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AIBU?

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Original poster

To ask why Wayne Couzens needs a defence barrister?

150 replies

HeartsAndClubs · 30/09/2021 10:28

Was just reading the BBC article about how he is due to be sentenced today, and they said that the judge will hand down the sentence after his defence barrister has spoken.

Thing is, he confessed to the murder, so it’s not as if this is a trial where guilt needs to be established and where he would be entitled to a defence to prove his innocence. So why does he need a defence barrister?

OP posts:
MsInsomniac · 30/09/2021 10:33

To provide mitigation against a possible whole life tariff and to argue for a lower tariff. A life sentence will be passed but the tariff before he can be considered for release for the parole board can be short up to never.

LateDecemberBackInLowB12 · 30/09/2021 10:34

I would think it would be to help him get a more lenient sentence and make excuses as to why he murdered her.

PinkFootstool · 30/09/2021 10:35

Everyone has the right to a proper defence. In this case, they have put forward what mitigation Couzens can come up with. Essentially they are just there as a mouthpiece.

I can guarantee they are not defending his actions, they are not trying to keep him out of jail, they are trying to do their job and mitigate. That's it.

Lockheart · 30/09/2021 10:36

@MsInsomniac

To provide mitigation against a possible whole life tariff and to argue for a lower tariff. A life sentence will be passed but the tariff before he can be considered for release for the parole board can be short up to never.
This. Defence barristers are there to test the prosecution's case and ensure that the sentence passed is appropriate.

They are not there to get their client off any charges.

Even those who confess to their crimes are entitled to a defence barrister to make sure their sentence is appropriate within the law and correctly handed down.

TheGrumpyGoat · 30/09/2021 10:37

To put forward his client’s case for the lowest possible sentence.

DameCelia · 30/09/2021 10:38

Even those who confess to their crimes are entitled to a defence barrister to make sure their sentence is appropriate within the law and correctly handed down.

This

DameCelia · 30/09/2021 10:40

Sentencing will be carried out within a range, the mitigation is to ensure consideration is given to all the factors which influence where in the range the sentence is set.

TheQueef · 30/09/2021 10:40

Hopefully his barrister is shit hot and doesn't leave any opportunity for this scum to appeal.
Much better that he receives a fair trial and appropriate sentence the first time so he doesn't have any grounds.

DocAutumn · 30/09/2021 10:42

Everybody needs legal protection.

Lockheart · 30/09/2021 10:42

@LateDecemberBackInLowB12

I would think it would be to help him get a more lenient sentence and make excuses as to why he murdered her.
That's an incredibly childish view of an essential part of our legal process.
Vanillaradio · 30/09/2021 10:43

Because in UK law everyone is entitled to someone to represent them and put forward their case. If someone (anyone for any offence) pleads Guilty the defence representative will put forward any mitigation like health issues, background etc. Its not about putting forward excuses as to why he murdered her- he did murder her and pleaded Guilty to that so he accepts the prosecution's case fully. It's about what sentence he should have now based on all the circumstances and the sentencing guidelines.

TokyoSushi · 30/09/2021 10:43

Yes agree, it's just to make sure that things are done correctly and the appropriate sentence is passed.

Matthew Thompson is providing excellent coverage on Twitter. Although just a warning that his thread is very harrowing. It does prove though that the defence lawyer is in no way trying to minimise what happened. Quote here:

Matthew Thompson
@mattuthompson
·
34m
Replying to
@mattuthompson
Couzens’ lawyer:

“Nothing I say today is at all intended to minimise the horror of what he did that night. He makes no excuses for his actions. He accepts that he deserves a severe punishment.

“No right minded person can feel anything other than revulsion for what he did.”

LaurieFairyCake · 30/09/2021 10:44

I hope he's got an excellent defence barrister - the very best

So that the conviction is very safe and that evil scumbag has much less room for manoeuvre for an appeal or a lower sentence

SpindleWorld · 30/09/2021 10:46

It's the protocol, as pp said ^^.

It will also head off any grounds for appealing the sentence in the future due to his not being properly represented today. It's good he's got a barrister. No excuses. I've a feeling he's going to get a whole life order, given the aggravating circumstances (hopefully).

It's going to hard to hear what a 'great dad' he is, though.

Normandy144 · 30/09/2021 10:46

Everyone is entitled to a defence lawyer even if they plead guilty. It's to ensure the sentence is appropriate etc. Can you imagine if we denied people a defence lawyer based on pleading guilty. That's a very slippery slope!

TokyoSushi · 30/09/2021 10:48

Apparently, sentencing is due at 11:30am for those interested.

gogohm · 30/09/2021 10:49

Everyone is entitled to a defence barrister. They could be asking for psychiatric assessment, vulnerability in some way etc so just about guilt

doublemonkey · 30/09/2021 10:52

I wouldn't worry about it. I don't think he'll see the light of day again.

Nomorepies · 30/09/2021 10:52

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on the poster's request

GoodnightGrandma · 30/09/2021 10:58

@doublemonkey

I wouldn't worry about it. I don't think he'll see the light of day again.
I don’t think he’ll be very popular in prison either.
InTheNightWeWillWish · 30/09/2021 10:58

Everyone is entitled to representation.

When you don’t have a defence barrister, or you have a poor defence barrister, is when people get through to appeal after appeal. As others have said, I hope he’s got the best defence barrister going and that he won’t spend the rest of his sentence appealing his conviction due to lack of representation and potentially having his sentence reduced.

NewlyGranny · 30/09/2021 10:59

Because that's how our legal system works! Representation isn't only for plaintiffs, it's for defendants, too.

Otherwise we'd soon be lynching people from lamp posts or burning them at the stake because we didn't like the look of them, wouldn't we?

AlfonsoTheDinosaur · 30/09/2021 10:59

There are excellent and informative responses on this thread. Thank you, everyone, who contributed light rather than heat.

zafferana · 30/09/2021 11:02

I really hope he gets a whole life tariff to protect women. If he's ever out on the streets again, they'll be in danger. He is completely without remorse. Terrifying individual.

Batinhernightdress · 30/09/2021 11:02

@Nomorepies

To provide mitigation on sentencing? To have advised him up to and including when he pleaded guilty?

Does this really warrant a thread? It's basic.

I don't understand how people get kicks out of patronising people.

No-one knows every answer and people should never fear asking questions. Some excellent answers have been posted up thread.