To think it’s unfair single-sex schools aren’t an option for many (perhaps even most)?

[patienceandprudence]

I have one single sex state school (and in fact there is only one private) in my county. It is in the county town, which we are not in the catchment for. It would take an hour and half to get to by public transport anyway.

Since it has been proven many times over that girls do better in single sex schools, why on earth aren’t there more options for those of us not in 11+ counties? I think it’s a great shame, and it doesn’t seem to be a thing that’s even being thought about.

@worriedatthemoment I'm interested to know the stats too - it's a key point.

@SusannaM so your one friend means thats what happens is it ? So I assume your friend has then reported these conversations ? As that is what she is doing
Forward as in discussing they will be getting xyz boy and don't care he has a girlfriend or isn't interested etc, they will do xyz at the weekend, im sure you understand what the word forward is

@Rugsofhonour send I g child to a school where they will not be a minority is completely different ending then to a strictly all black or all white or all girls school out of fear of what the opposing group might do to corrupt them.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@aSofaNearYou that isn't what the poster said at all
All the girls i know care more about what other girls think of there clothes / hair than the boys -
Infact recently at my ds birthday a girl attended in a very short dress , it was middle age relatives who had a problem with her dress rather than any of the boys who commented , many of the middle age ones said it was inappropriate, too short etc and when my ds said why ? Its her body her dress , if she feels good in it why do you care ? They didn't have an answer[/quote]
Yes, but they're not doing it in a vacuum. Many women and girls perpetuate ideas that still ultimately come from the patriarchal, sexist society they were raised in. This is one of the reasons I think growing up away from boys can be beneficial.

Young boys are not responsible for this, I am not saying they are. But it's about the effect, not the cause, people do not need to get up in arms like people are accusing their precious sons of something.

@postingfortraffichere you can't seem to get them same as you can get stats for sexual assault agains women/ men but not committed by who percentage
Well not easily
Its just yes I will take offence that some see my sons as automatically rapists or murderers just because their boys because statistically more men do commit crimes , no doubting that but there are also many that simply don't portray that behaviour

[quote worriedatthemoment]@postingfortraffichere you can't seem to get them same as you can get stats for sexual assault agains women/ men but not committed by who percentage
Well not easily
Its just yes I will take offence that some see my sons as automatically rapists or murderers just because their boys because statistically more men do commit crimes , no doubting that but there are also many that simply don't portray that behaviour[/quote]
Yes and you silence rational discussion about the sexism women face by doing so. Nobody is accusing your son of anything. Nobody knows your son. People should be able to discuss sexism by men without you jumping to the conclusion that they mean your son specifically. It is an important discussion.

It's not just the sexual assault though. It's just the constantness of the low level harassment. The boys who comment on girls looks, bang on the girls toilet doors, pull Tampax out of their bags, talk loudly about sex, make comments if a girl needs to go to the toilet in lesson time. Pulling on brastraps, looking up skirts, making gestures. Even the boys who wouldn't do any of this, but will laugh with the perpetrators.
It's just so wearing.

I went to an all girls catholic school and I hated it, I became a rebel as I didn’t want to be there. I much preferred the company of males and I still do.
It was bitchy, nasty and far too insular.

@worriedatthemoment I completely agree.

I'm also as other posters are suggesting not personally offended at all - I don't have sons. I don't have children! But I can still see how problematic some of the views on this thread are, I don't need children to see that.

@aSofaNearYou how can girla grow up completely away from boys
They have dads, brothers , uncles etc and if we go down the statistical route aren't more crimes committed by those we know
I would say all children are very different and some will benefit from all girls / boys and some mixed
I had chance to go to an all girls school years ago , I didn't as i knew some older girls and the bullying was rife from them so it wasn't for me, my co ed school I had no issues at so for me that was the right choice .
The reality is though as a country we cannot afford to have choice , only way would be all single sex schools as years ago but then thats going backwards in my opinion

@SusannaM so your one friend means thats what happens is it ? So I assume your friend has then reported these conversations ? As that is what she is doing

Huh?

I hear it from my DD and her friends. I hear it from my friend. I hear it with my own ears when I have to get the bus with schoolboys.

DD has long since given up as it just makes her a target and teachers don't care about the low level stuff, in fact they didn't care about the bigger stuff until the police were involved. Friend pulls the kids up when she hears it. No way am I going to tackle a group of teenage boys.

I changed my DD to a girl's high school (private) this year. She loves it, lessons are quieter, she said she can leave her books on the desk and not come back to them being doodled on by boys. Girls ask questions without worries about being ridiculed. Girls are less distracted. She is being assessed for ASD at the moment and easily led so I feel she is safer in single sex environment. I have 2 other DDs in mixed schools and they are currently fine but would still consider single sex for them too if it comes up.
One of the reasons I moved her is that I found the boys in her school intimidating. It had a uniform but the uniform policy went out the window with covid and I just saw groups of boys with their hoodies up and masks on walking around in the gloom of winter. I mentioned it to the school to no real avail...

@SusannaM yet when I was at school some of the girls did some of these things to as they do now, they can be bitchy about things , take piss out of girls who don't have breasts yet etc
I split my trousers once unbeknown to me , boys were sat behind me and one of them whispered to my friend so I could cover up with my cardigan, i had wondered why earlier when i walked passed some girls they had sniggered , obviously they had seen the hole .
Again did your friend report those boys conversations as if underage etc would be a safeguarding concern

[quote worriedatthemoment]@aSofaNearYou how can girla grow up completely away from boys
They have dads, brothers , uncles etc and if we go down the statistical route aren't more crimes committed by those we know
I would say all children are very different and some will benefit from all girls / boys and some mixed
I had chance to go to an all girls school years ago , I didn't as i knew some older girls and the bullying was rife from them so it wasn't for me, my co ed school I had no issues at so for me that was the right choice .
The reality is though as a country we cannot afford to have choice , only way would be all single sex schools as years ago but then thats going backwards in my opinion [/quote]
I never said I wanted them to grow up totally away from boys or men, just that at least having their learning space away from all that, and in an environment less likely to normalise messages of boys being better/more important than girls, can be a good thing.

Yes there will be good schools and bad schools of both type, no doubt. I'm merely talking in abstract.

@SusannaM so you regularly hear schoolboys talking about hardcore porn all the time? Not my experience where I am.
Accusing teachers of also not caring ?
None of my teacher friends would tolerate this , maybe you do need to look at a different school for your dd if her school is ignoring all this behaviour and report them to ofsted as well , so they take action

My DDs are at a single sex school, it’s non negotiable for us. I think every child should have the option of single sex school.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@SusannaM so you regularly hear schoolboys talking about hardcore porn all the time? Not my experience where I am.
Accusing teachers of also not caring ?
None of my teacher friends would tolerate this , maybe you do need to look at a different school for your dd if her school is ignoring all this behaviour and report them to ofsted as well , so they take action [/quote]
Oh for God's sake, you cannot discount wider, societal trends and statistics with repeated retorts of "well my friends don't do this". These things happen, they are well known to be a serious issue, why do we have to keep defending even saying that they happen?

@worriedatthemoment

Often enough. But I'm done justifying to you.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@over2021 statistically maybe not but there are some and they all seem to be rising, I have a right to not assume my son will be not be a murderer etc as well .
As statistically how many men are rapists , murderers ? I can find if the crimes how many are committed by men , which is high but not the percentage of men

As in is it 20% of all men commit a crime or 10% etc
[/quote]
You need to look at how many women get murdered, raped/sexually assaulted. 2.5 women get murdered a week

Although the prison system is good place to start. 18% of male prisoners are in their for sexual based crimes. even that figure is misleading though as we know how hard it is to get a conviction for rape and murder. ( just look at the high profile cases recently where men have strangled women to death but got away with it because they said it was sex same gone wrong) Although the allegations of rape have risen the conviction rate has fallen to a record low and there will be women who dont report at all. In the year to the end of March 2020, 58,856 cases of rape were recorded by police forces in England and Wales.
These led to just 2,102 prosecutions, compared with 3,043 in the previous 12 months. 56000 thousand allegations thrown out.

Now even if you argue a percentage of those allegations are false ( suspected at 4%) that's still over 50000 sexual assault victims left with out justice - A YEAR

Some ones sons are doing it.

@Evesgarden yes of course someones sons are , but I can read The stats like that what i can't find is that stat in men in total
As in 10% of all men , 20% of all men as some commit multiple crimes

@Evesgarden I am also as a mother entitled to not label my son without just cause on his behaviour as some are clearly advocating on here.

@funinthesun19 where do people think the money comes from to do this though realistically ?
We provide a state education in the uk thats it , if you live in an area that has one fine , some areas only have maybe 1 / w schools full stop in the area

That’s very true. My area has no same sex schools at all apart from one private one. There are plenty of state schools in my area, so you could argue that there isn’t a need for any more schools (including same sex ones) to be built and the council have done their bit.

Good idea on paper to some people to provide plenty of same sex schools. Not simple to just go ahead and do.

My (awful) exh said that he & his mates used to target girls who went to single sex schools because they were naive & inexperienced in dealing with boys 🤢
I think if girls don't have male siblings, it's valuable for them to attend co-ed.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Evesgarden I am also as a mother entitled to not label my son without just cause on his behaviour as some are clearly advocating on here.

[/quote]
Can you really not see what an enormous block you are putting to the feminist cause by refusing to allow people to discuss the statistics and trends around sexism perpetuated by males, because you feel upset that they MIGHT include your son in that? They're not talking about your bloody son! Jumping to that weirdly defensive conclusion is slowing down change that could improve things for girls and women, which is far more important than the vague possibility that somebody might be unduly wary of your son specifically.

Using publicly available statistics (ONS, BBC), 1.2m violent incidents a year in the UK (2020) 93% of them committed by males, 33m males, so about a 3.4% chance in the case of any particular male; although I've used total number of males (all ages) and the violent incidents is probably 18+, and no doubt there are serial offenders.

Equivalent figure for females 0.07 × 1.2m ÷ 33m = 0.3%.