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Original poster

That New Zealand's strategy has failed

999 replies

JudesBiggestFan · 22/08/2021 23:21

And they will have to start the long and painful process of learning to live with Covid? I spoke to my friend in NZ earlier and he was in shock at being back in lockdown. He said they really felt they'd defeated the virus and this has just come out of nowhere. I feel for him but an airborne virus...it can't be stopped. And the cost of trying is too high. Or do they still have a chance of beating the virus?

OP posts:
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5
Clearlyunhinged · 25/08/2021 10:59

There are racists everywhere sadly, no one thinks everyone is like that in any given county.

CheekyHobson · 25/08/2021 11:01

Because people are saying it's forced or compelled, which it's not.

Jet Park quarantine is clearly vastly more practical than attempting to self-quarantine which is why Ministry official will be very insistent in convincing people to go. Practically everyone understands that without needing to it to be spelled out to them, or concedes after a bit of arguing.

But if someone does decide to draw a line in the sand and say they're absolutely not going, no police officer is going to drag them there. Because they are not legally obliged to go.

FiveShelties · 25/08/2021 11:02

Some of my Samoan friends in New Zealand have told they have been the target of racism.

I have just been reading about this and it makes me ashamed that we are treating people in this way. Most people in NZ are just getting on with the situation and would not think of bringing blame to people diagnosed with Covid - my friends and I just bloody pleased that we do not have it and hoping it stays that way.

We could have all been at that Church, supermarket, pub, restaurant, gym etc and have no idea where the next outbreak will be.

mbosnz · 25/08/2021 11:02

And now I think I shall hide this thread, because we're all treading well worn ground around our respective mulberry bushes, and I suspect none of us are going to change another's mind!

I'm enjoying lovely sunshine (finally) here in South East England, might go wander around the garden centre and do a spot of shopping later on, and maybe some DIY.

Ka kite ano ki nga tangata o Aoteroa. Looks like the weather is still pretty bloody good over there, especially in Otautahi! Lockdown is a bitch when you're having a mosey in Hagley Park, or walking the dog on Sumner Beach. Kia kaha, aroha nui.

Gennz18 · 25/08/2021 11:03

They actually are, under the public health order issued on 24 March 2020 under s70 of the Health Act

CheekyHobson · 25/08/2021 11:03

I don't know what the solution to this would be, other than leave people at home now?

They have a similar facility to Jet Park which was recently used for MIQ which they've been upgrading to managed quarantine, I believe.

PicsInRed · 25/08/2021 11:04

@MapleMay11

*There is an attitude of being in this together and uniting to get through to better times. Everyone has a job to do even if it is just staying home. It's a brilliant comms and marketing strategy and no matter how cynical you are, it cannot be denied that it has worked.

Much of it is cultural too, we are in the waka together and what matters is the people, he tangata he tangata*

Some of my Samoan friends in New Zealand have told they have been the target of racism. For them, it feels like the complete opposite of what you describe.

Unfortunately that's true and the same thing happened during the 1st outbreak.

www.rnz.co.nz/news/ldr/449965/god-bless-them-church-at-centre-of-cluster-brushes-off-racist-abuse

50ShadesOfCatholic · 25/08/2021 11:04

@CheekyHobson

According to the moh website, they can be "required" to go. But certainly there have been cases in the past where families stayed home.. I'm guessing that MOH do it on a case by case basis in conjunction with the whānau. Some people will feel relieved about being looked after and some will struggle with being away from home.

Gennz18 · 25/08/2021 11:05

@mbosnz

And now I think I shall hide this thread, because we're all treading well worn ground around our respective mulberry bushes, and I suspect none of us are going to change another's mind!

I'm enjoying lovely sunshine (finally) here in South East England, might go wander around the garden centre and do a spot of shopping later on, and maybe some DIY.

Ka kite ano ki nga tangata o Aoteroa. Looks like the weather is still pretty bloody good over there, especially in Otautahi! Lockdown is a bitch when you're having a mosey in Hagley Park, or walking the dog on Sumner Beach. Kia kaha, aroha nui.

Arohanui @mbosnz Enjoy the rest of the English summer ☀️
FiveShelties · 25/08/2021 11:06

@mbosnz

It was a struggle to sit in the winter sun today in Hawke's Bay with the temperature just touching 20C.

Kia kaha

MapleMay11 · 25/08/2021 11:08

[quote 50ShadesOfCatholic]@MapleMay11

Yes that was in the news today. It's so awful. There definitely are racists here and most of us find it sickening.

I'm so sad for the Samoan community, more than half the current cases are in their community and they are already a very vulnerable group.

Please don't think that racists speak for all of us though.[/quote]
I don't by any means think that but I'm also saddened to hear this. I hope this will be a driver to increase vaccine uptake. We have had similar situations in the UK in areas with large BAME communities. The pandemic has brought out the very worst in some people. It's just appalling.

50ShadesOfCatholic · 25/08/2021 11:09

@mbosnz

I was chatting with a friend in Ōtautahi yesterday, she was lying in the sunshine literally laughing with joy about the enforced rest.

Enjoy your English summer!!

Noho ora mai

CheekyHobson · 25/08/2021 11:14

They actually are, under the public health order issued on 24 March 2020 under s70 of the Health Act

To my reading people can be required by a medical officer of health to quarantine at their home but they cannot be required to be removed to an MIQ facility.

What line gives you the understanding that they can be required to be removed to an MIQ facility?

50ShadesOfCatholic · 25/08/2021 11:15

@MapleMay11

It is definitely driving the vaccine uptake. I was booked for my second jab today at a Pacific Peoples church and I was cancelled to make way for an upsurge in demand from Samoan, Tongan, Cook Islands people. Which I fully support.

The Samoan church at the centre of the furore has been so dignified, all power to them.

ChaneySays · 25/08/2021 11:15

Presumably they will have suffered a lot less covid deaths by keeping the figure low until the vaccines were ready.

Gennz18 · 25/08/2021 11:15

@CheekyHobson

They actually are, under the public health order issued on 24 March 2020 under s70 of the Health Act

To my reading people can be required by a medical officer of health to quarantine at their home but they cannot be required to be removed to an MIQ facility.

What line gives you the understanding that they can be required to be removed to an MIQ facility?

I guess the fact that I’m a lawyer and have had to advise extensively on the effect of these orders
CheekyHobson · 25/08/2021 11:16

According to the moh website, they can be "required" to go.

Could you please link to the page?

CheekyHobson · 25/08/2021 11:19

I guess the fact that I’m a lawyer and have had to advise extensively on the effect of these orders

Okay excellent, can you refer me to the relevant line/s then?

MapleMay11 · 25/08/2021 11:20

@FiveShelties

Some of my Samoan friends in New Zealand have told they have been the target of racism.

I have just been reading about this and it makes me ashamed that we are treating people in this way. Most people in NZ are just getting on with the situation and would not think of bringing blame to people diagnosed with Covid - my friends and I just bloody pleased that we do not have it and hoping it stays that way.

We could have all been at that Church, supermarket, pub, restaurant, gym etc and have no idea where the next outbreak will be.

As soon as some people are even mildly inconvenienced the blame and finger pointing begins. As you say, none of us knows who could be diagnosed next in any country, regardless of their vaccination status. We just have to get on with it - enjoy freedom while we have it and put up with restrictions when we don't. There's no magical, easy way out of this for any of us.
PinkTonic · 25/08/2021 11:35

@Gennz18

Unless you can self-I isolate away from other members of your household (most people can’t as it’s pretty much impossible under any communal household situation) you have to go into mandatory quarantine - under stricter condition than border MIQ -in the Jet Park isolation facility . This is not controversial it is a fact. I don’t understand why you are arguing this.

How come people have the choice to go in with their families? Would they be isolated individually within the facility? If so it seems pointless offering the option, but if all isolated together they could do that in the comfort of home. So then it comes down to trust.

FiveShelties · 25/08/2021 11:36

@MapleMay11

Absolutely right.

I am really sad that I cannot get a slot in MIQ which would mean I could travel to see my Mum in the UK, but we have been really fortunate here and I am just grateful that none of my family or friends have contracted Covid and are safe and well. I have my fingers tightly crossed that my Mum will stay safe in the UK and I will be able to travel soon .

I still find it strange some days to believe this is all actually happening, it feels like a film script.

Gennz18 · 25/08/2021 11:42

Because if you go into managed isolation with your family/close contacts, the risk of the infection creeping into the community can be effectively curtailed.

If you isolated at home but your family/close contacts were still able to come and go (even if just to the supermarket or the park) the risk of the infection being transmitted into the community is increased. To manage that risk effectively at home you’d all need ankle bracelets or similar like home D (which has been mooted).

50ShadesOfCatholic · 25/08/2021 11:42

@PinkTonic
It's not because of other whānau, it's to stop community spread

Gennz18 · 25/08/2021 11:43

^That was to @PinkTonic

igelkott2021 · 25/08/2021 11:46

your unvaccinated population is currently much more at risk of catching Covid than ours

unvaccinated by choice, so their issue.

Adults who want to be vaccinated are vaccinated and we are coming to the end - my 18 year old son gets his second dose at the end of next week and then the boosters start for those who need them most.

I am not sure we could have followed a zero covid policy in the UK, although the borders could have been closed to all but freight and essential (not I am an "influencer" so I get to go on holiday) travel.