Insulate Britain - a bunch of loonies or rightful cause?

[EerieSilence]

I'm watching the videos with Insulate Britain people blocking the motorists, people driving their children to school, hospitals or simply going to work.
I don't get the cause and the way they chose. I'm a leftist myself and participated at demonstrations but this, I really don't understand.
How is blocking normal people doing their normal business going to achieve anything?
If it happened to me, I would be pissed off and wouldn't care one iota about the cause. Why don't they protest in front of Boris's expensive nursery, blocking ways to Queen's residences and parliament but instead target people who didn't cause the problem?

They’re scum. I wish them all a lifetime filled with nothing but pain and suffering.

*Just look at the levels of abuse they are prepared to take.

I don't think many people on this board would have the guts*

Classic privileged perspective. You've obviously never worked in customer service, retail or hospitality.

@Larryyourwaiter

It’s misdirection though. Most of the worlds pollution is coming from places like China. Obviously excessive car usage ruins your local environment/health. Most of the people I know who do the most environmental campaigning drive a huge amount themselves.

Most of the worlds pollution does not come from China. China emits around 29% of global CO2, against having 18% of the world's population. It's per capita emissions are half of those of the US, China's are about 30% higher than ours, however that is direct emissions. What we have actually done in most of the West is to offshore our emissions, the majority of the emissions from China are actually them making stuff for us, everything from computers to bikes, car parts, clothes, toys, furniture etc. If we made those things in the UK, or we accounted for the CO2 emissions of our imported goods our per capita CO2 emissions would be far higher than theirs.

Total loons and they’ll be forgotten. They won’t even be a footnote.

It’s interesting, I’ve seen a lot lately about what irresponsible arseholes the media are for leading the public yet here we are, happy to accept their assessment of these protests on the whole.

Certainly given the rises happening and projected for energy costs you’d think more people would see the benefit of what they’re protesting.

For those interested but not enough to research, these are their aims:

WE DEMAND

1 That the UK government immediately promises to fully fund and take responsibility for the insulation of all social housing in Britain by 2025

2 That the UK government immediately promises to produce within four months a legally binding national plan to fully fund and take responsibility for the full low-energy and low-carbon whole-house retrofit , with no externalised costs, of all homes in Britain by 2030 as part of a just transition to full decarbonisation of all parts of society and the economy

In order to meet UK commitments under the Paris Agreement to stay below 1.5C, and legal obligations under the Climate Change Act 2008, as amended in 2019, emissions from heating and powering homes must be reduced by 78% in less than 15 years and then to zero by 2050

Nearly 15% of the UK’s total emissions comes from heating homes: an overhaul of the energy performance of the UK’s housing stock is needed to reduce the energy demand

Retrofitting Shortfall

The UK needs a nation-wide programme to upgrade almost every house. The Institution of Engineering and Technology (IET) 2018 report, Scaling Up Retro fit 2050, advises that nearly every home in the UK needs to be upgraded with energy efficiency measures. That is 1.5 homes per minute to the year 2050

Currently, the UK Government does not have a robust long-term national strategy with a funding mechanism in place to retrofit our homes

They are targetting the public because they hate ordinary people

Behave.

@TravelLost

What do you propose they do instead?

Atm we have a government thst doesn’t give a shit. People don’t seem to be conscious of the situation.

So I’m wondering what people think will have an impact instead.

How about having discussions and convincing people at grass roots level, rather than pissing them off with these dramatic tactics? Or would that be too much like hard work?

@MephistophelesApprentice

*Just look at the levels of abuse they are prepared to take.

I don't think many people on this board would have the guts*

Classic privileged perspective. You've obviously never worked in customer service, retail or hospitality.

Exactly. They sit in the road for a couple of hours, may get dragged to the side or something snatched out their hands. May get some abuse hurled at them. They're doing it by choice.

I worked in hospitality for years and was regularly picked up, shoved, shouted at, spat at, scratched, hit etc all out of necessity to keep food on my table and a roof over my head.

For the right cause I would absolutely put myself in the position to be abused, but forcing motorists to be stationary with the engine running (defeating their purpose really), forcing people to not received medical care, preventing people from saying bye to loved ones, stopping children getting to school and regular Jo Public from getting to work and everything else is not the right way.

How about having discussions and convincing people at grass roots level, rather than pissing them off with these dramatic tactics? Or would that be too much like hard work?

They are not aiming at these people. They have more than enough "grass roots level" support - they dont need any more

right cause, wrong method.

do something bloody useful. glue yourself to my roof... I could do with some extra insulation.

Also, it just shows are out of touch they are with many people's realities.

In my current role, if I was late for work because of these morons, by bosses would probably just shrug their shoulders and let me make up the time later on/another day. In my previous job, not being on time for a shift could result in my losing my job and not being about to afford rent or food. In hospitality in my city, everyone knows everyone and if I was fired from one venue for missing an important shift (like running someone's wedding or something), that would follow me around like a bad smell and I'd be virtually unemployable in that role. Often bosses and hospo businesses don't care what your reasons are, only that you are there.

@Cornettoninja

It’s interesting, I’ve seen a lot lately about what irresponsible arseholes the media are for leading the public yet here we are, happy to accept their assessment of these protests on the whole.

Certainly given the rises happening and projected for energy costs you’d think more people would see the benefit of what they’re protesting.

For those interested but not enough to research, these are their aims:

WE DEMAND

1 That the UK government immediately promises to fully fund and take responsibility for the insulation of all social housing in Britain by 2025

2 That the UK government immediately promises to produce within four months a legally binding national plan to fully fund and take responsibility for the full low-energy and low-carbon whole-house retrofit , with no externalised costs, of all homes in Britain by 2030 as part of a just transition to full decarbonisation of all parts of society and the economy

In order to meet UK commitments under the Paris Agreement to stay below 1.5C, and legal obligations under the Climate Change Act 2008, as amended in 2019, emissions from heating and powering homes must be reduced by 78% in less than 15 years and then to zero by 2050

Nearly 15% of the UK’s total emissions comes from heating homes: an overhaul of the energy performance of the UK’s housing stock is needed to reduce the energy demand

Retrofitting Shortfall

The UK needs a nation-wide programme to upgrade almost every house. The Institution of Engineering and Technology (IET) 2018 report, Scaling Up Retro fit 2050, advises that nearly every home in the UK needs to be upgraded with energy efficiency measures. That is 1.5 homes per minute to the year 2050

Currently, the UK Government does not have a robust long-term national strategy with a funding mechanism in place to retrofit our homes

1 That the UK government immediately promises to fully fund and take responsibility for the insulation of all social housing in Britain by 2025

Ah, "The government pays", which means that they don't want to pay themselves, but want "someone else" to pay. I agree with additional home insulation, but the majority of it should be funded by homeowners.

2 That the UK government immediately promises to produce within four months a legally binding national plan to fully fund and take responsibility for the full low-energy and low-carbon whole-house retrofit , with no externalised costs, of all homes in Britain by 2030 as part of a just transition to full decarbonisation of all parts of society and the economy
The second demand is basically the same as the first, but that they want it enshrined in law that they don't have to pay.

The rest of it, whilst insulation could help, if we build 15-20 nuclear power plants, banned gas boilers and insisted they be replaced with heat pumps and built more off shore wind and solar would hugely reduce our carbon output and requires little in the way of insulation.

If they wanted us to get to net zero quicker then they should be campaigning for a UK built and funded nuclear power program, removing all fossil fuel power generation from the grid. However as their whole position is about having a tantrum, not about making substantive change, they won't.

It's pretty annoying but surely some people can change their mode of transport whilst the protests are on

I find it bizarre the lack of rage on here when ambulances can't get through floods or people can't get to work because major roads are flooded. Bizarre.

There are so many more positive things they could be doing instead of causing difficulties and harm to ordinary people

1. seeing if there are charities currently offering insulation to low earners for free/ at a discount and if there are put their efforts into fund raising for the charity so that it can offer the service to more people
2. if there isn't, set up a charity and do it themselves
3. work on educating people about insulation options
4. making deals with insulation companies for discounted insulation if x number of homes all buy it from them (my area has done this for solar panels, so I'm sure something similar could be done)
5. stand at by elections and force it to become a campaigning area Etc...

Instead it looks like they're throwing their toys out of the pram and demanding someone else deals with it for them

The timing of this has all been very convenient.

This!

For a government trying to push through some controversial legislation, the IB mob were manna from heaven. I dont think the government wound them up, but they aren’t doing much to defuse the situation either

And after today’s performance (motorists pulling protesters off the road and articulated lorries inching forward) it’s getting bad out there

Hypocrites every one of them

1.5 homes per minute😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂.

Bet none of them have even read that IET report or have a clue what the IET is...

You shoulda made this a poll @EerieSilence Would have been 95% against these entitled twonks.

It's pretty annoying but surely some people can change their mode of transport whilst the protests are on ridiculous comment- so everyone who uses a motorway during the week is to rearrange their daily lives in case these twats pop up...oh its a ploy to fund public transport?!

@Dojacatpaws

It's pretty annoying but surely some people can change their mode of transport whilst the protests are on

Not if people had already started their journey before they knew where the protesters would be. Unless they announce their planned protests the day before or something?

Does anyone think that Johnson and his merry band of deeply caring and responsible Tories will eventually watch the footage of people glueing themselves to the M25 and say OH MY GOD you are right, thank you for pointing it out, we’re going to implement all your proposals immediately , thank you thank you thank you

No? Thought not.

I saw the leader of Insulate Britain on the SE News last week hectoring and bullying Riz Lateef aggressively and I didn’t think his ‘no debate’ stance did him any favours at all. Nor did his shrugging over the fact that people could/will die if ambulances are stopped from getting through, or people are prevented from getting to their seriously ill loved ones in hospital. He didn’t care.

There are ways of going about things and many of their points may be valid ones, but this is a classic case of utterly muddle-headed thinking over how to work towards their aims. They won’t achieve what they want in this way. You want to get people on your side, not to alienate them. Surely this is a pretty basic point.

Reasonable cause, but being pursued by a bunch loonies. They’ve completely lost public sympathy and it’s only a matter of time, judging by today’s footage, before it gets properly violent or someone gets hurt. I know they want to make their point but blocking ambulances and ordinary working people going about their business isn’t the way to do it.

@MatildaIThink we’ve (as in England and the wider UK) have already committed to reducing emissions.

I’m not sure your points about wanting someone else to pay stand; this is our money, it’s our government they’re protesting.

I can’t pretend to know the ins and outs but I’d rather money was spent on tangible home improvements than the environment equivalent of Dido Harding and a black hole shell company siphoning off our cash without providing what it’s meant to. Which is a likely scenario if the government choose to pay lip service to their commitments by providing the usual bluster around setting up ‘something’ called something appropriate (but utterly impotent) to keep people happy.

@Cornettoninja
My issue with them demanding that "the government" pay is that what they mean is they want to not pay themselves. Homeowners, be they owner occupiers or landlords should be responsible for upgrading the insulation to reasonable levels, but that cost should not be funded from general taxation because the benefit financially will be felt by those owners and owner occupiers or landlords.

I would of course rather that the money was spent on something where we see a real return on our investment, but I don't think we should spend for the sake of it. If the government can find, from general taxation, £60 billion per year to insulate homes, is that actually the right way to spend it? In reality, looking to reduce our carbon emissions, it would almost certainly make more sense to spend that building 3-6 nuclear power stations per year. If it was to be spent on a wider spread, more electric car charging points in lamp posts would also factor in, wider than that it might make sense to spend some of it on healthcare and education, solar installations and heat pumps on all government buildings etc. With increasing energy prices home owners will insulate their own homes as it will save them money in the long run and it could be managed in the rental sector by mandating energy efficiency standards (just as they currently do with gas and electrical safety etc.).