To not understand the benefit system . What is going on ?

[Westnsouthnabout]

I have got totally out of touch with the benefits system.. used to work in public services so did used to be in direct contact with a variety of social issues.
Am aware that sudden breakages like washing machines to be paid for, delays in initial payment and sanctioning can mean a sudden and catastrophic change in cash flow.
However, I have been reading that food banks are utterly stretched and in crisis.
I do understand that many people end up in emeegency sitiations, however, have also been reading that some are actually reliant on regular food banks . Sort of like a weekly shop..
I totally accept that I am out of touch with current situations and would like to kmow( seperate to current rising cost of living etc which i know about) .. what is going on re why so many people are relying on them as a regular source of food when they are in reciept of a regular and mostly preductable income( apart from sanctions etc as i said) in the form of benefits.
I am aware I am ignorant amd want to understand more and perhaps contribute.

The closest launderette to me is nine miles away. It's £7 for a load of washing, can't find the cost of drying but I assume the same again. Add £6 bus fare, that's £20 for a single load of washing.

Some people are completely out of touch with the real world.

The thing is a lower income family such as us (I am fully reliant on benefits) may pay more on TV but don't have any other form of entertainment.

I pay £24 broadband, £10 Netflix and then alternate Nowtv/disney+. I have prime but that's because accessing shops is a nightmare due to DC's disabilities so it's a benefit of the postage. So roughly £50 a month.

I don't go for coffees, we don't go on kiddy days out. I haven't had alcohol since 2015. I don't smoke. I don't pop out for breakfast/lunch/dinner with friends or go to gigs etc. I haven't gone out on an evening since 2014. It is all swings and roundabouts.

The choice in that situation would be to do the washing at a laundrette

Last time I went to a Laundrette it cost me £4 in bus fare and I think about £10 doing the laundry. And that wasn't everything we had worn, just enough clothes to get us through another week.
So if my washing machine breaks you think its possible to spend £14 per week and save for a new machine? (Luckily when I was in this position last year I got a refund on the holiday I'd booked when I could afford it that was then cancelled due to covid so could replace my machine)

People on benefits do tend to smoke more than those not on benefits, and as a group are more likely to spend more on takeaways.

To know the reasons behind that rather than judge people for these choices is the key.

For people with few pleasures in a difficult life, smoking can give a welcome break in the relentless gloom of a day. People on benefits are human beings after all.

The same applies to TV packages, people stuck in all day need something to occupy them FGS.

Wealthier people are able to spend more on healthier pursuits, are more likely to have positive things to look forward to in their lives and reasons to care about their health and future.

Added to which, many people are in accommodation such as Band Bs which have limited or no cooking facilities, so of course they will eat more takeaways.

Not many people would choose a life on benefits, so maybe those looking down from a position of superiority should learn a bit of compassion.

@ForgedInFire

So my partner (who was our breadwinner) died suddenly a couple of months ago and right now I'm relying on the benefit system. The issue is the benefit cap. Rent on my home is £1100 a month- this is cheap for my area, honestly you won't find a 2 bed cheaper because my rent hasn't been raised in several years. But because I am under the benefit cap the local authority will only pay £600 towards my rent. They will pay £900 a month towards rent normally but can't because of the cap. I get £800 a month. So out of that £800 I am expected to pay £500 a month rent top up, all bills and feed and clothe myself and 3 children. The council won't help me, they won't even let me on the list because I still have a roof over my head. No money to move house/area. I've got a meeting with a housing charity next week to see if they can give me any advice.

@ForgedInFire so sorry for your circumstances

@wewereliars I think your example is one group of people and then there's another camp. Single parents staying to make it on a low wages and we have to manage and make it work. Sometimes it is frustrating as we are adults... I don't think it's as clear cut as people lacking compassion that's just one aspect.

@wewereliars

People on benefits do tend to smoke more than those not on benefits, and as a group are more likely to spend more on takeaways.

To know the reasons behind that rather than judge people for these choices is the key.

For people with few pleasures in a difficult life, smoking can give a welcome break in the relentless gloom of a day. People on benefits are human beings after all.

The same applies to TV packages, people stuck in all day need something to occupy them FGS.

Wealthier people are able to spend more on healthier pursuits, are more likely to have positive things to look forward to in their lives and reasons to care about their health and future.

Added to which, many people are in accommodation such as Band Bs which have limited or no cooking facilities, so of course they will eat more takeaways.

Not many people would choose a life on benefits, so maybe those looking down from a position of superiority should learn a bit of compassion.

They don't get it and never will, they just imagine themselves, with their background, motivation, knowledge and hope just with less money.

They don't understand the affect it has on you. Until I had money I never understood that cooking could be enjoyable rather than one more fucking thing I had to do before I could have a minute. Same with walking and any number of other activities.

Then you get the obligatory "I was always poor but just naturally better at being poor than all the other filthy lazy poors", and everybody nods, comfortable in their belief that being poor is ultimately a choice and thus deserved.

Fuckers.

Well exactly glasstabletop.

But People have been encouraged for years to hate the poor, disabled etc all the while the people with millions and billions don't pay their fair share . Or anything in many cases.

It's a deliberate agenda, dispiriting that so many fall for it. The immigrants have been kicked out so I guess those on benefits are the next scapegoats

@MatildaIThink you have obviously never been poor. Your lack of understanding shows.
Being poor long term is tough. People treat you like crap. You are likely to have a low paid job where at the bottom of the pile people look down in you and treat you like crap. You likely live in an area that is not so great with high crime and anti-social behaviour.
All of this creates a lot of everyday stress. You cant afford to go on spa days, or have massages and holidays to destress regularly. Instead many people drink or smoke.

But also middle-class people drink more alcohol than poorer people. And are more likely to take cocaine and other illegal drugs to destress.

Do you know how expensive a laundrette can be? We were without a washing machine for 10 days or so. My neighbour did a few loads. I couldn't ask them to do all the washing.

I spent around £60 in the laundrette in that time.

£4 a load, or £8 a load for the big machine and then £1.50 for 15 minutes drying time.

The choice in that situation would be to do the washing at a laundrette, or if possible at a family member or friends for a while until you had saved the cash to buy outright rather than pay the exorbitant price of credit

The nearest launderette to me (according to Google), is 15 miles away. I live in a village that has no buses at weekends and only 4 a day during the week. It would take 2 hours and 3 separate buses to get there "Going to the launderette" is not an option for some people.

Posted to soon.

So 4 hours and 5 buses. How long do you think it would take someone on benefits to save for a washing machine given it would cost around £30 for bus fare (the bus through the village is not subsidised), plus the Laundry costs?

6 buses not 5 obviously

[quote julieca]@MatildaIThink you have obviously never been poor. Your lack of understanding shows.
Being poor long term is tough. People treat you like crap. You are likely to have a low paid job where at the bottom of the pile people look down in you and treat you like crap. You likely live in an area that is not so great with high crime and anti-social behaviour.
All of this creates a lot of everyday stress. You cant afford to go on spa days, or have massages and holidays to destress regularly. Instead many people drink or smoke.

But also middle-class people drink more alcohol than poorer people. And are more likely to take cocaine and other illegal drugs to destress.[/quote]
Its not the use of drugs or alcohol by anyone that is a factor really. If its bad for one group, its bad for another.

Of course the unspoken point here is that middle class people are insulated from the very real effects of crime that comes from their use, and can afford it. Drugs and alcohol are just like the rest of capitalism.

That's what it comes to and always has. Receiving public benefits means that the state can claim to enquire about you, or at least, that is what a lot of politicians think.

One day, those who get these benefits will be tested. The idea of the deserving poor has never gone away.

@Myusernameisnotmyusernameno

Yes but why not make sure genuine claimants are given what they need. Not pass it on to people who can't be arsed to get a job.

The DWP themselves say the “error and fraud” rate on disability benefits is less than 1%

However, ill informed people like yourself is why it has been socially acceptable for governments to repeatedly make disability benefits virtually impossible to get for people without professional help.

Fwiw - all of the disabled adults I know (which due to having two disabled children is quite a few now) downplay their conditions and symptoms. Especially on social media.
In fact some snide people have commented in the past that my DD is obviously “fine” because her Facebook shows a young woman socialising with friends and doing “normal” things. Funnily enough people soon got fed up when she made a point of blogging the days where she couldn’t get out of bed, the days she was incontinent, the almost weekly a&e trips and the likes and encouraged her to focus on the fun things…

@Nemorth

Do you know how expensive a laundrette can be? We were without a washing machine for 10 days or so. My neighbour did a few loads. I couldn't ask them to do all the washing.

I spent around £60 in the laundrette in that time.

£4 a load, or £8 a load for the big machine and then £1.50 for 15 minutes drying time.

Oh and I have a car to take me there.

There are no buses where I live (bus company took the only one away). So I'd have to walk with the laundry or get a cab.

I'm lucky in that I have a laundrette only a mile away but walking with laundry would be difficult and cabs an additional expense.

If you think you'll end up spending around £30-£40 a week at the laundrette, buying on ridiculous credit (because it's expensive to be poor) seems a sensible choice.

The fault is with companies like BrightHouse (RIP) they should have been regulated in order to provide a valuable service without exploitation of the poor.

I think some people think 'work' is just 16 hours a week or so and then claim benefits, expecting everyone else to pay for them.

More people could be working full time, I say that as a single parent who works full time. I expect there are some full time workers who may need a food bank, but most don't.

Being reliant on benefits is a very stressful and precarious way to live.

I am self employed, the freelance lifestyle is pretty stressful but it's the only option I have, no one else in their right mind would employ me, my health makes me massively unreliable!

I rely on my PIP very heavily, because of my PIP I get the disability working tax credit (fortunately, as the universal credit option), I also have a car, I don't pay car tax or car insurance.

Although my PIP award was for 3 years, they can and do call you in for review after a year or two - I am currently awaiting a review, I could wake up tomorrow to a letter saying "no, we think you are better now, give back your car, your money stops as of last week"... and I will lose hundreds a month, with perhaps a week or two of warning.

This is despite the fact that my disabilities are not conditions that get better, they only get worse.

I can appeal that, but my benefits would stop until I win an appeal, leaving me with half my income or less, and no transport.

Mandatory Reconsideration can take weeks. Tribunal can take YEARS to actually come to a hearing. Ok you get back pay if you win... but you then get an award that ends at the end of the term and you have to make a NEW application (not a review) before the end of that, so you could win, get a 2 year award, and be back applying within the year!

How many people do you know who could take losing their transport AND half their income with no warning, and find it easy to haul themselves out of that hole.. even without disabilities and shitty health to cope with?

It's easy to think anyone on benefits is being given freebies and lovely stuff but the reality.. is often pretty scary shit.

Righty some people can't afford to work full time because of the insane cost of childcare in the UK. There comes a point where you're worse off in work. That shouldn't happen - the system needs to change.

Zero hours contracts also contribute to the situation - where work is precarious and poorly paid and where you don't know what you will have coming in from one week to the next, you aren't going to take risks.

The poverty trap is real.

@Righty

I think some people think 'work' is just 16 hours a week or so and then claim benefits, expecting everyone else to pay for them.

More people could be working full time, I say that as a single parent who works full time. I expect there are some full time workers who may need a food bank, but most don't.

You can't blame them though. Make it make sense.

My childcare costs £40 per day through out school holidays that's £160 4 days a week
It's so expensive UC do not cover £200 per week for play schemes.
My DS school has NO after school club only snack and chat till 16.15.

Do you get the picture now?

Righty

News just in, your experience is not everyone's experience.

"More people could be working full time" what is the data to support this assertion?

UC say to use the food banks as if it’s part of the service they run. It’s disgusting.

As a single parent to 2 primary age & a toddler DC approx 10 years ago I received the following each week:

CB - £48
CTC - £195
HB - £129
CTB - £21
IS - £73
Total income - £466 per week (I also got maintenance but we'll disregard that just now)

Just did the entitled to calculator & I'd get £413 per week in the same situation just now - that's £53 a week less (the cost of my food shop 10 years ago).

Given that the house I lived in at the time (£139 a week rent) now costs £219 per week (yet the weekly LHA has only risen by £4 to £133 for a 3 bed) & the cost of food, fuel & utilities have increased I'm pretty sure I'd be using the food bank too.

The thing that has always amazed and horrified me is how quickly things can spiral. A friend of mine was a SAHM with 3 small kids when her husband announced he had been having affairs through the marriage and was leaving, then had a massive stroke soon after. So she went from having a fairly well off life to having no income, not being able to access benefits, finding she was liable for all kinds of debt he had run up. Within a year they were living in a caravan, she could not afford to keep her car, and had to use food banks. I watched her get so ground down by it, it was heart breaking.

@Smashingspinster This. We went from a 65k combined income where we worked opposite shifts (Me 5am-1.30pm, he 3pm- 1am) to a very lone parent. The day he fucked off he emptied my bank account.

I soon found out he hadn't paid our council tax in years (luckily the LA took him to court as they deemed me as having zero means to pay back) nor our electric bill, the two things he had responsibility for.

The local children's centre bought me a tub of formula to get through the first few days.

My oldest DC had disabilities, I couldn't (and still cant) find child care for her. I had to quit my job.

My life went from ok to unrecognisable in a matter of a fortnight.