To think you as a parent are responsible for your child’s education.

[washingmachines4]

To think you as a parent are responsible for your child’s education.

I have always considered myself the primary educator of my child, manners, shapes, ABC, 123, speech, reading and over time that evolves into fractions, telling the time and so forth. I view any education at school as a bonus, to my mind I want them socialising and learning how to interact with others well when they are there. There are times I have failed, my husband and I said we were going to be a multilingual family and bring up our kids with English, Spanish and Chinese – we didn’t learn Spanish and Chinese so fell at that hurdle.
That said, I wouldn’t consider allowing them to go to any old school, before we had children we moved house and one of the criteria for me was that we were in a catchment for multiple good schools. Things can change, we could have got unlucky, in the 5 years after moving before they started school they all could have gone downhill, unlikely but possible, in which case we would have moved again. An acquaintance of mine says this is insane but will always justify sending her kid to the closest school rather than moving to be near the best school for her kid. She also thinks the school is to blame that her child failed the national phonics test in year 1 – she has never once read with her kid, ‘that is the teachers job’ and actively discourages him from reading – makes comments he wants to feel better than others, brainbox – proper nightmare Matilda’s parents style. She is an extreme example but the responsibility is ours right? (For reference, I work full time but try and make learning as time efficient/fun as possible – eg. Got a CD of all the times tables in a song to put in the car so whenever we travel to do something we sing the song of the times tables they are learning that week) etc.

As both a parent and a teacher, I'd say that the ideal way is in the middle.

Before children start school, parents are the primary teachers as well as the primary carers. I think that they should talk to their children (from when they are babies, not wait until they can talk themselves), teach them self help and self care skills (toileting, how to brush their teeth, dressing and undressing, use of cutlery), teach them social skills (sharing, taking turns, how to ask if they need help, being able to wait a few moments for attention if an adult is talking to someone else - these won't all be achievable, depending on a child's developmental stage etc, but children should be encouraged to develop these skills) and parents should share books with children from when they are young babies.

When children start school, then ideally, parents and teachers will become partners, sharing their knowledge of the child but teachers become the primary educators. Parents' role becomes more supportive. They need to read with their children daily, provide a quiet space for homework and get them to school on time.

If a child shows an interest in something they have learned at school and a parent is able to encourage that at home (eg by providing art materials, going on museum trips, planting seeds together etc) that is brilliant but not all parents have the time, money, skills or confidence to do so.

People are being very kind to call this just ‘a bit smug’, although possibly what I think could get me reported.

So what you’re saying is if parents have a low level of literacy or limited time eg because they work 2 jobs to keep food on the table and a roof over their heads that their children should be forever uneducated and poor? Charming. Fwiw I think school is important and am also making sure my child can attend schools I think suitable - after all that’s where they will learn Chinese, not when they’re home with me who has like you failed to learn more than the basics of mandarine. I can afford to buy lots of books and not work shifts that mean I have time to read to my child; which makes them extremely privileged. I’m not too busy caring for disabled siblings and elderly parents (yet) and I have a supportive husband to share the load whcih makes my children extremely privileged. I can afford and prepare good food to feed their growing brains which makes them extremely privileged. I can afford to buy a house in a location that means my child can attend a good school (again, because that’s where they will learn a lot) i’ll be there to support my child and am capable of reviewing and helping them across most gcse subjects, which makes them extremely privileged. I hope they recognise this privilege and the advantages it gives them compared to others whose parents havent the education and/or time themselves to support their learning, nor the money and understanding of the system that comes with privilege to be able to send them to great schools, and are too busy keeping things going at home to model learning culture. I hope they don’t just think they earned their own way compared to others less fortunate because no matter how hard my children have worked and how smart they are that’s not true.

Maybe your friend should put a bit more effort in. That doesn’t change the fact that your attitude is pretty insufferably smug and blinkered.

@Josette77

Hopefully, the teachers are in charge of educating your children on humility.

Just the word I was coming on to type...

it sounds like your doing a wonderfull job op , its inspired me to such an extent that tonight instead of running around like a nutter cooking dinner and vaccuming the house whilst iv been at work all day and my 13 yr old is playing roblox that im going to not bother with it all and teach her fractions instead

You are privileged and have easy (young) children without additional needs. Why not be grateful you have it so easy.

Certain things are for parents to teach.
Table manners, tying shoe laces, getting dressed, basic hygiene and teeth brushing , telling the time.
Otherwise it’s about providing support - eg reading, homework, trips to museums etc
To not read with a child is a failing in my opinion.

I think parents are responsible for the basics eg using cutlery, sharing, please and thank you, dressing, tying shoe laces etc.

Also, DC who are read to on a regular basis at home (or even better, parents take the time to listen to their DC read) will perform better with their reading and writing. If your DC isn’t encouraged at home, then they’ll be less likely to be motivated at school.

I feel it's a joint effort.

It's the school's job to teach my child academic things and for me to follow their lead and support that at home (reading, spellings, homework etc.) They are trained professionals and I don't want to interfere with their methods or confuse anything.

It's my job to teach my child manners, life skills and values and I expect the school to support that.

Also @washingmachines4 what do you mean by “teaching my DC Chinese”? Which Chinese dialect? Can you read Chinese characters and know all the dialects (or even one, for that matter).

@GeorgiaGirl52 What sort of memories will your children have? Riding in the car with mother and reciting the times tables? Nighttime spelling quizzes?

Funnily enough, you can let your DC learn through life experiences… and also read with them! You don’t have to plan strict lessons. All you need to do is read with your DC (pre-school age) for maybe 5 mins or less a night. It encourages a love of reading and learning.

YANBU that the parents input is really important.

But your friend is an extreme case.

Happily raising their kid to be one of the ones that calls you a swot if you are at all enthusiastic. 🤦

I'm lucky that I like reading and was provided with plenty of fiction and nonfiction books as a child and my family visited interesting places. And I once got given a maths computer game because I didn't like maths so I struggled 😄

Not everyone will have parents with the same background though. My house now has loads of books and luckily the DC are wee readers like me.

I wouldn't see me ever moving house to get near to a school, but in Scotland the vast majority of children go to the closest local schools, so it's not so much of a thing here.

@washingmachines4

To think you as a parent are responsible for your child’s education.

I have always considered myself the primary educator of my child, manners, shapes, ABC, 123, speech, reading and over time that evolves into fractions, telling the time and so forth. I view any education at school as a bonus, to my mind I want them socialising and learning how to interact with others well when they are there. There are times I have failed, my husband and I said we were going to be a multilingual family and bring up our kids with English, Spanish and Chinese – we didn’t learn Spanish and Chinese so fell at that hurdle.
That said, I wouldn’t consider allowing them to go to any old school, before we had children we moved house and one of the criteria for me was that we were in a catchment for multiple good schools. Things can change, we could have got unlucky, in the 5 years after moving before they started school they all could have gone downhill, unlikely but possible, in which case we would have moved again. An acquaintance of mine says this is insane but will always justify sending her kid to the closest school rather than moving to be near the best school for her kid. She also thinks the school is to blame that her child failed the national phonics test in year 1 – she has never once read with her kid, ‘that is the teachers job’ and actively discourages him from reading – makes comments he wants to feel better than others, brainbox – proper nightmare Matilda’s parents style. She is an extreme example but the responsibility is ours right? (For reference, I work full time but try and make learning as time efficient/fun as possible – eg. Got a CD of all the times tables in a song to put in the car so whenever we travel to do something we sing the song of the times tables they are learning that week) etc.

What’s that CD and can I get it on Amazon?

Catchment areas for schools change year on year so a road or area that's in catchment one year might not be the next. So it's not always possible (or affordable) to guarantee getting "the best" school.

While I agree parents should (in most cases) be responsible for teaching kids the basics including toilet training, independent dressing/undressing, manners, social etiquette (waiting your turn etc) there are things that are best they learn at school.
Even at primary level some of the grammar is stuff I havent the faintest idea about (Fronted adverbials, clauses etc) not because I am uneducated, simply because it wasnt part of the curriculum in the 80s/90s. My friend is an author and even she doesnt understand primary grammar!

And even though I did A level maths, I've struggled to remember much of it that's not used in daily life. My DD is doing GCSEs and I can proof read things for spelling, (some grammar) repetition etc and help with the odd maths topic or occassionally advise on art...but other than that at this point, I'm afraid my role is to provide the required equipment and books, space to study, and ensure she sets time to do homework and complete it to the best of her ability. I help her come up with or refine ideas for creative subjects, but something like science I'm literally no help at all! My own parents had no input into my schoolwork past a certain point, I used siblings and friends for help.

I did Kumon with my DD and she cried every time and said she didn't want to go. I'm doing a full time nursing university course and to be honest I don't have as much time as I'd like to give for work outside of school. I think there's a balance I do ask school for extra work because my DD is behind but I don't make her do it everyday anymore.

@00100001

You need to teach your kids basics like manners, life skills like how to cross a road.

And then with school stuff, support them
But there's literally no need to teach them
...

Life skills certainly need to be taught /demonstrated/modelled at home wherever possible. In most cases with support from school. Things like (table)manners, crossing the road, basic home stuff like food shopping and meal prep/menu planning to whatever budget you have. Managing money, how to travel on a bus or train, how to run a home of their own as they get older. Showing how to build and maintain healthy relationships.

All rhus stuff can be modelled from birth.

There's another thread going where the op is raging that due to covid her kids have missed out on swimming lessons (yeah, the 30 mins max per week for a term that is on the curriculum that no non-swimmer would be able to learn anything productive): IMHO water safety/confidence is very much a parenting responsibility - mine had both had enough "cling on to mum and occasionally doggy paddle like mad' sessions in our local pool with me before they found their own form of front crawl/breast stroke and were way beyond their peers by the time their weekly schlep to school lessons came along.

Parents have a responsibility for the non-academic side (that the school enhances with PSHCEE lessons), teachers have a responsibility for the academic side (that parents enhance with access to quiet space to do homework, reading, times tables in the car, whatever)

I'd much rather be at a "failing" school my dad moved house to be in the catchment for a top school I was bullied relentlessly and tried to end my own life. My DD is happy at her Ofsted rated Good school has many friends and isn't the best academically but I'd prefer she was happy then moving her and risking what happened to me.

I teach my kids all the stuff they need to know that school doesn't teach - how to cook, ride a bike, mend a puncture, iron a shirt, save and invest money, have good manners. The basics of life. I expect school to educate them to be able to pass final exams. I'm not capable of teaching GCSE maths or science I tried a fucking failed miserably during lockdown so somethings I have to rely on school for. I also can't teach a musical instrument and have to rely on private tutors. (Did you not engage outside help to ensure your DC could speak another language?) But I appreciate not everybody can afford music tuition (should people who can't afford music lessons not have a child?)

Your post sounds very privileged OP. Other than hearing a child read, many parents aren't able to teach their children academic subjects, which is why school exists and why parents desperately hated schools being closed during lockdown. Many people aren't able to move house to be close to a good school.

Of course parents are the primary educators, and their support is 100% necessary to ensure a child achieves their best by providing a safe and secure home, and making sure the child is happy and healthy so they're able to learn effectively at school.

And the phonics screening test involves children being able to identify sounds, so even some good readers need to be coached in that, and yes the school should have taught the child, and unless the child has an SEN or is a late developer, or just not a visual learner, it's usually possible to ensure a child passes. It's really not the parents who should be ensuring a child passes the phonics test. It's the parents who should be encouraging a love of books.

@secular39 Also waiting to hear how my child’s SEN are my fault. If only I wasn’t so lazy, my son’s ASD would just have vanished into thin air, is that the gist? I’m fascinated by this idea.

Op, cop onto yourself. Good grief. Unclench and find a balance between learning and getting to relax and unwind a bit at home too, which is just as important as constant cramming.

Do you just want a bunch of strangers to confirm your belief that you’re a better parent than your friend…?

I do agree that parents play a big part in the learning The teacher has 30 children to try and teach sometimes with no lsa how they get anything done is beyond me. I tried to teach mine to write their name before they went to school and the basic things like alphabet and adding up This really gives them a good start. Reading at home is the best thing you can do to help them before they start and also once they start bringing books home. Even 10 minutes a day will make a big difference. I was quite shocked to read the post yesterday about a mum that blamed the school for her child not being able to swim. That is the parents responsibility. Take your kids swimming from babies for goodness sake it isn't expensive and really important Why do people expect so much from the system

How old are your children, @washingmachines4?

I view any education at school as a bonus, to my mind I want them socialising and learning how to interact with others well when they are there.

I was exactly the opposite. I believed education was the remit of the school system. I believed it was up to school to teach my kids numeracy, literacy, science etc. If there was an issue and a child was struggling or fell behind in any area then we stepped in ourselves to get them up to speed or organised tutoring to achieve this but we certainly didn’t consider ourselves their primary educators in these areas.

Some of my kids went on to do highest level maths, physics etc and believe it or not I left that to the school system. Again, if it looked like they were struggling or behind I would have organised tutoring. Didn’t need it but I certainly didn’t believe it was on me to educate them in these areas, I don’t have the necessary higher level qualification and don’t pretend to! Nor those who wanted to specialise in history and humanities, I’m not an expert, I’m not the educator.

A lot of your post just doesn’t make sense. You don’t believe in schools teaching children anything, it’s your responsibility. Schools are for social skills and peer interaction. Yet you say it’s imperative for people to be in an area with top schools and if they are not they have failed their children. What does it matter if you don’t believe it is up to schools and teachers to educate your children but is your responsibility. It’s like a post that wants some weird smugness award but just fails in the detail.

Man, you really dropped the ball on the Chinese. The kid is screwed now. Will probably just go to jail- even then I read that you need basic Mandarin to be considered for parole these days.

I agree with the premise of supporting your children’s education. However I feel so sorry for them as the subtext here for you being “responsible” for their education is that you are just hugely pushy. They will burn out and resent you.

Some of the parents who the OP thinks are 'failing' will be having to put far more effort in with their child/children than she does or will ever do.