to think this workplace situation is completely inappropriate?

[Lu781]

Man in senior management position, mid 40s. Was previously responsible for training and mentoring junior member of staff, but once she had moved to another department (but still a trainee) instigated a sexual relationship with her, despite his position within the company and living with a woman (claimed it was a platonic relationship)

The junior - early 20s but very naive/ sexually and emotionally inexperienced, had never had a boyfriend nor had sex (or gone further than kissing).

The 'relationship' ended after a few months when he decided she was too young for him, after which the junior ended up out of a job. Not as a direct result, but it certainly didn't help matters.

Was this inappropriate on his part? (or indeed both their parts?)

Lu781 ref your update of Thu 16-Sep-21 13:51:19.

I realise this does not solve your own current feelings about what happened but seriously you dodged a bullet. If you had ended up married to him and having his kids it feels highly likely it would not have ended up "happy ever after".

He behaved badly and unprofessionally. It sounds like he took advantage of you too. But please don't contact him - it won't help you. I think you need to process this as something unfortunate which you have learned lessons from, and then put it behind you and concentrate on your future.

No, you weren't groomed. You were a grown consenting adult. You were naive to believe he wasn't in a relationship yes, but I don't think you can use the excuse I was young and naive to make it seem you had no willing part in the relationship. You fell head over heels and were upset when it finished. That's all there is to it.
Ethically at work, yes it's not the most appropriate. But technically nothing was wrong in what he did. Not having a boyfriend before him also makes no difference. You were not forced into anything against your will.
We've all been young and hopelessly fallen for someone who wasn't interested in the long run. I don't think seeing yourself as a victim in this is helpful to you at all. I do think it would be beneficial to speak to someone, a therapist maybe to unpick your feelings about this as it's obviously still effecting you years later. I hope you can put this behind you soon op

@Namechangeapologies

Lu781 ref your update of Thu 16-Sep-21 13:51:19.

I realise this does not solve your own current feelings about what happened but seriously you dodged a bullet. If you had ended up married to him and having his kids it feels highly likely it would not have ended up "happy ever after".

Thank you -no I absolutely am aware of that, the mumsy comment he made was kind of the end of any residual feelings for him and the start of me realising I was better off out of it. He was not good in bed, I'm sure I wasn't any good either but at least I had the excuse of no previous experience. And would I want to be saddled with a man in his 60s when I was 40? He was also very serious, read or listened to music at home and didn't have a TV. Think of all the Netflix I would have missed 😊

@lynntheyresexpeople I am already in therapy, it was my therapist who has encouraged me to see the relationship as entirely inappropriate and an abuse of power, I'm now trying to process that as it completely changes how I view it.

law is such a toxic culture.
In my day the male partners overtly bantered (out loud) about how all of the female trainees had been recruited for their looks only and had arguments in open office about who got any given female trainee next.
Horrendous. If my daughter ever indicates she might go into the same profession i would be seriously worried.

And Lu781 the age gap in your situation is totally predictable and sadly a feature of these very common scenarios.

I’m sorry this happened to you OP. It was an abuse of your trust. As I said before - and my opinion has only been strengthened by the detail you’ve since given - if this happened at my workplace he would be risking a charge of gross misconduct. And deservedly so in my opinion. Completely unprofessional. I think employers have a better understanding of the concept of their duty of care to their workers these days but it is still very patchy and certain places like the law are very hidebound in my experience.

Is your therapy person centred? Can you not ask to explore why this is gnawing at you now?

Ultimately it doesn't matter what we think; what's important is getting to a stage where you're at peace with it.

Are you blaming yourself? worried you would make the same mistake again? Do your choices you made then relate back to your childhood experience or the loss of your parent?

They could all be fruitful areas to explore if you have a good relationship with your therapist.

It's your opinion that counts as it's you that has to live the rest of your life with how you feel about yourself. Good luck with making sense of it all.

" as entirely inappropriate and an abuse of power"

I can see why your therapist might have said this to you.
However (and I have been in this type of situation myself) you might have to accept that female trainees (and junior female associates) are often in the prime position to fall into these types of situations, especially if they still harbour the happy-ever-after wishes in their heads and/or their biological clock is ticking etc - having a very wealthy older man right infront of you might be enough to tip the woman over the edge (and arguably that would not be an abusive situation).

it was my therapist who has encouraged me to see the relationship as entirely inappropriate and an abuse of power

You need to differentiate inappropriate and an abuse of power from grooming and manipulative.

Sorry, just seen your updates. I don't think a good therapist encourages yuo to see things a certain way. They should be helping you understand how you feel about it yourself.

I think it's worth exploring why it matters now.

What difference does it make in your life if you see it as toxic or not? Does it influence your behaviour from now on?

I'm going to stop there as I'm not qualified!

Do you think you would have viewed it this way if it had worked in your favour op? If you hadn’t split until qualified your story could easily have been extra experience in seat you loved and good word from supervisor (who was your bf) leading to you getting plum NQ job at firm and a real leg up on your career.
I know a paralegal who actively pursued married partner and got training contract as a result. It worked out for her in sense she qualified, I highly doubt she would have without relationship.
My view remains it’s inappropriate and shouldn’t be permitted in workplace though.

It sounds like he was a shit but I think you're being melodramatic and manipulative to suggest that you were groomed when you were a highly educated full capacity mid twenties adult.

I started therapy after a recent break up, I felt as though I had a lot of unresolved grief going back to the loss of my parent. In speaking to my therapist they went back through my history - loving upbringing, very sheltered but happy, and then we moved chronologically to talk about relationships and all this stuff came out. And it was just s bit of a shock I had thought he loved me, I certainly loved him and I thought it was genuine, I'd not seen him as predatory or taking advantage. Realising it was probably all so calculated just makes me feel icky about the whole thing. I just wanted someone to care about me, I feel sad for how vulnerable I obviously was.

I'm definitely in a much better and more cynical place now but I feel sad for my past self, if that doesn't sound too mad.

It’s clear you aren’t that old so this is fairly recent. I wonder if you could get any support via lawcare or junior lawyers division.
Like another poster said his name could well be on the expected to come up before tribunal list! The Gazette reported there were 140 similar cases in pipeline to one appealed I linked above.

I think he did groom you, yes, He was a (seedy as fuck) older man seeking to take advantage of the fact that you were young and in a subordinate position to him.

As lots of others have said, I would have bet my mortgage it was the legal profession just from your OP.

I think it was fairly routine back in the day - good looking female trainees recruited by the male partners, nature of the profession / training contract means you work very closely with your supervising partner. Sweeping generalisations - young, naive (studious / sheltered background) trainee is flattered by the attention from a senior / wealthy / popular / successful partner and a relationship begins. Trainee thinks its love, plans a future etc. Unbeknown to the trainee, its never the first time the partner has done this, rest of the firm judge her naivety / it detracts from ability, relationship ends and either the firm or trainee (who is devastated) makes decision that she shouldn't stay on beyond end of training contract.

Fortunately things have (started to) change. I would try to move on. Don't give it (or him) any more thought. Good luck.

"The flip side of the toxic culture is the disbelief that I had been recruited by a certain womanising partner (who liked to stick his penis in as many trainees as possible) because “he only offers training contracts to good looking woman!” BigLaw is chock full of utterly atrocious, regressive misogynist cunts."

And because law is so over subscribed and saturated, the very notion that you are so disposable and can be replaced easily and the relative shortage of qualification jobs (or at least the myth that there are a shortage of qualifiation jobs) feeds into a "perfect storm" type of culture where female trainees find themselves wondering if they are actually grateful for the pervy attention. Urgghhh. So glad i am not in my 20s and 30s any more.

Can I just add that in no way did I enter into it with the idea of advancing my career. I started looking for NQ jobs as soon as we started seeing each other because I didn't think we could or should work in the same department as a couple - because of course I thought it was the real thing.

I remember a few awkward interviews with other firms where they said oh XYZ solicitors is highly regarded in this field why are you looking to leave? And having to give a fake answer when they likely knew it was because of him, City gossip being what it is.

Op I didn’t get impression at all you had done it deliberately to advance career I just wondered if you would be viewing it same way if it had worked out so to speak.
Yes I can imagine it causing you issues in interviews for NQ jobs.

My workplace has a policy on workplace relationships which says although workplace relationships aren’t prohibited, where there’s a significant professional power imbalance/seniority difference between the two parties, the more senior of the two is required to declare the relationship to management.

in light of the fact that this kind of thing is still so prevalent /common is it any wonder whatsoever that so few women (on a relative basis) make it to partnership level.

Sorry - pressed send too soon - and that policy is designed to prevent exactly the situation you describe.

I’ve worked in law and I can just imagine exactly how this situation arose and exactly how it panned out. As others have said, it was routine not so long ago, but the SRA have started taking it seriously. I think unless you’ve worked in law you can’t appreciate quite how acute the power imbalance is. I’m really sorry it happened to you.

"where there’s a significant professional power imbalance/seniority difference between the two parties, the more senior of the two is required to declare the relationship to management"

which is all very well but would be irrelevant in a lot of law firms because the management themselves are the ones who do this kind of thing to the subordinates and set the precedent.