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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Infidelity is abusive. AIBU?

131 replies

Infidelitydiscussion · 06/10/2021 15:07

Given that cheating on your spouse/partner often includes gaslighting, causing emotional trauma and putting them at risk of sexually transmitted diseases - personally I would consider cheating to be abusive.

AIBU?

OP posts:
TractorAndHeadphones · 06/10/2021 16:00

Given that you can cheat on your partner without them even knowing - it’s not abusive.
Abuse is violent, controlling, destructive etc behaviour.
Cheating can be none of these until a partner finds out.

Cheating is disgusting btw I would never stay with a cheater. But you don’t minimise abuse by calling cheating abuse.

LittleMysSister · 06/10/2021 16:00

If you are in a position to be able to have an affair then you are able to leave a relationship IMO. It might not be really easy but it's certainly possible. Just because someone treats you badly doesn't mean you are entitled to potentially put them at risk of STDs for example.

Agree with you in theory but in reality it's just not that simple for many people.

Not least those with children who know that ending their relationship means being apart from those children a lot of the time, or who know that their partner's will likely move away with the kids if they split. Also those who would really struggle financially to make it work.

Obviously when a split happens they do make it work, but those hurdles are huge ones when it comes to ending an established relationship/family. I can see how people bury their heads in the sand.

LittleMysSister · 06/10/2021 16:00

*partners

CorrBlimeyGG · 06/10/2021 16:00

Just because someone treats you badly doesn't mean you are entitled to potentially put them at risk of STDs for example.

So it's OK to abuse but definitely not OK to have sex with someone else?

LaBellina · 06/10/2021 16:02

Just because someone treats you badly doesn't mean you are entitled to potentially put them at risk of STDs for exampl

An affair doesn’t always have to include sex. Look at the many threads here about partners having emotional affairs.

ftw163532 · 06/10/2021 16:03

@HarrietsChariot

It's abusive in the sense that all relationships are abusive, both partners abuse the other to a lesser or greater extent. I've never had a relationship (that lasted) where I didn't have my personal freedom limited to some extent, nor did I not limit the freedom of my partner. That's what a relationship is, a compromise between what's best for the two individuals and what's best for the couple combined.
You don't understand what abuse is.
Jellycatspyjamas · 06/10/2021 16:08

Cheating is disgusting btw I would never stay with a cheater. But you don’t minimise abuse by calling cheating abuse.

Absolutely, abuse in a relationship is awful and no I don’t think being in a position to have an affair means you’re in a position to leave. Leaving a relationship involves disrupting everyone’s life, sometimes the level of control means it’s not possible to leave, sometimes the affair is a means of provoking a split that otherwise wouldn’t be countenanced by the other party. As in much of life, the complexities of affairs don’t lend themselves to a simple, blanket statement.

MatildaIThink · 06/10/2021 16:12

@Infidelitydiscussion

Oop, replace 'man' with woman wherever nessecary. I'm not trying to be sexist even though the vast majority of cheats are men Smile
For people under 50 the amount of men who cheat is roughly the same as the amount of women who cheat, it is just that men are more likely to get caught. Over 50 men cheat twice as much as women, 21 and under women cheat more than men.
DrSbaitso · 06/10/2021 16:19

21 and under? How are they defining cheating within that age group?

DrSbaitso · 06/10/2021 16:20

@Tal45

Yes I would consider infidelity abusive. the definition of abuse is something cruel or violent and infidelity is cruel IMO. Agreeing to compromise on the other hand isn't abusive as it isn't cruel or violent.
In many cases, the partner doesn't know anything about it and is perfectly happy. Is that cruel?
Original poster
Infidelitydiscussion · 06/10/2021 16:24

In many cases, the partner doesn't know anything about it and is perfectly happy. Is that cruel?

Yes for many reasons, one being that in many cases the partner is still having sex with the wayward spouse/partner completely oblivious to the fact that they're going with other people and putting their sexual health at risk.

OP posts:
HollowTalk · 06/10/2021 16:25

I think it's like throwing a bomb into the home, tbh.

LittleMysSister · 06/10/2021 16:28

@Tal45

Yes I would consider infidelity abusive. the definition of abuse is something cruel or violent and infidelity is cruel IMO. Agreeing to compromise on the other hand isn't abusive as it isn't cruel or violent.
Surely the cruelty has to be actually aimed at the person in question though? For something to be abusive it surely needs to be deliberately focused on hurting that other person.

With infidelity, it's a selfish act that people commit with only their own feelings in mind (usually). It's just that it hurts someone else in the process.

Theoldprospector · 06/10/2021 16:29

‘Yes for many reasons, one being that in many cases the partner is still having sex with the wayward spouse/partner completely oblivious to the fact that they're going with other people and putting their sexual health at risk.’

By that definition, anyone who enters into a relationship without first having an std test is an abuser.

I didn’t have an std test before I got married.

PicsInRed · 06/10/2021 16:31

Like many abusive behaviours, the act of cheating is often part of a pattern of intentionally abusive, controlling, punishing and crazy making behaviour. Lundy Bancroft covers this type in his book on domestic abuse, "Why Does He Do That". YANBU.

Theoldprospector · 06/10/2021 16:35

‘Like many abusive behaviours, the act of cheating is often part of a pattern of intentionally abusive, controlling, punishing and crazy making behaviour. Lundy Bancroft covers this type in his book on domestic abuse, "Why Does He Do That". YANBU.’

Many things which are not abusive on their own become abuse when they are part of a pattern of behaviour which targets an individual.

Texting someone, parking outside their house, turning up late at your kid’s school, asking what time your spouse is getting home, having an argument, disagreeing about finances etc etc.

DrSbaitso · 06/10/2021 16:39

@Infidelitydiscussion

In many cases, the partner doesn't know anything about it and is perfectly happy. Is that cruel?

Yes for many reasons, one being that in many cases the partner is still having sex with the wayward spouse/partner completely oblivious to the fact that they're going with other people and putting their sexual health at risk.

And if they're taking precautions and both clean?
Winniemarysarah · 06/10/2021 16:41

@DrSbaitso

If actually having an affair is inherently abusive, then presumably we need legal protection against it. Can we really make it an offence in law?
It was a while back now but I’ve put on here before that I think cheating should be illegal, I got absolutely torn apart. The majority of the people were commenting about 3rd world/inhumane countries where women get stoned to death for the mere suggestion of them committing adultery. Of course that’s not what I meant at all! I did have a google out of interest and there are countries where cheating is punishable by law. A fair trial is held and punishments can vary from fines to a prison sentence. I agree with this after being cheated on and having an std passed to me during a time that I was breastfeeding our newborn. I’ve been raped before, but would hand on heart willingly go through that again rather than have to sit in a hospital room getting me and my newborn baby screened for stds after having my world blown apart by the person I loved the most. How can this not be a crime?
lululu16 · 06/10/2021 16:45

Hmm yes abusive.
I would not consent to having sex with my husband if knew he was having sex with someone else (from an sti and health point of view). He knows this and if he went against it then that is not only him knowingly affecting my mental health but also would feel physically violated.
I compare it to if a guy removes a condom during sex which the woman does not consent to happening.

2boysDad · 06/10/2021 16:48

No business of the state to go shoving it's nose into people's private lives.

Cheating is usually wrong but human beings aren't perfect and mumsnet isn't the real world. Most (not all) people cheat at some point in their lives. We're going to need a lot of prisons to lock them all up. I wonder who will be left to guard them?

Being cheated on. getting dumped, getting unfairly fired and falling out with family/close friends...... All bad stuff that adults have to deal with, it's just the reality of human nature.

DrSbaitso · 06/10/2021 18:24

It was a while back now but I’ve put on here before that I think cheating should be illegal, I got absolutely torn apart. The majority of the people were commenting about 3rd world/inhumane countries where women get stoned to death for the mere suggestion of them committing adultery. Of course that’s not what I meant at all! I did have a google out of interest and there are countries where cheating is punishable by law. A fair trial is held and punishments can vary from fines to a prison sentence. I agree with this after being cheated on and having an std passed to me during a time that I was breastfeeding our newborn. I’ve been raped before, but would hand on heart willingly go through that again rather than have to sit in a hospital room getting me and my newborn baby screened for stds after having my world blown apart by the person I loved the most. How can this not be a crime?

I am truly sorry for everything you've been through, but it still absolutely shouldn't be a crime. You mention the case of women being stoned as not being what you meant, but this is exactly what it means to criminalise consensual adult sex and make it a matter for state intervention and legal punishment. I don't know what countries you found that criminalise it, but I'll bet anything women don't do well there. States that legally enforce personal sexual ethics are not liberal, after all. There are all sorts of other problems. What about women in abusive relationships who find solace or strength elsewhere and the husband continues his abuse by prosecuting? What else do we criminalise if our criteria is "dishonourable, potentially marriage ending behaviour"? Refusing to have sex? Do emotional affairs count? Physical affairs that never involved a sex act that could pass on an STD?

The idea that the state could fine or imprison me for having consensual sex is backward, regressive and downright dangerous, especially for women. The state must not own your body.

flippertyop · 06/10/2021 18:24

Absolutely YANBU

DrSbaitso · 06/10/2021 18:25

Also, if adultery became a crime, nobody would get married any more. I wouldn't on principle. And then how do lower earning, child raising partners get their protection?

HuckleberryJam · 06/10/2021 18:25

Yes definitely

PicsInRed · 06/10/2021 18:31

@DrSbaitso

Also, if adultery became a crime, nobody would get married any more. I wouldn't on principle. And then how do lower earning, child raising partners get their protection?
If you don't like the contract don't sign it. Don't marry if you intend to have a one sided open marriage. If you want an open marriage, do it with a partner who is also living that lifestyle.

HTH.

I wonder if all these "oh, be nice" types would be so forgiving if the other party to any other contract decided to tear it up unilaterally? No, they'd lawyer up and head to court. I don't think it should be illegal, but it should certainly be despised for the selfish hurt and often permanent life changing harm it causes to innocent parties.