to think that the school nurse shouldn't have sent me this letter...

[emkana]

which has a programme in it how to deal with dd2's "bedwetting" WTF? She doesn't do "bedwetting", she's only 4.4 and still in pull-ups, which I thought was widely accepted as quite normal?

I tend to agree with moondog.

I tried night time training my ds2 at about 3.5 - lifting him at around 10/11pm - after a couple of weeks of changing sheets a couple of times a night (both before and after lifting) I put him back into pullups, he clearly wasn't ready

then at 4 we tried again - yes we had a few accidents again, but it tailed off after a few days and after about a week he was fine. He now hasn't wet himself for a couple of months (now 4.3)

He never had a dry pull up at night before training

I think there are a few children who can't be dry at night after 4 (more boys than girls) but I certainly don't think it is normal, and it certainly is no reason not to try and train them. It is infantilising putting a 4 or 5 yr old in night time nappies without even trying to train them to be dry at night IMO.

and hula an accident once a week is MUCH better than keeping her in a night nappy 7 days a week, don't you think? well you must do, because that is what you are doing. Which is quite right I think. Basically you are saying she is trained at night but has lapses - fine. But you are going the right way about it

Yes, it makes it much easier than using nappies, although we did have resulable Bedwetter things so not too bad. We have a couple of great bed mats from Mothercare. They go on top of the sheet, directly under the child - so if she does wet (which she did some time last night - nothing to drink bar water but did have a night terror about 9pm) it is only the mat nd PJ bottoms to wash.

I still don't class her as being dry at night as such as we have to control it so much - watching the drinks, etc.

Speaking as ancient frazzled crone whose (now `13) yr old ds seemed to take forever to be dry at night (4), pullups weren't invented then & I'm sure it was the unpleasantness of waking in a pool of wee that trained him. If they have a nappy or pullups on, they're not uncomfy, so don't wake up.

Sorry if am repeating other threads - far too long to read them all!

Emkana our paediatrician here told us one quarter of 4 yr olds are in nappies at night. Wait till aged 7 to even mention it.
As you know a German Kinderarzt is Always Right
(It is a wonderful practice actually)
On a different note:
Have just made the children Nuernberger Rostbratwurst with Bio-Kartoffelpuffer and home-made Kaisergemuese for lunch - mouth-watering oder was?

Sorry Minty but I disagree. I think you think you trained your dd but I think it was more that you encouraged her and she would probably have become dry at around the same time regardless of what you did.
My earliest child was almost 2yo when dry day and night. No training.
My eldest 2 were 5y+ and 9y+ before dry at night despite being dry during the day between 2y and 2.5y.
6 others dry day between 2y and 3y of age. Dry at night between 2y and 4y.
We generally had a rule that 3 dry nappies in a row we considered they could go without a nappy for bed. We didn't have to do anything else but wait until they were ready themselves. Obviously the 2 late ones we tried the methods mentioned here but to no avail and with hindsight I think they had no effect and just passed the time until the child was ready.

Mine were never bothered lying in a 'pool of wee' It didn't even wake them up. But they were upset when they discovered it in the morning.

my children didnt become dry at night until 8-9 years. it is a genetic thing, from ex's family.
cant believe the school nurse even commented about a 4 year old still wearing pullups!
my 4 yr old is also wearing them and I have no intention of worrying about it.

ps we had wiener schnitzel, kartoffel puree, gerostet kurbis und sauerkraut

Minty your limited knowledge and hands on experience shows through load and clear.

Stick to what you know.

mean LOUD and clear

I wet the bed until I was over 14 I think. It never woke me up. In retrospect I think it was a combination of 1) mental parents - constant arguing mentally abusive behaviour to each other and us. "0 being bullied at school probably due to victim vibe see above. 3) Threadworms which I never mentioned to my mum because I was too frightened having been shouted and threatened with going to the doctor due to bedwetting.

DD1 on the other hand spontaneously was dry at night when she potty trained at 2. I did use cloth nappies and realised I was taking of dry ones in the morning. After I realised probably after anout 4 days I stopped the night nappies and she has never had an accident. Absolutely nothing to do with me .

Juuule I'm MRsS as was btw

DD is not in nappies or pull up, she gets woken up when I go to bed and goes to the toilet but can still wake in the morning with a wet bed. I sometimes find her wet when I go to wake her and she then wakes distressed. She must sleep quite heavily as she doesn't realise the bed is wet till I wake her or she wakes in the morning.

She has asked recently if she can go back in pull ups so that I don't have to wash so many sheets.

She goes to the toilet before bed, she doesn't like fizzy drinks, and we le her drink as much as she likes until about two hours before bed as long as it is water.

juule - DS1 wasn't either - and it was more than a "pool" - it was absolutely sodden - he never woke, and was never upset in the morning either !

"Betwetting occurs on most nights in 15% of five year olds and is still a problem for up to 3% of 15 year olds"

and the "ERIC" website reckons that there are 1/2 million children aged 5-16 still regularly wetting the bed

I've just read all through the thread, and wanted to add my tuppenceworth.
There was a post earlier saying that if children were in real nappies they'd all be dry at night: um, have to disprove that one.
Ds is 4.5, wears tots bots size 2 and an extra large ME airflow over the top (that bit is for those of you who can't find real nappies to fit, these do fine, although my boy isn't huge for his age). He's sodden every night. On the nights when I've tried him without a nappy (even at his request) he's soaking by 11pm and distraught at the thought of having had an accident.
For info, we do all the things listed earlier, just as a matter of course.
Dd - dry at 2.4, day and night.
The more I talk about it to other playgroup / nursery mums, kids either seem to get dry on their own at the same time as they train during the day, or it seems to be nearer to 4 or 5, with a few people later still. I'm not going to stress about it until ds is at school.

One more piece of advice from someone who's been there, done that. Its probably only apt for older children who are motivated and capable of sufficient understanding.

Its to do some 'positive thinking' last thing before sleep. Wee (then count to 10 slowly and see if theres a bit more), get in bed and give messages to your brain to work on while you're asleep. (sort of like when you dont have an alarm clock and tell yourself you need to be awake at 7, it usually works for a lot of people).

"If I need to have a wee I WILL wake up and use the toilet"

"I CAN be dry"

that sort of thing.

What I'm not sure of is how well this works without an authoritative nurse telling the kid to do this and that it can work! I'm not sure if DD would have taken it seriously from me.

Hi MrsS Love the christmas name

Just realised I told a fib. One of mine, the youngest, is still in nappies at night at 4y6m. Soaked in the morning in a tots bots size 2 with ME wrap (Mistletoe's post reminded me). We are starting to get the occassional (very occassional) dry night now, though. Shows how concerned I am, I totally forgot Plenty of time yet.

I have one still in nappies (excluding DS1 that is) too.....but he's only 6 months old so I think we'll let him off

Will you stop talking about that yummy German food.

I do think it is rather funny that Moondog presents herself as the expert on getting a child dry at night, when it is one of her children who is actually dry, and she hasn't even tried yet with the other one. Who knows it might fail you know? FWIW, dd1 was reliably dry at barely 3 as well, doesn't make me an expert though.

I think the school nurse should send out a letter saying "normal at this age, but if you are concerned at a later date contact me or you could try this"

As I have had more children (and therefore had more experience of how children go the developmental phases very differently,) I've come to realise that I really know very little BUT that I have experience which I can use to 'help' others BUT also thatymy children are not their children.
All there ever are are pointers.
I really hate it when people have a couple of kids and then they know it all.
All they know are their own children

Well said Kitty

wow Kitty you are quite pleased with yourself aren't you
I did say that I thought there were children who wouldn't be dry after 4 or 5, but that was no reason not to try, NOT "all children can be dry at night until 4"

My point is that you don't have to wait until you have a dry night time nappies until you attempt to train, some children will pee in a nappy if you put them in one but be dry at night if you don't

try and read the posts before you get on your misplaced high horse

and I have got four children so not THAT limited

Minty I am nowhere near a horse let alone a high one.
I find that you come across as somewhat bossy that's all.

Really. So as a result of your personal prejudices gleaned from somewhere else on this board, you post a rather rude "Stick to what you know" in response to a perfectly reasonable opinion, illustrated with a couple of examples of me (a) failing and then (b) managing to night train a child.

Nice.