Can you ever really come back from having huge fights with in laws ?

[nubbie]

To cut a long story short, I think there's a big personality clash between my in laws and I.

I don't think they're bad people. I don't think they generally mean harm. But it's just a bad fit.

We've had various big fights over the years.

I think eventually both sides will just give up and we will stop seeing each other socially. I would never stop them from seeing the grand children. But I just wouldn't spend time socially with them.

I think the narratives between us are so deeply engrained on each side, that there's always going to be friction.

It's always the same, they say something upsetting. I either let it go or I tell them please not to say or do whatever it is. They say I'm sensitive and shouldn't be upset and that they only ever mean good.

I understand it takes two sides to have a fight. But they never take any blame at all and basically attack my character. Saying I have a chip on my shoulder, a horrible mind and that I twist what they do.

They don't apologise for upsetting me. I end up apologising to them for making them aware of having upset me. Because I genuinely am sorry about it, because they just don't understand it. It's a character clash.

Anyway, it's just not healthy for anyone. Has anyone ever come back from a situation like this ?

And before everyone tells me that I'm the issue, I do think about this a lot and I analyse myself and I really really try to let as much stuff as possible go. But sometimes it just gets too much and I have to say something to stand up for myself.

As I said, it's not black and white. I understand sometimes I need to let things go/ not take things to heart and just brush stuff off. I try to do it as much as possible. But I acknowledge this to them as well and I apologise.

They don't seem to see any error in their ways and always put the blame on me having a strange personality and I just can't accept that's the only reason there's a problem.

It's a clash, which I'm happy to acknowledge, but they do not. They say it's me only.

Any advice ?

@ShowMeHow

Sounds like they have a different ‘family style’ than you aspire to (understatement) assuming they speak to each other the way they speak to you. It not then it’s outright bullying IMO.

My Family of origin were also entirely offended when they were confronted with the impact of their unreasonable ‘jokes’/expectations/overstepping (on my DH) entirely believing they were untouchable… that if there was no (acknowleded) mal intent then they were entitled to do say as they wished without filter.

It went so very tits up I can’t explain without a book length post.

Totally feel for you and your DH (who is me in this scenario and probably at a loss what to do)

How old are your kids and what distance are you living from in-laws?
What does DH think, do and say about this stuff?

We don't live far and kids are tiny still.

DH initially didn't really get it and would brush it off but now he really is seeing it for what it is.

MIL also said that he's horrible to her because I have turned him against her. But it's not that, he just sees things for what they are. It really isn't easy for any of us. In-laws included. And yes, the different family styles thing rings true in this case.

@Babyiskickingmyribs

How does the blunt change of subject technique go down with them? So MIL says ´those trousers make your bum look ginormous!’ and you say ´is that a new rose I saw in your garden, MIL? I’m looking for one for my sister, perhaps you know a good garden centre for interesting rose varieties.?’ Don’t even justify her hurtful nonsense with a reaction. Or. Tell her that was a rude thing to say and then move seamlessly on to garden roses, new teacups, latest episode of coronation St etc. Don’t get drawn into ridiculous discussions about whether you’re over sensitive to her ridiculous rude comments or not.

OMG I try that all the time. Or I pretend I didn't hear and just don't give a response. It does not work, she'll keep hammering until she gets a response.

Telling someone they have a big bum? Nah, can’t imagine a situation where that ever would not be offensive.
Your bum is big, have you noticed your bum is getting bigger, why is your bum so big? Nope it’s all offensive, there is no food way to ever say it, and there’s no need to. Hell I have a big bum and I know it, no one has ever pointed it out to me and if they did I’d tell them to FO.
It’s just inexcusable rudeness, then gaslighting when you call them out on it.

It doesn't even matter if they're "all bad" or whose fault it is or if you're oversensitive or whatever. The fact is you don't enjoy their company and they probably don't enjoy yours either so what's the point? I value my free time too much to be around people whose company I don't enjoy.

Obviously, there are 2 sides to every story, but from what you've said, you are not the problem.

Back away from contact but be wary about what they're saying to your kids when you're not around.
I imagine the little drips of poison about you will start soon enough. Make sure your husband knows that any badmouthing you to the kids will result in no contact with them.

@Cheerbear23

Telling someone they have a big bum? Nah, can’t imagine a situation where that ever would not be offensive. Your bum is big, have you noticed your bum is getting bigger, why is your bum so big? Nope it’s all offensive, there is no food way to ever say it, and there’s no need to. Hell I have a big bum and I know it, no one has ever pointed it out to me and if they did I’d tell them to FO. It’s just inexcusable rudeness, then gaslighting when you call them out on it.

I could have lived with it if she said it just to me. But she said it in front of other people. It was even more embarrassing. Everyone then proceeded to look me up and down and near my bum.

Yep, I would avoid seeing her too. Limit visits to what you can stand without exploding. Consider teaching the kids a stock phrase like ´that’s not a nice thing to say about Mummy’ so they don’t start thinking it’s ok to be rude to you.

So… it’s funny of they’re horrible to you, but horrible if you’re equally “funny” in return? I think you need to move away. Don’t let the kids near them. Let DH go by himself and let them suffer in their own misery. If they don’t like you, that’s their problem. You can live with that, because they’re vile people. When people say “I’m not racist, but…” they invariably blurt out something horribly racist. Same with “No offense, but….” and then they bludgeon you with something absolutely hideous. Their opening line does not negate the racism or offensiveness. They’re attempting to hide it in a stupid cowardly manner. Just like this dickheads. Just don’t play anymore.

@Justilou1

You need to look up “Gaslighting” and you need to look up “deflecting”. When people behave badly (and know it, but don’t want to admit it) they try and “deflect” negative attention towards the victim. That’s what’s happening. Gaslighting is when you are made to look like or feel like you’re the crazy one for absolutely batshit behaviour or rules or situations you’re expected to put up with - like repeatedly being told you have a fat bum. Like having your family insulted. Like having your parenting insulted/disregarded.

They’re arseholes.

This!

As soon as I read the OP, I thought, that doesn't sound like a clash, that sounds like gaslighting.

OP, if they genuinely thought you were "just too sensitive" then why the fuck do they insist on pushing your buttons? (It doesn't sound like you are too sensitive. You sound very patient)

I think the plus for you is that DH seems
to see the problem

At least you can go OMG did you hear your mother today when she said XY and z and he’ll hopefully be horrified about her and supportive of you.

I would at all you can do here is accept they are sub ideal and try to move toward activity based contact, taking them to soft play, playgrounds, crazy golf etc changing the activities as the kids grow so the focus is not on you but in the activity. Cinema = ideal.

Don’t ever accept a wider family holiday or hosting at your house and keep any visits short with always a commitment to leave after say 90mins for another engagement, hopefully before they have disgraced themselves with their behaviour.

My dad and my sister are like this. When they insulted me, I used to point out its insulting and upsetting, they would say I am over sensitive. It got me to that point of crying with tears of frustration/anger because they didn't listen. So then I thought, fuck this I will fight fire with fire.

If they insulted me I would insult them back but always with a truth, so that it was impossible for them to turn it on me.

So for example when I got my MSc my Dad said: 'You really are pathetic with all these degrees you do, it is pointless' so I replied with 'You don't have one qualification to your name so how do you know whether degrees are pathetic or not?' When my sister said 'Your bum is massive isn't it?' I replied, 'The difference is your massive thighs carry your weight don't they?'

My Mum and brother practically cheer when I do it.

They get stumped because I am not lying, and to argue otherwise would make them look silly. They can't even tell me off for bullying them because they would have to admit they are doing the same thing. It has actually made them back off a bit and they try it on a lot less now because they are wary of hearing the home truths about themselves and it isn't worth them starting their jibes

I wouldn't be making much of an effort with anyone who told me I had an evil mind and a chip on my shoulder in those circumstances.

They sound exhausting - and boring. I'd cut way back on time spent with them. When you are there just ignore/agree with them about the personal insults "your bum is huge" "Yes I know - thanks" save your arguments for when they try to make you do something with your children you don't want to - but even then you need to just leave rather than having a screaming match.

Just lower you expectations - way way down and then down some more. these people will never "like" you or treat you nicely. expect that, limit how much you have to spend with them and stop feeling guilty that they feel they have lost their son to you. they have and it is a bloody good thing.

Back away. The most liberating thing in my previous marriage was no longer seeing ils
.. If they came over I was at work. Dh took the dc to theirs every week. I stayed home. Bliss.
You are being a mug for accepting anyone speaking to you like you describe op..
At a leisure activity or in a cafe would you stick around for more? These people aren't your people..
Thank goodness too!!

V low contact
Always have an escape plan “
Never stop sticking up for yourself , your examples are v reasonable as soon as kids are teens they can manage their own relationship with grandparents ( make this clear to everyone and also clarify ground rules are to be polite about you otherwise no contact

Had this a few years ago. Got to the point I needed therapy to help me see it wasn't me it was them. Went NC and haven't looked back.

DH is LC but still having therapy to help him figure out stuff from childhood right through to now.

They won't change. They don't want to. So either you shut up and put up, or you set boundaries. Lucky for you your partner sees it.

Good luck x

Keep yourself & your kids away.

They need protecting from abusive bullies-not subjecting to them.

OP just drop them. I wouldn’t even left them be alone with my children. If they’re happy to insult you in front of others, I can only imagine what they would say about you in your absence to your children or even insult your kids. Being blood or in a family gives no one the right to insult you and treat you in such a way.

Stay away in general but if you must visit kill them with kindness (and consequences) Your bum is big- response I know, I love my bum as does dh(sly smirk)
You should let your kids play in mud - ok mil, then let them tramp mud through house and smile at mil and say your idea was fabulous, they look so happy (same applies to chocolate hands on furniture)
Your kitchen is dirty .. thank you I’d love some help, kids can be overwhelming, here’s a mop
Your sil does x better… tell sil mil has offered her services to do x because you know, she is so amazing at it.. when can she do x

Or tell them to go to hell… personally I’m petty so would at least try killing with kindness 😂

I've never had a huge fight with any other adult, I suppose the closest I came was the serious breakdown of a business-partner relationship but even that was dealt with through legal channels and any time we had to speak to each other it was civil, if strained. This isn't because I don't know any toxic people, I do, including my partner's father, but we deal with that by supporting each other, agreeing how we would deal with him together so we would present a united front, clearly setting boundaries, and then quietly but firmly ending conversations/leaving situations when those boundaries were crossed. it isn't easy, but it is simple - as long as your co-parent is willing to 100% support you (and vice versa) and that you present that united front. It's when partners get wishy-washy about that united front and leave you twisting in the wind with their toxic family that things really fall apart.

@Lollypop701

Stay away in general but if you must visit kill them with kindness (and consequences) Your bum is big- response I know, I love my bum as does dh(sly smirk) You should let your kids play in mud - ok mil, then let them tramp mud through house and smile at mil and say your idea was fabulous, they look so happy (same applies to chocolate hands on furniture) Your kitchen is dirty .. thank you I’d love some help, kids can be overwhelming, here’s a mop Your sil does x better… tell sil mil has offered her services to do x because you know, she is so amazing at it.. when can she do x

Or tell them to go to hell… personally I’m petty so would at least try killing with kindness 😂

Haha I've done this. Aw DC looks tired, shall we put her down for a nap? At 5:30 pm.... ' oh OK, so you want to stay up with her until 11 pm then ? ' smile

I honestly think killing with kindness won’t work with these people, they want to be able to to insult you with impunity and not be called out on it. They want to get away with it.
Sod that, you sound like have more self esteem than to let them get away with it- good for you!

They sound like my own parents. I’ve not seen them for over 15 years. They are horrible people.

I think it depends if its just too much hard work tp maintain a relationship that possible is bringing absolutely no positivity to tour life. Sometimes blood really isn't thicker than water and estrangement is kinder all around.

to possibly your*

[quote nubbie]@blubberball he thinks it's totally unfair that the narrative is always me being the issue and that they can't see they genuinely upset me a lot.

I think it's pretty toxic for my health to be honest.

But if he stands up for me they tell him he's a traitor to his family. It's just a mess. And I feel for him because it really can't be easy.

It's not easy for in laws either. I also feel for them. But I just can't take it anymore and I think my life would be easier if I limited contact. Like I said, I want them in my children's lives. But do I really need to have dinners and christmases with them. I don't know, it's tough when there's such a clash. [/quote]
But if he stands up for me they tell him he's a traitor to his family. It's just a mess. And I feel for him because it really can't be easy.

He's not a traitor to family, as YOU are his family! When a man leaves his childhood home and enters into a marriage and new family with his wife, SHE becomes his family. He would be a traitor to his family if he didn't have his wife's back. His wife IS his family. Maybe they should be told that.