Extinction Rebellion co-founder says he would block an ambulance carrying a dying patient

[sst1234]

How can anyone support this bunch of nasty idiots who are willing to commit what can only be described as murder. How can anyone justify this? Imagine how you would feel it was one of you family members in that ambulance, this man would not hesitate to cause their death.

Most people are SELFISH and would prioritize their kid over humanity. We need people willing to risk being beaten to a pulp or going to prison; people willing to make huge self-sacrifices for the greater good.

If they actually believed in this, they'd be bombing refineries, power stations, picking up guns and putting their lives on the line. But no: they only want other people too for for their beliefs, while they get the protections of the justice system.

I'd still despise them for their violent crimes, but at least I'd believe they possessed genuine conviction in their beliefs. I certainly don't believe it of these privileged, performative wankers.

If you are being blue lighted in an ambulance I’d say every second counts. Let alone if a fire truck is sitting in traffic waiting for the protestors to be unglued...

I know, Kitten, and it's why I also mentioned this

I liked being reminded of the "blue steam" we were all supposed to disappear in though - I always thought it a pretty way to go, but admit I wondered why it should be blue and whether a spangled violet or something wouldn't have been nicer

@PurpleParrotfish

But when Extinction Rebellion block roads they do let ambulances through. It’s a huge diverse group of people and I think pretty much all of them would be shocked by RH’s statement as well. Whatever you think of their tactics of causing inconvenience to draw attention to the fact we are fucking up our planet’s life support system, they are not signed up to kill people. I know RH is one of the founders but he should have been booted out of XR when he went to Germany and trivialised the Holocaust. By the way, Insulate Britain, the M25 lot, are a different group.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/extinction-rebellion-ambulance-addenbrookes-hospital-16741207.amp

XR do not always let ambulances through. Just because it wasn’t a blue light situation at that moment doesn’t mean it wouldn’t have become a blue light situation, and forcing them to go the long way around could have made all the difference in that scenario.

They just make me want to rip out the insulation in my house, which I presume is not the reaction they were hoping for.

Absolute psychopaths

@MephistophelesApprentice

Most people are SELFISH and would prioritize their kid over humanity. We need people willing to risk being beaten to a pulp or going to prison; people willing to make huge self-sacrifices for the greater good.

If they actually believed in this, they'd be bombing refineries, power stations, picking up guns and putting their lives on the line. But no: they only want other people too for for their beliefs, while they get the protections of the justice system.

I'd still despise them for their violent crimes, but at least I'd believe they possessed genuine conviction in their beliefs. I certainly don't believe it of these privileged, performative wankers.

I think they would start doing this if there’s no consequences for their current actions. Imo

I have zero support for them. Hopefully the law is changed and they can be removed and locked up

So to pose the question a different way - what action WOULD the majority support to raise awareness and stimulate action on climate change?

Most people are SELFISH and would prioritize their kid over humanity. We need people willing to risk being beaten to a pulp or going to prison; people willing to make huge self-sacrifices for the greater good

Ah yes, the screaming and stamping, "we've all got to do such-and-such NOW!!!" mentality.
I've chaired so many meetings with people like this, all of whom say the same things - but come the day when something actually has to be done which requires effort they're nowhere to be seen - especially if the weather's poor

Funny, isn't it, that ER and their associated rabble are seen much less in the winter? Presumably it's no fun banging drums and glueing themselves to things in the rain and slush ...

@sst1234

How can anyone support this bunch of nasty idiots who are willing to commit what can only be described as murder. How can anyone justify this? Imagine how you would feel it was one of you family members in that ambulance, this man would not hesitate to cause their death.

They're going on the data OP, that our grandchildren could be living through hell because of current irreversible environmental damage. Still noone is really doing anything. That data holds and it's so frightening. Our generation won't suffer though, not like the next generations, and he's thinking about that - desperate changes are needed now, to protect future generations.

If he can feel that way about people that don't exist yet, he's clearly an empathy filled person that cares about others, but feels like people now need to be forced to change. Of course he isn't a psycho who wants to stop ill people get to hospital.

It's just a sad situation all round but data is very frightening and extreme action is needed. Governments can act but they don't, they're the real enemies here. Ext Reb are forcing change because they feel they have no other option. That's not going to be comfortable.

@katnyps

So to pose the question a different way - what action WOULD the majority support to raise awareness and stimulate action on climate change?

I am not sure you can say we need more awareness - climate change is pumped out of the media every single day.

What might help though is honest debate and not the ideological virtue signaling hypocritical unrealistic dogma that surrounds it at the moment.

That data holds and it's so frightening

This is the sort of statement that turns me right off. The data is often cherry-picked, exaggerated and is always presented as Fact.

It definitely has an ideology vibe not a science vibe.

One of the problems with XR is that they don't believe in hierarchical structures so any idiot can claim to speak for them.

I feel I'm in a minority on here as I do think that some targeted disruption is justifiable if it gets people to focus on climate change. Simply signing petitions and asking people nicely is achieving feck all. However, there's a balance to be struck as once you start alienating the general public to this extent it's counter-productive.

It's worth remembering that the Sufragettes weren't generally popular either and that people would point to the disruption they caused as evidence that women shouldn't have the vote. Being amenable doesn't change the world.

doing a crime to protest against another crime
This is not a reasonable protest but - as pp stated - terrorism
There was a one chap who was an insulation installer who was held up in an earlier blockage! The irony he had to cancel his installations for that day!
Imagine the amount of pollution caused by this stalled traffic - hospital or other clinical or care staff being held up from going to work. personal stories of people trying to get to families for many urgent reasons. Ambulances going to individuals in danger or taking them to hospital. Fire engines or police. people being held up from attending much waited appointments - dc being transported to school or school based journeys. & trucks
People are naturally wary of using transport systems (old friend covid) & many of these journeys can not be done by public transport anyway
To discount causing death or injury caused directly by their actions is amoral - even if they claim their action might (really?) save millions.
No they won't - they are not doing some ethics experiment of balancing family members against stopping a train crash -because their actions are actually antagonising people & not helping their cause in the slightest.

hamstersarse what needs to be debated and if there was to be such a debate how would you engage, what platform would you expect to see it on and what would be required for you to take action as a result?

@tenredthings

ER are doing everything they can to get climate change in the front of peoples thoughts. Climate Change is a huge tsunami approaching us and people don't want to look at it. We are running out of time !

The ambulance comment is straight out of the Trump schoolbook of what the fuckery. Say something super controversial and outrageous, everyone talks about it in an outraged manner but the core message Climate Change will hopefully enter people's consciousness enough to promote the action needed. The fact is the protesters do get out of the way of ambulances. Their goal is to promote change. Being outrageous gets media coverage and sometimes negative coverage gets the core message out there faster.

But they haven't been getting out of the way for ambulances though that's why the general public had to manhandle them to move yesterday.

Jumper yeah I know what you mean. I struggle to see how any of us can really be persuaded to take action though - what would actually get people to change their behaviour? The climate debate is all about making it someone else's problem "no point me doing anything when corporations aren't" and "well I didn't have any kids so I can go on long haul holidays 3 times a year and drive the 5 minutes to the shops every day in my petrol car"

If he can feel that way about people that don't exist yet, he's clearly an empathy filled person that cares about others, but feels like people now need to be forced to change.

@Polkadots2021 Nope. He’s a selfish cunt.

I hope they don’t get what they want, and I will deliberately do everything I can to enable that. I won’t be changing for the likes of them.

This is how you alienate people.

It's worth remembering that the Sufragettes weren't generally popular either ...

Worth remembering too that it wasn't their screaming and stamping which got women the vote in the end, much as it's pretended it was

That was down to the war, when afterwards it came to be appreciated that a group who'd done so much really couldn't be refused the vote any longer

I think it's actually convenient for people to have a hateable figure - it is an excuse to ignore the whole issue... though I hope most of the responses on here are just facetious

@katnyps and how are they helping exactly?!

@katnyps

So to pose the question a different way - what action WOULD the majority support to raise awareness and stimulate action on climate change?

To be brutally honest, I think a tick mark and note of “done to death” can be put by “raise awareness” and for “stimulate action” I would advise looking for real gaps between what is being done and what can be done and start petitions, draft legislation, lobby MPs.

For example,
The U.K. Government has a goal of banning petrol and diesel cars by 2030. Simultaneously U.K. Government is pushing the construction of new housing developments to address the housing crisis. Yet none of the developers are required to build these homes with charging sockets/charging stations. Nor is there any government effort to retrofit electric charging sockets or stations for older homes, especially those that only have on street parking. So my advice is look at the Government goals to combat climate change and start finding and addressing the pitfalls that will prevent this goal from being a reality.

Another example, is not to blindly assume investment in fossil fuel based companies is investment into using more fossil fuels. XR has criticised London for investing billions in “carbon polluters” such as Maersk. Maersk has largest fleet of cargo ships in the world, so yes they are currently carbon polluters. But do you know why £1.3bn was invested in them? To convert their entire fleet of cargo ships to carbon zero ships. XR also protested the British Museum for allowing Shell to contribute to its exhibits, they assumed all Shell does is sell petrol. But Shell is also a world leader in bio-fuels and developing carbon zero aircraft. Many many companies are in fact going green, and protesters need to let go of old prejudices and actually do their research before kicking up a fuss.

livpool just to clarify I'm not an XR supporter - I could actually lose my job for being a member (small print of the ethics policy I had to sign recently! something about not being a member of any organisation opposed to the core business of the company). I also don't agree with stopping ambulances. BUT I'm not sure who's having the alternative, well-mannered debate that people are actually listening to? That debate exists - and the rational arguments to support it - but sadly mostly aren't sitting around reading the latest IPCC reports...

Whatever our different views on what he said, not caring about the environment is no longer an option.

It simply is too late now for choice. May be what this man said was outrageous and awful, may be he did do harm to the public perception of ER and IB, may be he is scum or any of the other words used, may be it has forced the government to put in stronger measures to combat direct action. May be. May be not.

The fact is drastic action needs to be taken. There is no longer any choice and using it to negate our own individual responsibility is just pointless. Cutting your nose off to spite your own face comes to mind. I understand the outrage and anger but not the ‘so to hell with it’ attitude of some PP

For DECADES there has been peaceful, polite, measured and responsible campaigning but governments have not listened. Instead, they have tied themselves closely to the very industries that cause the most harm.

If after decades of awareness raising, campaigning and educating, after you g people took to the streets to plead for us to do something, our leaders are still not taking the drastic action needed, then there is a moral imperative to take direct action (that has minimum risk of harm to others).

The current direct action, at times may have crossed a line, I don’t know the facts, but direct action is now the only course of action - everything else has been tried and we are in an emergency situation.

They're going on the data OP, that our grandchildren could be living through hell because of current irreversible environmental damage. Still noone is really doing anything. That data holds and it's so frightening. Our generation won't suffer though, not like the next generations, and he's thinking about that - desperate changes are needed now, to protect future generations

A lot of the science is very uncertain and it’s disingenuous to imply otherwise. For some of the climate models, it’s really garbage-in-garbage-out. Yes, the earth is warming, but how that’s going to affect our environment is really very uncertain.

I’m not willing to put people in poverty over these uncertainties.

If he can feel that way about people that don't exist yet, he's clearly an empathy filled person that cares about others, but feels like people now need to be forced to change. Of course he isn't a psycho who wants to stop ill people get to hospital

He doesn’t care about others. Oh sure he cares about some innocent, idealised other, but not real-life people and their very real problems.

Governments can act but they don't, they're the real enemies here.

Then why aren't they attacking the government instead of the public?

Oh yeah, because that would involve genuine danger and sacrifice, rather than being roughly manhandled out of the way.

Lazy, pathetic cowards, lying to reach other and themselves about their bravery.

If they stuck themselves to a ministers car, I'd find that hilarious! I'd applaud! Or an oil executive, or a banker. But no, they'd rather punish the powerless like the ideological bullies they really are.