We fecking told you so. Brexit making us suffer.

[flashbac]

Project Fear you said. Sunlit Uplands you said. Sovereignty you said. Can I buy food and heat my house with Sovereignty? Can I put sovereignty in my car's fuel tank? Can I?

It was common sense that this would happen. Common SENSE.

@EatSleepRantRepeat

If people had spent the last 5 years doing proper planning instead of batching and trying to overturn the result, recruiting and training British people in shortage jobs, and paying people decent wages in the first place we wouldn't be in such a mess. I'm not willing to live in a country which runs on exploiting poor Eastern Europeans and migrants because we won't pay the going rate for goods and services.

Working here was never 'exploitation' more of an opportunity for Eastern Europeans who struggle to find jobs in their own countries.

@EatSleepRantRepeat

If people had spent the last 5 years doing proper planning instead of batching and trying to overturn the result, recruiting and training British people in shortage jobs, and paying people decent wages in the first place we wouldn't be in such a mess. I'm not willing to live in a country which runs on exploiting poor Eastern Europeans and migrants because we won't pay the going rate for goods and services.

You’re a clueless clown. No one was exploiting Eastern European migrants they came here to work, earn good Money and then go home, creating a better life for themselves in the process.

Considering there is 1.9 million vaccines now with accute problems in care, hospitality, haulage the problem is going to get worse, why?

Because we are an ageing society, we will need more immigrants then ever.

We could of course also slash and burn the benefits system but still wouldn’t solve the problem.

Then you add in the pandemic. Which was also perfectly predicable given the government had been planning for it till they took they resources from it to plan for a no deal Brexit.

Sadly we have a country full of morons like you.

Absolutely OP. Brexiteers are getting what they wished for. Tossers.

The tories have already made a u turn on immigration. It anyone still thinks brexit was about raising wages and living conditions they are very deluded.
www.theguardian.com/business/2021/sep/24/supply-chain-crisis-tories-poised-turn-foreign-worker-visas?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

Things will continue to get worse. I know a few vociferously pro-Brexit people IRL. Whenever anyone tried to warn them of consequences they screamed Project Fear’. They weren’t lied to, they wanted to hear what they wanted to hear.

Things have changed since then. One pretends the current issues aren’t linked to Brexit. Another one is trying to rewrite history and say they were against Brexit all along.

I wish to God there was some way that only Brexit voters paid the ‘price worth paying’.

While Brexit is most definitely a factor, read up on the IR 35 reforms and lorry drivers. That's something no one is talking about and this is the primary reason why the lorry drivers are not continuing to work. Hopefully Rishi can stop the madness.

@Pokhora,

Whether it was ‘about’ raising wages, that is certainly happening. Now, no one will conclude firmly that it will continue, but many sceptical journals are at least admitting it is a possibility.

cebr.com/reports/the-times-labour-shortage-is-forcing-pay-up-but-how-long-can-it-last/

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-wages-hospitality-retail-pandemic-b1890591.html%3famp

Were none of the many, many existing threads on this very subject good enough?

Nope

@EatSleepRantRepeat

If people had spent the last 5 years doing proper planning instead of batching and trying to overturn the result, recruiting and training British people in shortage jobs, and paying people decent wages in the first place we wouldn't be in such a mess. I'm not willing to live in a country which runs on exploiting poor Eastern Europeans and migrants because we won't pay the going rate for goods and services.

"People"? You mean the people who voted in the idiots who bore heavy responsibility for Brexit in the first place? Or do you mean those idiots. They are, after all, the people who said Brexit would all be wonderful and who had responsibility for the necessary planning.

@P0ntiacBandit

While Brexit is most definitely a factor, read up on the IR 35 reforms and lorry drivers. That's something no one is talking about and this is the primary reason why the lorry drivers are not continuing to work. Hopefully Rishi can stop the madness.

IR35 does make things fairer in other sectors though so I don't think it's all bad (aside from those who pay more tax now of course), but yes it should have been better considered in regards to sectors such as this where it made up for inadequate pay.

I'm not British but always supported remain as I have family in the UK and couldn't understand why Britain will damage itself for no reason leaving the EU.

Having said this, I think it's pointless talking about Brexit anymore. It's done. The majority voted for it and gave a clear majority to the government you have now.

I don't think doing a U turn granting haulage visas is not going to solve the problem for the UK thou. Truck drivers are very sought after in the EU and prices are competitive. Few want to come back to the UK, they'll need to be paid 3 times as much to do so which then will be passed on consumers. Dover is a serious problem for truck drivers coming back to Europe with cargo. Lots of paperwork, delays and awful conditions with few dirty toilets. UK government/s need to begin solving problems instead of trying to reverse Brexit decisions that are conductive nowhere.

Having said this, I think it's pointless talking about Brexit anymore. It's done. The majority voted for it and gave a clear majority to the government you have now

Brexit is not done. Brexit will take years to be “done” and can be “done” in different ways.

[quote TheReluctantPhoenix]@Iggly,

I don’t think anyone (with half a brain) believed that, in the short term, which could be a decade, frictional costs of Brexit would not outweigh benefits.

However, being in the EU allowed us to mismanage everything important to an ongoing stable society (fair pay, education etc). We could cover over the cracks with our infinite supply of cheap Eastern European labour, regardless of the cracks to the fabric of society.

If the EU just consisted of the original Northern European members, I could buy into it, as there was, broadly, equality of income, law etc.

When you see pay and conditions being forced up for crop pickers, lorry drivers etc, I see this as a Brexit benefit. And not having infinite choice in Waitrose every time I shop there is a very small price to pay.[/quote]
@thereluctantphoenix

Immediate benefit was exactly what people were promised and what swung the vote for leave. Saying anyone with half a brain knew it would result in a decade of misery is equivalent to admitting most brexit promises were lies.

'Being in the EU allowed us to mismanage' is an amazing bit of mental gymnastics. We might have been running the economy on poor principles and failing to invest in education and training enough. If we mismanaged within the EU, why would we suddenly become better outside of it? It was the shitty choice of our own politicians. Nothing to do with the EU. We could have delayed freedom of movement for newly joined countries and then applied the limitations other countries have so people return after three months if not in employment. We chose not to.

It's not about having infinite choice in Waitrose. That's absolutely dismissive. Food shortages mean some people will go hungry because prices rise. Brexit will cause people to go hungry.

Brexit will cause people to go hungry.

The government have been doing this for years, dressing it up as Brexit will just make them say well people voted for this. Let's hold them primarily responsible.

@EatYourVegetables

It would be great if there was a way to find out what exactly was to blame and in what proportions...

How do I attach a picture of BoJo?

I mean, he handled both Brexit AND the pandemic. Did such a great job. I’m sure we’ll all vote for him again 🙄

I will I think his done a great job. We had the best vaccine rollout in the world and if we didn't have brexit we wouldn't even have been able to get the vaccine because we were governed by the eu so we would all be well and truly screwed !

@alondra it's not done. The Tories are acting like the vote gave them a mandate for a whole swathe of things that will include deregulation, free trade agreements that flood the market with inferior products etc.

People were told by almost all brexiters that we would stay in the common market and very little would change beyond being able to make deals with other countries and curb immigration.

Brexit is not done. Brexit will take years to be “done” and can be “done” in different ways

Brexit is done for the EU. They had enough of difficult negotiations and couldn't wait until it was over. EU has moved on, UK should do the same.

@EnidFrighten,

We will have to manage our economy better out of necessity.

In the same way the German economic miracle happened because of, not in spite of, a strong Deutschmark.

Since the Euro has been held artificially low (from a German perspective), they have had far more flexibility to not innovate as much.

@Beapot

Brexit will cause people to go hungry.

The government have been doing this for years, dressing it up as Brexit will just make them say well people voted for this. Let's hold them primarily responsible.

Sure, there was already an issue with people being on such low incomes they couldn't afford food. Brexit makes it worse.

There is no shortage of fuel, BP are trying to manipulate things. Get a grip 🇬🇧

Can anyone name another European country currently experiencing food and fuel shortages, or soaring energy prices?

Anyone?

Though, I don't think it's entirely down to Brexit. It's also a direct result of the appalling decisions made by a government that consists of those that were chosen for their Brexit ideology rather than their competency, voted in overwhelmingly by Brexit voters.

[quote TheReluctantPhoenix]@EnidFrighten,

We will have to manage our economy better out of necessity.

In the same way the German economic miracle happened because of, not in spite of, a strong Deutschmark.

Since the Euro has been held artificially low (from a German perspective), they have had far more flexibility to not innovate as much.[/quote]
@reluctantphoenix I think that might be exceptionalism - you're assuming that somehow we will do well out of this because we're Britain. The economic miracle was just that, long term decline is what happens to many countries that make dumb decisions.

There is very little overall food inflation. And no more since Brexit (see attached chart).

Certain sectors (predominantly luxury foods) have seen spikes.

Saying people will go hungry due to Brexit is not an evidenced claim.

tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/food-inflation

@KingdomScrolls

A friend of my husband's drives a tanker for a living. He said there are no fewer tankers going out this week than there have been usually, the media is causing the issue. The company who said they have a shortage of drivers, Hoyer, made a third of drivers redundant during Covid and now wonder why they won't go back.

I didn't vote for Brexit btw, but it's more complex than that.

Unfortunately many people will ignore the truth like this and carry on with the blame brexit game.

@Skyla2005

"I will I think his done a great job. We had the best vaccine rollout in the world and if we didn't have brexit we wouldn't even have been able to get the vaccine because we were governed by the eu so we would all be well and truly screwed !"

Best vaccine rollout in the world you say?