To wish people would stop saying childless

[Moolihooli]

Watching loose women today, Katie Piper - not for the first time - used “childless” in reference to women without children.

Previously she has also said that she dreads employers who are childless because they lack the empathy for women with child care needs.

I wish people would stop using “childless” as a description for people who are not parents.

I just like to say that I’ve been pregnant 8 times and all my babies got flushed down the loo. Cuts through the shite.

Agreed. I see myself as Child Free as its an active choice i make. Childless sounds like i wanted a child and couldn't. In my opinion anyway.

Look, it's not suggesting a lack of empathy but yes I absolutely notice a difference in employers who have children vs those who don't. If you don't have kids you don't understand (I certainly didn't pre-kids) just like someone without cancer doesn't understand what life is like for someone who has or has had cancer. Said person can still be empathetic but they just won't fully understand the minutiae that makes up your life.

@FightingtheFoo I tend to agree - I am a manager and have no children, through choice. It's not that I am uncaring but there are things that wouldn't occur to me to think about, in others' circumstances. The company I work for fosters an open culture where people feel able to raise these things so I can then take them into account, but it's true to say I am not aware of what parents' lives are like.

As an example - I assumed parents would welcome the ability to WFH, but hadn't understood it could be confusing for children to have mum or dad there, but be shut away in an office and not interacting as normal.

To those who want a distinction between child free and child less depending on the choices and feelings of the person.....are we to ask people which it is? That seems far worse.

I don’t have any children and I don’t really care how I am described. What offends me more are the assumptions about someone who chooses not to have children (no empathy, uncaring etc). Some of the least empathetic people I know happen to be parents, both mothers and fathers. Basically no matter what your life looks like there will always be crappy individuals on both sides of the spectrum.

@twinningatlife

Why is there this culture of outrage at everything these days? 🤷‍♀️

I'm sure a woman who desperately wanted a child but couldn't have one would find "childfree" a bit insensitive too since it implies she deliberately didn't want them and is better off without one

To me the term "childfree" is almost like implying you are free of some disease or something 🤣

And genuine question to the childless/childfree/non parent/without issue etc - do you hand on heart genuinely empathise if a parent comes to you with child care issues or are you inwardly rolling your eyes and judging?? because my experience in the workplace is that employers and line managers who do have children just "get it" whilst there is an air of suspicion from those that don't that I'm slacking off in some way?

I'm definitely not rolling my eyes and judging but I also don't "get it" without being told. Obviously I have gained an appreciation of issues over the years I've been in my job so I'm not totally clueless, and I believe (and try to help with) any issues that come up, but I wouldn't say "empathise" was the right term for what I can do.

I dont like the expression. We dont say husbandless. Partnerless

Never heard anybody use those terms. I've believe ''single' or 'unmarried' are the common terms

So for those who are offended, how about using a gentle and friendly tine if voice, add a smile, to explain that the term us a bit upsetting and 3oukd they mind using X,Y or Z in the future if that's ok with them.

End of.

When I was going through infertility I described myself as childless. If our miracles hadn't happened I'd have always been childless. For me it was because something was missing.

I think if you don't have children by choice child free is slight better. It sounds more positive

@BasicDad

Childless is a negative connotation though, as is homeless and YANBU.

Childfree is much better and implies choice.

Childfree sounds more appropriate if you've made that choice, but what if you haven't? Having someone say you're childfree when you wanted children could really hurt. The term needs to avoid attaching worth to having children but needs to also acknowledge that this isn't always a choice. I have no idea what this could be, but childfree has its own negative connotations and isn't appropriate for all people who don't have children.

@BasicDad

Childless is a negative connotation though, as is homeless and YANBU.

Childfree is much better and implies choice.

But for some people it’s not a choice. I can imagine being described as child free might be hurtful to those who want children but can’t have them.

I suppose those without children would probably be best

Childfree is much better and implies choice

How does that help when it is not a choice?

I am childfree - I have chosen not to have children. Children (of my own) would a be a burden to me.

I am not 'childless' because that implies children are lacking in my life.

While I wouldn't be offended by 'childless' I would correct anyone who described me thus.

I agree with you, OP. It's quite an 'othering' description, isn't it. The only alternative I can think of is childfree but that won't apply in all cases.

I am not 'childless' because that implies children are lacking in my life

but you actually, are, as less as a suffix simply means without. You are without children.
You may prefer a different term, and that's fine, but you can't change what words actually mean. Someone without children is childless, whether they choose the term or not.

I have not had children (from choice) so tend to use child-free to denote that.

Childless to me would imply that children were wanted but, for whatever reason, didn't happen.

I don't feel fussed re how others refer to me - this is how I choose to refer to myself and what I understand from how others refer to themselves.

Child free is fine when you want to call out that you are happy about no kids. But you don't always want to specify that. Both because it's a personal question and also because sometimes you just want to talk about people without kids as a group. I think childless makes sense as the general word.

@ManifestDestinee

I am not 'childless' because that implies children are lacking in my life

but you actually, are, as less as a suffix simply means without. You are without children.
You may prefer a different term, and that's fine, but you can't change what words actually mean. Someone without children is childless, whether they choose the term or not.

But if you (for example) wanted to describe yourself or a country as not having Covid, you'd say you were 'Covid free' not 'Covid-less'.

Before someone jumps at me, I am not comparing children to a virus, just pointing out that, whatever the technical meanings, the customary use of suffixes is 'less' for things you want but don't have, and 'free' for things you don't want.

just pointing out that, whatever the technical meanings, the customary use of suffixes is 'less' for things you want but don't have, and 'free' for things you don't want

No it is not. A painless procedure is not something where you would like pain. Someone who is fearless is not someone who wants to be afraid. If your house is spotless you do not wish it was dirty.

YOU are putting connotations on the word. When I hear childless all I understand is they don't have children. I don't know why, or if they would like them or not, it's a simple descriptive term not a value judgement.

I understand why people who don't have kids might not like "childless" but I can't bring myself yo say "childfree". It just implies that children are objectively a bad thing. I wouldn't like a single man calling himself "womanfree".

It may sound clunky but I just stick to "people who don't have children".

As an example - I assumed parents would welcome the ability to WFH, but hadn't understood it could be confusing for children to have mum or dad there, but be shut away in an office and not interacting as normal.

Some parents do welcome the ability to work from home. I’ve got friends who are fighting not to go back. It totally depends on individual circumstances. Assuming someone will want something or not want something based solely ob if they have kids or not is the issue there. Not lack of empathy gif parents.

@Twizbe

When I was going through infertility I described myself as childless. If our miracles hadn't happened I'd have always been childless. For me it was because something was missing.

I think if you don't have children by choice child free is slight better. It sounds more positive

I think I agree with you. I couldn’t have children, but am quite happy with my life as it now is at 60. Childless suggests I am still grieving. I’m not.

If I had experienced infertility, I probably wouldn't have wanted to have to make a choice that implied to all and sundry whether or not I had chosen not to have a child.

@DrSbaitso

If I had experienced infertility, I probably wouldn't have wanted to have to make a choice that implied to all and sundry whether or not I had chosen not to have a child.

I think for me it was important that people knew it wasn't my choice I didn't have a child.

I hated being asked when we'd have kids (I never ask anyone that question) and near the end of our journey I'd say 'we're trying but it's not happening'. I wanted them to know that we hadn't chosen to not have children. We wanted them desperately but nature wasn't cooperating

Child-free by choice works for me.

I used to say that I loved children but didn't think I could eat a whole one. All good.