Cultural appropriation...how bad is it?

[malificent7]

So Rhianna is under fire for braiding white model's hair. What if a black model wanted to straighten and bleach her hair?
I love african wax print fabric but don't want to be accused of cultural appropriation if i wear a bit of it. I also own sari fabric clothes.

Aibu to ask mn who may or may not be from different ethnic backgrounds would they consider Rhianna or my behaviour inappropriate and what constitutes real cultural appropriation?

This is not a racist thread as dd is mixed race.

To be honest it was bloody painful & I would have no desire to do this ever again.

@Funnylittlefloozie

How is wearing a cheong sam to prom "cultural appropriation "? That's the sort of thing that makes people roll their eyes in disgust

Well quite. It all rather smacks of "white saviour", the idea that people from other races can't speak for themselves.

@LookingGlassMilk

I've seen a post on facebook of someone with a tattoo in Irish, which they claimed said "you will always be in my heart", but actually said "An bhfuil cead agam dul go dtí an leithreas", which everyone in Ireland knows means "do I have permission to go to the toilet?".

That reminds me of the English couple who thought they'd name their house in Wales "Tŷ Bach" because it literally translates as "Little House".

Cute, eh?

Before indoor plumbing, if you said you were "going to the little house", where were you off to?

Yep, they'd basically named their house "Toilet".

[quote Chickenkatsu]I think that its gone a bit far, I don't see why Chinese people can't sell bubble tea:

www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/pt1tix/black_woman_accuses_a_bubble_tea_shop_of_stealing/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share[/quote]
Am I, as a white person allowed to drink bubble tea?

Wear what you want OP. People who whine about cultural appropriation are usually just pointless virtue signallers.

So many first world problems on this thread

Peri I had a similar experience with workmates from Nigeria offering and being insistent about doing hair. I felt bad declining as they seemed offended (ironically).

I’m a POC and I think cultural appropriation doesn’t exist. It’s one of those things that has unfortunately floated over from American politics due to social media. Bothers me whenever I see it— I remember the best lessons on other cultures we had as deprived kids in the middle of nowhere, Northern England where the ones where we got experience it ourselves. I don’t think a teacher would dare let children put bindi’s on their foreheads or do a haka (wasn’t there even something in the news recently about that?) but I remember those lessons vividly so many years on.

@mellicauli

Imagine going on holiday maybe to Russia or Argentina or some other country with a historically troubled relationship with the UK and finding everyone was wearing red velvet cloaks with fake fur, plastic replicas of the Queen's crown and carrying a plastic orb. It might not bother you that much as you are from a non-marginalised culture but you would still feel a bit misunderstood, cheapened, like they didn't really get where you came from and that they were treating your country like a joke.

That's cultural appropriation: a commodisation of someone's culture . It trivialises the culture, yet makes money out of it at the same time.

Personally I think a single wax headscarf bought for a fair price from a business owned by a PoC would be OK - but maybe not if lots of other people did it too.

Wow - this is a really poignant post. Very though proving.

I originally didn’t see the issues with wearing braids, despite reading all the posts, my mind didn’t change, until I stumbled on this. It’s definitely made me think…..

I'm a black woman and what annoys me more than anything is white people being offended on my behalf for things I wouldn't give a second thought to!

@TintinIsBack

Is there any POC on this thread who is saying they have an issue with while people wearing their clothes, braiding hair etc..?

I think so far I’ve seen people saying it was ok. (Unless I’ve missed a post)

Shall we listen to them instead of splitting hair in two between ourselves?

@TintinIsBack thank you. Someone is actually hearing us.

@patienceandprudence

I’m a POC and I think cultural appropriation doesn’t exist. It’s one of those things that has unfortunately floated over from American politics due to social media. Bothers me whenever I see it— I remember the best lessons on other cultures we had as deprived kids in the middle of nowhere, Northern England where the ones where we got experience it ourselves. I don’t think a teacher would dare let children put bindi’s on their foreheads or do a haka (wasn’t there even something in the news recently about that?) but I remember those lessons vividly so many years on.

This

@AveryGoodlay

I'm a black woman and what annoys me more than anything is white people being offended on my behalf for things I wouldn't give a second thought to!

Me too.

Not read all yet but my view is when a person from a non oppressed group takes an aspect of a culture from a group that has been oppressed and used this for personal gain (money or status) then that is culture appopriation.

For example... black women had their heads shaved by oppressors and their haor styles mocked. Someone using traditionally black styles but not using black expertise and experience or black models.

Sign language is a different example. Deaf people were baned from using sign language by hearing people and punished physically and mentally if caught. The languages survived by deaf people teaching and using the language in secret. Today many many deaf children are still denied access to this wonderful language. Yet we have non signers promoting themselves for likes on social media with other non signers saying wow amazing when often the signes are incorrect. Or we have makaton which creates monetry gain for tutors that have extrememly limited skill or knowledge. The creator or makaton who stole the signs from BSL while refusing to engage or communicate with deaf community experts. In creating the makatin they further restricted opportunities for deaf children many of whom continue to be denied access to a fully accessible language.

So yes culture appropriation exists. Which can causes awful consequences or further oppress minority groups. Most people are acting unaware of the damage they are doing.

@Redcart21

As a POC, I love white people and other races enjoying my culture, wearing our clothes, eating our food (even if they anglicise it). It can only be a good thing for people to take interest in others cultures?

Absolutely this.

@Strawberrryfields

I can see why it may seem relevant to your post BUT someone’s child being mixed race doesn’t exclude them from being racist. I’m absolutely not suggesting that you are OP but that’s sadly not the case for everyone. To me, its along the same lines as “some of my best friends are black” comments which are not helpful.

Completely agree

@AveryGoodlay

I'm a black woman and what annoys me more than anything is white people being offended on my behalf for things I wouldn't give a second thought to!

Agree with this too

Just to add. If you want to learn about other cultures then learn from and buy items made by that culture.

Having read the full thread, I have come to the conclusion that if you are secure in your identity you aren’t really concerned about cultural appropriation.

Sign language is a different example.

Yeah, fucking bigots- learning sign language. How dare they speak to deaf people?

Am I, as a white person allowed to drink bubble tea?

Drinking any tea is racist. If you want to truly embrace diversity then avoid all contact with other cultures.

@donquixotedelamancha

That is not what i meant. Theres learning the language which is amazing when people actually learn. AND then the is appropriating the language when someone puts videos of themselves up or trys to teach others without knowing the language. And they are doing it wrong and passing on incorrect signs to others. Whilst getting comments from other non signers say 'ww you are amazing ive learnt so much'.
Imagine a non english speaker teaching people English wrong and imagine them getting higher wages and getting more praise than those teaching English correctly. Imagine your fluent English speaking child being corrected because by someone who heard this new incorrect version of English and things it is right.

Imagine going on holiday maybe to Russia or Argentina or some other country with a historically troubled relationship with the UK and finding everyone was wearing red velvet cloaks with fake fur, plastic replicas of the Queen's crown and carrying a plastic orb.

Bizarrely a small midwestern town ( USA) that was in recently had several cars with large decals of the Queen waving in the back window.
The first one so thought was odd, but I think we saw three in total.

As an aside I'm fine with people wearing tartan, I like sharing my culture.
Calling your dd MacKenzie is odd but harmless.

I wouldn't want to wear things I knew were upsetting people like Native American headdresses.

I'm West African and can agree that most instances of cultural appropriation are nonsense and used by some people to continue their trend of being offended by almost anything. BUT there are various instances that really do upset/annoy me.

1. "Creating" something that minorities have worn/used.eaten for years by misusing words/ingredients a la Jamie Oliver and his jerk rice.
2. Speaking about cultural things without having done the proper research and giving wrong information.
3. Selling culturally significant items as trinkets or fashion.
4. Repackaging/stealing products created by minorities and gaining money + fame.

So it's really not the wearing or eating different food that is the issue, it's being insensitive to it's origins and trying to make a fast buck out of it.

@strivingtosucceed

Yes really well explained

Cultural appropriation is something I try to avoid. Interestingly though none of my friends who are from other cultures actually care at all and think I’m a bit ridiculous.

I’m also not sure where cultural appropriation ends and cultural appreciation starts. It’s one of those things the media tell me is wrong so I just try to avoid (as wouldn’t set out to offend) but I can’t say I really understand it.