Star Hobson- murdered toddler; prevalence of videos of “funny” parenting of “difficult” children

[CallMeRisley]

This isn’t a thread specifically about Star Hobson, I know there is another thread about her. I didn’t know how to succinctly word my title so I’ll explain. After seeing that thread, I googled the case and read through some details. In this page of live updates from the trial:
www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/19659483.live-trial-alleged-murder-toddler-star-hobson-begins/
There are details explained of videos taken of Star before her death, from the mother and her partner’s phones.
These include for example:

-A video of Star distressed/upset (having a tantrum?) lying on the ground outside, an adult says “come on, get up”, she is then picked up by an adult by her reins “like a puppet”, then put back down.

-A video of Star falling asleep, eyes drooping and head falling lower and lower until she ends up with her face in a bowl of food with caption “That’s what happens when a baby doesn’t sleep”.

-A video of Star leaning forwards in a kids’ plastic chair too far forwards so that she falls out and the caption “It was in that moment she realised she’d messed up”.

The judge/lawyer referred to these videos as “disturbing, bizarre pieces of footage”. The judge or lawyer said of the tantrum/lifted up by reins video “why would a mother film their child in this state?” and of the falling asleep in food video “there is no love being demonstrated for that child”.

I don’t know about anyone else but I see videos like this of toddlers and young children all the time on Instagram and tiktok.
I have seen many “funny” videos of kids falling asleep at the dinner table. Just google “toddler falling asleep while eating”.
A personal acquaintance uploaded a video of their child crying at the table at breakfast time, having been given last night’s dinner for breakfast after refusing to eat it at dinner time, with comments of “good on you!” from others.

There is quite a well known and shared image of a Dad carrying his tantruming toddler by the front of her coat (I’ve added it here, if you haven’t seen it) which is generally shared as “funny” and “we’ve all been there”, the Daily Mail article about it calls it “the hilarious moment” and that the Mum can be heard “chuckling” during the video and she says “What's even funnier is that she is more than 3-feet-tall and over 37 pounds heavy and the jacket didn't break”.

There are also plenty of videos of kids falling off things, falling out of chairs, swings, pushchairs etc with “humorous” captions.

Ok so the parents in all these other videos didn’t then go on to murder their children, as it appears is the case with Star Hobson. But AIBU to feel uneasy about the rise and prevalence of “funny” videos making light of young children and/or showing them upset and in distress, and that the sharing, watching and making of these videos creates a desensitised attitude towards the children- that they are being used as humorous entertainment rather than their emotional needs being met.

So are these types of videos (obviously not including the later context of Star’s murder) as the trial says “disturbing and bizarre” and “no love is being shown” for the children, or are they just a bit of light hearted fun, poking fun at stressful parenting situations and showing solidarity for the tantrums, the sleepless nights and the rough and tumble?

YANBU. Who looks at their child upset and whips out their phone to film it, surely you'd be busy comforting them or trying to deal with the situation.

[quote PixieLaLa]@Marmite27
I’ve got a photo of DC1 being followed by a clutch of cygnets and a mummy swan, which is adorable. The next photo is of her wailing in DH’s arms because mummy duck pecked her because she didn’t throw the duck food on the floor like she was told to

Not really the point of your post but what you did was actually really irresponsible and put your child in danger all for a cute photo opportunity. Mummy swans are extremely protective of their babies and have been known to break children’s arms if they get to close…but hey it got you a few likes of SM [/quote]
Haha, the classic British "A swan can break your arm!" urban legend.

Although I do agree that letting young kids play around animals and their young is probably not a good idea, "have been known to break children’s arms" sounds quite funny when you think about it. A quick google says there's no reports of swans ever breaking anybody's arm/s. It's just a thing British people love to repeat to each other for some reason.

www.countrylife.co.uk/out-and-about/dogs/curious-questions-can-swan-really-break-arm-190943

Nobody should be plastering videos of their children all over social media. Even if the moment is an amusing one to them.

I have seen threads here from posters saying that they were video’d when e.g drunk and plastered all over friend’s social media while they themselves aren’t on SM at all. And the response is that the friend is out of order and should take the video down.

Yet we don’t give our children the same privacy. We see their moments as being there for the amusement of adults, and that’s not ok.

As pp's have said its a fine line. Baby asleep in a bowl of spaghetti to kids injured?

Star's mother should be shit at sawn

Shot at dawn

I would not want a permanent digital trail of my DC. We're a mix household, laid back and strong boundaries, and we both as parents agree that posting videos/photos online is against our principles.

@waferingstranger
Haha ok the swan breaking arms was OTT 😂 But my general point was I think it’s irresponsible to put children in a potentiality dangerous situation to photograph or film it because they think it’s cute or funny and will look good on their social media….

My god, I've just read the court updates from yesterday and today. That poor baby. I hope those two women get life. The messages between them are sickening. She was a baby. 4 months younger than my son. I can't imagine filming him in distress and not consoling him. Heartbreaking.

@VapeVamp12

My god, I've just read the court updates from yesterday and today. That poor baby. I hope those two women get life. The messages between them are sickening. She was a baby. 4 months younger than my son. I can't imagine filming him in distress and not consoling him. Heartbreaking.

It’s horrible isn’t it

[quote PixieLaLa]@Marmite27
I’ve got a photo of DC1 being followed by a clutch of cygnets and a mummy swan, which is adorable. The next photo is of her wailing in DH’s arms because mummy duck pecked her because she didn’t throw the duck food on the floor like she was told to

Not really the point of your post but what you did was actually really irresponsible and put your child in danger all for a cute photo opportunity. Mummy swans are extremely protective of their babies and have been known to break children’s arms if they get to close…but hey it got you a few likes of SM [/quote]
We were at Centre Parcs and the swans are pretty tame there and will follow you around asking for food. Even when you’re minding your own business several feet away they will come up to you. They also knock on the windows asking to be fed.

Apart from being pecked by an over excited swan as she had the food in her hand, she wasn’t in any danger as an adult could have picked her up at any time (and did).

But carry on judging.

Plus, where did I say I posted it on social media?

All I alluded to was the actual existence of the photo, if you actually read what I posted instead of frothing you may have noticed that. I don’t have Facebook or Instagram accounts.

I really wish I'd not read that link. Poor little girl 😭

@Marmite27

Would you/did you upload the middle photo on social media with caption “that’s what you get for not doing as you’re told with the duck food!”

My comment to the photo at the time was ‘it was all going so well, until they were pecked by a duck’. I think in ‘real life’ they were told ‘that’s why we said put it on the floor’

Well your response to the question above definitely gave the impression you had posted it somewhere. Along with your comment about ‘loosing the narrative’ if you left the 2nd photo out. The narrative to who?

I was complaining to my husband yesterday about this weird reel on Instagram that turns your face into a horse. People are doing it with their babies and their babies are terrified. I don't understand why people do this? Why would you want to purposely scare your small baby?
It's baffling

I just read some of the court updates out to DH and couldn’t even read it out without crying. That poor little girl.

Those court updates. Horrific. Hope they get the maximum sentence. Utterly dispicable.

YANBU - filming a kid's distress is just plain wrong.

As for parents filming themselves dishing up last night's dinner for breakfast to their kid and the kid crying. Nothing commendable about any of that.

It has definitely gone too far in some cases. There was a US You Tube family who regularly showed the parents playing really cruel jokes on their children & also them screaming at their kids for no reason , until they cried "because it was a joke, it's funny". They had their children removed.

YANBU. I find videos like that very distressing to watch. Using your child as a punchline, or more generally constantly mining your life for SM posts, seems to me a sort of self-exploitation. I feel some people been conditioned by SM likes into a sort of alienation from their own existence- never actually really experiencing anything at all except as potential content. And where this also involves a vulnerable and non-consenting third party, it’s worse again.

I commented on a tik tok once of a father letting his small child climb onto a chair and then fall off while he tried to climb on to the window ledge. He was probably around a year/year and a half old and could have really hurt himself. I got abuse hurled at me, called "a Karen" etc.

Oh yes o commented on a few
One where family were on a speedboat and the dad was holding the child lengthways and was pretending to throw him overboard.
The sea was very choppy and they were going so fast, if they'd have hit a rogue wave the kid would've been a gonner.
NO safety vest worn by the father or the child.

I too was called "Karen".

That shows you the level of intelligence on there.

Everyone should delete tik tok and stop giving these morons a platform to abuse their children.

I agree, those kinds of videos have always made me twitchy

Op I agree and that's what also struck me in the star case.

It's appalling, filming dc and normalising it and sharing it. I feel that there is no education at all on how to parent and I'm getting fed up of these excuses of "difficult dc" being rolled out and extreme punishment for these difficult dc

We need to urgently address this as a society, even if that includes how to parent in phse. (sp)

That children want to please us they are not naughty or difficult.

Sttsgeties and help needs to go out from doctors, midwives, nurses, health visitors at every moment they come into contact with the new mum.
It needs to be made clear physical contact is not acceptable and preferably banned.
Punishment like facing corners is not acceptable and doesn't work.
Etc etc.

• I lived near the river and I still remember being bitten as a toddler by a Swan and how sharp it felt. It was scary and I had a fear of swans for a long time after, as a small dc swans are huge and pretty terrifying. I certainly wouldn't want to be bloody filmed I'd think my dp were utterly mad if they had filmed and posted me in pain and scared.

There is a lot on social media that makes me uncomfortable. The ones I’ve always hated are children in hospital beds in A&E etc. I’ve always been so worried and stressed when we’ve been in. I don’t understand why some people whip out the camera and take a load of pictures of their kid on an oxygen mask to post on Facebook.

That said, it is clear in the Star case the photos weren’t there as a ‘oh this is cute’. They were not providing her with a safe space to sleep and seemed to be enjoying her doing it in a cruel way. The intention is everything here.