Emergency spiritual help needed!

[GrrrlPwr]

We are moving house. This house has a 'presence'. It is not a happy presence. And we would rather not move house with it!

Have already had a priest round to bless the house which helped.

But it's still not gone. The presence not the priest. He went after a cup of tea and a biscuit.

Removal men commented they could 'feel' the presence too.

So. Any ideas?

Any leaving the house ceremony type thing from another culture we could borrow?

We are white British Christian background. So open to any ideas! Thanks

The problem with your position is that you offer unverified statements as facts that may or may not be true [e.g. "Spirit does not consist of a “material unlike anything we know” because it does not consist of material at all"].

1. Says who? How do you know? Why should I believe that? On what basis can I ascertain if you are mistaken?

And 2) many people do claim that they interact physically, in the material world, with ghosts. They see them. They smell them. They touch them. They see and feel ectoplasm. Ghosts pick things up and thrown them and smash windows. They have sex with people. So what's going on there? Why can't science investigate those claims?

^ @ibelieveinghosts

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

Just make sure it's not white sage, otherwise you might be offending some other bunch of whacko cultists somewhere, even though they live on the other side of the planet and have no inkling at all that you might be using it.

????? WTAF?

Did you seriously just call Indiginous People "whacko cultists"

You are aware how fucking racist that is, right?

@LoisLane66

ESB. It's per se, not persay

ah, thank you! Habit from hearing it for a long while before seeing it written!

@MasterBeth

1. Says who? How do you know? Why should I believe that? On what basis can I ascertain if you are mistaken? You are still trying to force the situation into a scientific method framework. My belief system is how I know, I just do. It’s not for me to convince you about my personal beliefs/gnosis, I’m happy to explain what they are but you must reach your own conclusions which feel authentic to you And that is your path not mine.

If scientific methodology cannot measure these things people perceive on the physical plane then there are many explanations inc

1. It’s all made up for a giggle
2. It’s all made up but people believe because of psychological factors
3. Things happen due to external factors which are material but read as supernatural
4. Things happen on a different plane/wave length etc which can be experienced by some people and not others or measured in a scientific way
5. It’s all in the mind, but then you are left with the question of what is the mind, a load of chemicals and physical connections, a receiver of consciousness a creator of consciousness and is that collective or personal? And then you are left with the question of what is consciousness where there are many theories.

Lots of others will have many different views. There is no right or wrong here just perspectives. Any right or wrong is only absolute within the framework in which it is set.

@EmotionalSupportBear

Ahem, it's spelled indigenous.

If you are going to berate pps might as well write it properly.
And I think all of us, indigenous people, deserve the correct term.

Also, for the record, you need to specify where the indigenous people are from. For example, I'm indigenous to my country (as far as I know ).
So, North American Indigenous people. But I suspect not all will use white sage, even.

Interesting article about the use of white sage.

www.beautyindependent.com/native-americans-troubled-appropriation-commoditization-smudging/

One of the main concerns seems to be the overuse and lack of availability of white sage for Native American use, rather than solely cultural appropriation.

There is no right or wrong here just perspectives.

For some things, there is more than just perspectives. That's an idea that has been passed on by, well, people who don't want their methods and practices and claims scrutinised.

Say, home decoration, yes, it's a matter of perspective.
Health, less so.

@EmotionalSupportBear re: "Did you seriously just call Indiginous People "whacko cultists"... You are aware how... racist that is, right?"

Please note that XDownwiththissortofthingX did not mention indigenous people at all!

They said "some other bunch of whacko cultists" which "OTHER... whacko cultists" directly implies that there are whacko cultists here too, not just elsewhere. The geography aspect was trying to be all inclusive across the World and very clearly tried to address RESPECT for all cultures, by saying "you might be offending..."

In fact, I believe it was YOU who specifically pointed out earlier that "Native American Tribes... Holy people have requested we stop using it", so clearly you seem to agree about respecting others.

And if you care to read all of XDownwiththissortofthingX's postings you will find that they seem to be skeptical of ALL esoteric beliefs.

So, there was nothing racist about their comment "...you might be offending some other bunch of whacko cultists somewhere, even though they live on the other side of the planet..." because they believe all cultists from all races, countries, cultures, etc. to be misinformed.

@XDownwiththissortofthingX: Am I right?

[quote Lweji]@EmotionalSupportBear

Ahem, it's spelled indigenous.

If you are going to berate pps might as well write it properly.
And I think all of us, indigenous people, deserve the correct term.

Also, for the record, you need to specify where the indigenous people are from. For example, I'm indigenous to my country (as far as I know ).
So, North American Indigenous people. But I suspect not all will use white sage, even.

Interesting article about the use of white sage.

www.beautyindependent.com/native-americans-troubled-appropriation-commoditization-smudging/

One of the main concerns seems to be the overuse and lack of availability of white sage for Native American use, rather than solely cultural appropriation.[/quote]
and my mispelling makes their Racism ok does it?

[quote MakeMathsFun]@EmotionalSupportBear re: "Did you seriously just call Indiginous People "whacko cultists"... You are aware how... racist that is, right?"

Please note that XDownwiththissortofthingX did not mention indigenous people at all!

They said "some other bunch of whacko cultists" which "OTHER... whacko cultists" directly implies that there are whacko cultists here too, not just elsewhere. The geography aspect was trying to be all inclusive across the World and very clearly tried to address RESPECT for all cultures, by saying "you might be offending..."

In fact, I believe it was YOU who specifically pointed out earlier that "Native American Tribes... Holy people have requested we stop using it", so clearly you seem to agree about respecting others.

And if you care to read all of XDownwiththissortofthingX's postings you will find that they seem to be skeptical of ALL esoteric beliefs.

So, there was nothing racist about their comment "...you might be offending some other bunch of whacko cultists somewhere, even though they live on the other side of the planet..." because they believe all cultists from all races, countries, cultures, etc. to be misinformed.

@XDownwiththissortofthingX: Am I right?[/quote]
You're just being disingenuous to defend the indefensible.

They were quite clearly referring to the commentary on this thread about Native American People requesting that western practitioners of Magic, and some 'new age' people stop using White Sage, as its considered a closed practise to some, and otherwise related to oppression of their People.

Oh, and my apologies if after less than an hours sleep due to ill health that my spelling isn't perfect.

I wasn't aware it needed to be to call out blatant racism.

ESB, I mentioned your spelling, because you've used the same wrong spelling throughout the thread.

Anyway... as much as we should respect anyone's culture, smudging has no demonstrable health effect (although apparently sage extracts might have some benefits), I think we all have the right to call any religion or belief system as "whacko", no matter what culture it comes from. Let's be real, it's not better than burning incense by some cultures or religions. Not better than exorcisms. Or my grandmother's superstitions.
It's all unscientific. Thus whacko.

www.webmd.com/balance/news/20190521/are-there-health-benefits-from-burning-sage

As an aside;several years ago I watched a TV programme about people who thought they had seen ghosts. One man who was a scientist had experienced something odd while he was alone at night in the lab. Being a scientist he attempted to find a rational explanation and to paraphrase he realized that if the extractor fan near the lab bench was working at a particular level (revs per minute or such like) and his head was in a certain position he 'saw' out of the corner of his eye, something that couldn't be there. In other words his brain was interpreting something in a way that was wrong due to certain physical conditions. Obviously I am shortening the explanation, but I am convinced that lots of these paranormal incidents can be explained by rational phenomena.
Thought I would just say that.

And here comes the bunfight, so bloody tedious.

@Monestera

I’m an expert in these kinds of things and unfortunately I don’t have good news. In my professional experience, the presences will follow you everywhere you go.

Wow!

Where did you train, to gain this professional experience, & what are your qualifications?

@Foxlover46

So if the church only decide to help after a mental health evaluation then surely if you were suffering from any kind of depression or anxiety they would consider you to have mental health issues ? So therefore would that mean they wouldn't help ?

So let's get this straight -

Catholicism simultaneously expects you to believe in the existence of the divine, the afterlife, transubstantiation, and so on, and all this is regarded as a sign of being perfectly sane and healthy, but if you declare the existence of any sort of 'dark' entity, the first assumption is that you must be mentally ill?

Right...

@MakeMathsFun

Not far off.

All religions are cults, doesn't matter how profligate they are, how long-lived they are, or whether they are regarded as cultural identities or not. Their adherents are cultists whether they regard themselves as belonging to a cult or not, and yes, given what they believe and what religious practice sometimes involves, I think it's entirely reasonable to describe them as 'whacko'.

www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/02/there-is-a-paranormal-activity-lab-at-the-university-of-virginia/283584/

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

I wouldn’t take anyone’s word for it on this thread about what the Catholic Church believes.

Whomever said they will bless your house to calm you down? That’s just not true. No religion is practicing their faith just to make someone else feel ok. House blessing are something that they do for people when asked. It’s not about ghostly activity, just a blessing.

@ChargingBuck this could actually be true.
@Monestera could be a mental health specialist.

I wouldn’t take anyone’s word for it on this thread about what the Catholic Church believes

Fair point, though this pearler is far from the only thing that raises a quizzical eyebrow about the Catholic church.

@Lweji

There is no right or wrong here just perspectives.

For some things, there is more than just perspectives. That's an idea that has been passed on by, well, people who don't want their methods and practices and claims scrutinised.

Say, home decoration, yes, it's a matter of perspective.
Health, less so.

Well that’s entirely your own perspective to which you’re entitled 😁

@EmotionalSupportBear

My point was that XDownwiththissortofthingX seems to consider
ALL cults as "whacko". There was no singling out. Therefore not racist to indigenous peoples. Not requiring defense, just clearer understanding before blame.

[quote Cissyandflora]@ChargingBuck this could actually be true.
@Monestera could be a mental health specialist.[/quote]

[quote XDownwiththissortofthingX]@MakeMathsFun

Not far off.

All religions are cults, doesn't matter how profligate they are, how long-lived they are, or whether they are regarded as cultural identities or not. Their adherents are cultists whether they regard themselves as belonging to a cult or not, and yes, given what they believe and what religious practice sometimes involves, I think it's entirely reasonable to describe them as 'whacko'.[/quote]
Thank you. On a different thread I made a comment that belief does not prove reality. I think that says it all.