse Labour values either.

I think Sir Keir is great. He makes Boris look like a total buffoon at PMQs.
Hes just not full of himself like other leaders and I like that.

OP I agree - I think there needs to be a combination of integrity and personality. I like Starmer. His way of approaching politics appeals to me. But he doesn’t get the soundbites, which means he doesn’t get the news coverage. Instead, they cover Johnson spouting his crappy 3 word slogans because it’s quick and easy and memorable.

I watched Ed Milliband at PMQs when Starmer was off with covid. He had Johnson on the back foot from the outset, and left him flustered and blustering. It did show how much more effective someone else might be than Starmer in that role.

Its difficult because I dont search out what they stand for or what their manifesto would be. So i get a biased press impression of them.. But I dont see them holding the government to account at all which is the point of an opposition and they seem focussed on identity politics at rather than social change and I dont think their model has caught up with global changes in the workplace

@PermanentTemporary

Same.

Not sure why people want "charisma" over intelligence and an understanding thats lots of issues are complex and don't boil down to a simple soundbite.

I don't except to agree with him on every issue - politics is compromise. I'd prefer he was a bit more keen to tax more and push more green reforms but I also get that the public probably doesn't feel the same yet and it's better to get elected than to always be on the sideline

But I think Keir's principles are sound, he would be a diligent and honest prime minister and that he is not there for the fame and the money.

I'll always vote for anyone but Tory as they go against all my beliefs. It depends on the year who that means and it's not always ideal, but I honestly could not vote Tory with a clear conscience.