To feel I have utterly let down my children by sending then to a state school?

[hibbledibble]

I went to a private school, and achieved very well academically.

My children go to a state school, as I can't afford private school. I will never be able to afford it sadly. They go to the local community school, which has a reputation for not being academic.

My eldest is extremely bright, and tested many years ahead of her age on entering the local primary. Now, she has failed to even get to the second round of the 11+. She has really just coasted at school, as they have not set any appropriate work for her, despite multiple requests. They say they can't offer 'gifted and talented' provision, due to funding.

Her sibling is very behind on learning, as she missed loads of school due to lockdowns, and the school offered very little remote provision throughout most of the time. I have asked for support for her, but am told that nothing is available, again, due to funding. Meanwhile, she is struggling with even the basics.

I do think that both of my children would have done better, had they gone to a school where their individual abilities and learning stage was catered for, and they were helped to achieve their potential. I feel I have let them down by not providing them with a good education, which they could have had if I had the money.

Now it's looking likely my eldest will have to go to the terrible, and rough, local secondary, and the underachieving will continue.

Also the super selective grammars are the absolute most competitive, probably more competitive than getting into oxbridge in numbers per place applying etc.

Did you really not have a back up plan if they didn't pass?

In these areas almost everyone knows that you can't rely on getting a place so either 1. They explore private scholarships, take out second mortgage etc and go private. 2. Move away from the area to area with fantastic comprehensive schools, lots in the home counties. 3. Accept that child will go to local school

Leaving aside all the sniping, the issue is not state schools in general, but the state school your children are at.

Can you move them?

Invest in private tutoring for them?

It doesn’t have to be eton to get a good education.

@hibbledibble
Can I just ask you how do you know that your child failed her 11+ exam? I thought results are only will be available from the middle of October.?But I’m might be wrong.
Also if you need a good online tutor I could recommend someone just message me if you’d like her details.
Do you think your child just got bored at school being the class clown? Also if there is no funding for the school for children like her I’m sorry but there is nothing you can do. Hopefully secondary will be better equipped for her needs.
I know lots of children who went to private school and they did have good education and they are very successful in life. I also know someone who went to a good private school and when finished school went to work at McDonald’s. 🤷🏼‍♀️

@Macncheeseballs

Ajil46, weird how my state school kids have had many discussions with teachers about topics taught that day, or maybe it's because I've brought them up to be confident and curious

You're lucky your children's teacher can accommodate 35+ such discussions per day.

Re grammar school and the 11+ because Labour removed it from the hands of primary schools like back in the df day...

Who else is going to know about this test, 11+ etc? Get the dc prepared for it...

The parents.

My df had been in that system back then would never have gone because his parents were absolutely against it.

The Sutton Trust has out lined this as a specific issue and notes where primary schools offer more support to all 11+ candidates even through parent volunteers... More dc from all backgrounds can get into grammar.

Not exactly rocket science is it.

I thought results are only will be available from the middle of October.? First round 11+ results (into second round or not) came out last week for localish super-selectives.

I suspect OP was invested in her DD getting into a super-selective but now that's not happening she's faced with the stark reality that other parents have to face!!!

@Blanketsnpamphlets

“ Sorry but your daughter obviously isn’t that gifted and talented if she didn’t pass the 11+ …. a persons future is dependent on the work and effort they put in, not what school they attend.”

This. If you need to pay 15k a year to put your daughter through school to be a success she’s not as gifted as you think.

The vast majority of Russell group graduates are “just” state school. I really don’t understand this obsession with private school in real life.

How many of them were tutored through school or even to pass the 11+?

We live in a non grammar area with a couple of selective entry schools and then a school that has a handful of spaces for children outside their frankly tiny catchment area for academic excellence. The children who get those spaces have been tutored since at least year 4 but many have been tutored since Reception.

@NewModelArmyMayhem18

I thought results are only will be available from the middle of October.? First round 11+ results (into second round or not) came out last week for localish super-selectives.

Ah. That's for clarifying that. I've literally never encountered this 'second round' business.

The most in demand super-selectives not too far from us do operate a second round. I don't think it's the way the 11+ works in places like Bucks and Kent though!

[quote 5329871e]@Theendoftheworldisnigh
I've just checked online, and the MINIMUM pay for a GP, so the lowest doctor of the low, is £62K. You presumably earn well above that at your age.
I’m afraid this speaks to your ignorance. GPs are not “the lowest of the low”. Qualified GPs have worked for at least five years after medical school. In those first five years, the salary is much lower than £62K. If part-time, those first five years last much longer. If OP is doing a non-GP specialty, the training path is longer. E.g. for general hospital medicine, it takes 10 years full-time-equivalent to get to consultant.[/quote]
Are you part time? One of the reasons for shortage of doctors is that almost 50% of GPs are part time. So pro rata.

Everyone's children are in the same boat. Most of us send our kids to the local school. When our son did the 11+ we got him a tutor. He didn't make it by 8 points.
Tutor can be via zoom so Covid will be less of an issue.
The school isn't fully responsible for your children's results. It's a combination of both. I'll be looking closer to home and talk to the teachers about their progress.

Most people can't afford private school, but if the local School is under performing Then they move to a better catchment.

Op, you are where you are, and so there is no benefit in regretting things. What you need to do is think about the future and put your kids in the best place to succeed. Lots of suggestions about tutors and other enrichment activities that you can source for them. They should also take inspiration from you and what you have achieved. Other than that it is really up to them I'm afraid and I think you need to convey this message strongly to them. Private schools aren't all wonderful and there are plenty of stories of parents spending huge sums of money on fees only for their children to not achieve much. I attended a 'prestigious' independent school in the dim and distant past but then left at the age of 13 for the local state school which I much preferred. I still have friends from both schools and I can honestly say I would classify many of my inde school friends as under-achievers at school.

Prívate school don’t have to have qualified teachers.

For the level at which doctors function, for their hard work and skills, they can get paid over £100K in the private sector (or over 2-300K if lucky)

But very few would and the T&C in the private sector are a lot less attractive than public sector professional grades.

There are many jobs which attract none of the kudos and status of medice or public sector benefits and which also demand long hours of unpaid overtime on much lower salaries without the potential high earnings (topped up further by private work) in the longer term.

That isn't an argument to say doctors are overpaid but high earners bleating that they are hard done by because private school fees are out of reach when they have made no other plan will always sound tone deaf, especially in difficult times.

I paid a lot for my DD to go to a private school. She crashed out with severe mental health problems and is unlikely to go to university. I have no idea what she's going to do. She's limping through her final year of A'levels at a local college now, after repeating years 10 and 12. If she gets 3 Cs I'll be amazed, despite all of the amazing opportunities she had and world class education (the school was amazing).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you just don't know whether your DC would have been high achievers if they'd gone private. My DD found that the high achieving girls at her school ruined her self esteem and she just gave up, despite also being bright.

@Powertoyou

Prívate school don’t have to have qualified teachers.

Nor do all state funded schools since the changes made by Gove. Free schools certainly are not required to have qualified teachers and from memory academies have some exemptions as well (although not to the same extent).

I'm not trying to be mean, but lots of people think their children are "gifted" when they aren't really. Maybe your children aren't as gifted and talented as you feel they are, or aren't willing to work hard to achieve good grades. Which is OK, not everyone is cut out to be academic and lots of jobs don't require stellar grades.
Private school might hothouse them, but that still isn't a guarantee they'll do great.
I've never set foot in a private school and never had any tutoring, except English as a second language lessons. Went to a woefully underfunded school in a country often labelled a "shithole" on here...then went on to study at a UK uni with a mixture of state and private schooled kids. I always thought their parents had wasted all that money sending them to private school, only for these kids to end up at the same uni as the rest of us 'plebs'.

@LittleBearPad

The starting salary for a consultant in the NHS is £85K, ffs. That's about 3 times the average UK salary.

For a qualified doctor with numerous years of experience following lengthy university and medical school training. It’s in no way comparable to an average job on the average wage. What a bizarre assertion.

As for the scepticism about 2 stage 11-plus the grammar near me does this. And it’s not enough to ‘pass’ and there’s your place. You have to be the top 100 of the 1200 kids sitting.

OP I would consider moving to better schools. It’s not state schools as a whole but certainly yours doesn’t sound good. The lack of differentiation speaks to poor practice. It wouldn’t be the norm or acceptable in a good state school.

I didn't say that a consultant should earn the average wage. I pointed out that their hard work and experience is remunerated in that their starting salary is 3 times the average wage. 3 times - as in 1 person earns the same as 3 people, 3 people who are not badly paid (remember that the average wage takes into account top bankers, etc, and that the median wage will be considerably lower). How is that insignificant? Does it ever occur to you that other people are undervalued, when you sneer at a consultant's salary being only 3 times the average? Do you think that they're worth 6 or 7 times the average person? Why not think of it this way, if it helps: A new consultant makes £5K more than the British Prime Minister.

I can't afford private school. My daughter goes to a local state secondary. It's an ok school. DD is predicted 6-9s in GCSE. If I were to ensure she gets more 9s, I put in the effort at home. It's simple.

There's nothing wrong with state education as long as you put in some of the effort to support your children's learning as well.

My girls either went to, or currently attend, private schools. 3 different ones, as my girls are different! One is hating hers.
There's sadly no such thing as the perfect school OP, and private school is no guarantee of happiness or success.

I'm a Dr. I had a private education and I send my kids to state school. I am happy, they are happy and it's fine.

I don't believe in private education anyway. I arrogantly believe I would have succeeded without mine and that my kids will do the same.
Or maybe they won't succeed in absolute academic terms as well as I did and that will be OK too as long as they are happy.
My DH didn't get great A levels despite his private education but he has his own very successful creative business that he is happy with.

My older kids state secondary school doesn't make her do as much homework as it possibly might and my younger primary DC has got gaps in his learning due to Covid like everyone else.
So what. Their lives won't be ruined. They want for nothing. They have books and educational trips and discussions over dinner and all the benefits that middle class family life brings and they live in the real world and they can see how lucky they actually are.

The thing that's wrong is your attitude
You don't believe in state education. You would have sent them private if only you could afford it so you will never be happy with state.
Your kid didn't pass the 11+
Perhaps you didn't hothouse them enough or pay enough tutors to game the system
Ask yourself why you care? Its just another shitty divisive thing that shouldn't exist
Your child is just as intelligent as they were before they failed it.

Move to an area with decent comprehensive schools and just try to worry less about it all is my advice and then everyone can be happy

Why not think of it this way, if it helps: A new consultant makes £5K more than the British Prime Minister.

You’re thinking of the basic pay of an MP, which is about £81k.

The PM earns about £160k.

@Theendoftheworldisnigh it's a high wage.
However
Median (not average) UK full time salary is over £31k a year, so it's not 3x. It's significantly higher in London, and likely in other major cities also. And within that number there are bankers, but there are also a large majority of people who did not undertake 10-16 years or more of work and training after 5-6 years incurring student fees of over £9000 and all associated living costs. Most of those will also not be working hours that are far higher than average, and who have spent many years being required to move location frequently and work unsocial hours. Many of my family are doctors, and parents often end up working part time (and taking far longer to qualify, or dropping out before becoming a specialist), or have to pay for expensive childcare like nannies, because hours don't support nursery or after school care. It's also not easy to therefore be at home to do all the supplemental education that lots of posters on here think should be normal.

Being a doctor can still be a great job, but it's not as simple as saying that someone is privileged and should therefore be quiet.