That New Zealand's strategy has failed

[JudesBiggestFan]

And they will have to start the long and painful process of learning to live with Covid? I spoke to my friend in NZ earlier and he was in shock at being back in lockdown. He said they really felt they'd defeated the virus and this has just come out of nowhere. I feel for him but an airborne virus...it can't be stopped. And the cost of trying is too high. Or do they still have a chance of beating the virus?

@DottyHarmer

Is NZ going to accept any Afghans ?

Good question.

I didn’t @pollyglot because I stayed in Auckland 😂 but I could absolutely defend it, movement prior to 11.59 was legal, NZ is not a police state last time I looked.

Looking increasingly likely that everyone-but-Auckland will go to level 2 in two weeks. So it's worked, lockdown has worked.

@Guineapigbridge

Looking increasingly likely that everyone-but-Auckland will go to level 2 in two weeks. So it's worked, lockdown has worked.

That is an incredibly optimistic take.

Even if it’s true that the rest of the country heis to Level 2 in 2 weeks (and I don’t know what you’re basing this on) it’s looking increasingly likely that Auckland & its, what 1.5 million(?) residents are going to be in hard lockdown for the foreseeable future. Certainly beyond the next two weeks. It doesn’t show lockdown has “worked” - just that it has limited the spread geographically. Which is a good thing.

Given we are still seeing 80+ cases a day and even Ashley Bloomfield admitted they are currently only contact tracing 80% of close contacts I think the outlook for stamping out Delta is poor. It will be cold comfort to the rest of the country if Auckland remains in Level 4 for a long time, even if everyone else is at L2.

I didn’t @pollyglot because I stayed in Auckland 😂 but I could absolutely defend it, movement prior to 11.59 was legal, NZ is not a police state last time I looked.

All about the letter of the law and not the spirit of the law, huh.

Yes I am. The first time L4 was rolled out (in March 2020) it was actually illegal because the Govt didn’t bother to roll out the requisite legislation until something like 9 days later. I realise they had a lot to contend with at the time but it was unforgivably sloppy. I am not going to condemn citizens for undertaking activities that are legal just because of “the vibe”. This is a democracy and laws mean something,’.

Thankfully nosy neighbours moaning on the community FB page and anecdotes about too many 4x4s in SH1 is not a basis for a prosecution (yet).

If 3.5 mil out of 5 mil are free, and the remaining 1.5 mil are in a holding pattern for a while whilst they put needles-in-arms, then that's better than all 5 mil being locked down right? Auckland likes to think it generates the nation's wealth but actually the real juice gets created on the farms of Taranaki and Canterbury, the orchards of the Hawkes Bay and the tech firms of Wellington and Dunedin. Auckland just adds the service bit on top and tourism is fucked regardless.

(I'm not in NZ but I'm a kiwi watching from afar)

Yes - 3.5 free is better than none!

Not sure that’s true about the economy though. Definitely agriculture is still the backbone but I think Auckland contributes something like 40% to GDP.

@bogoffmda

I am a Kiwi/GB!

And yes NZ has laughed their socks off at the rest of the world for the past 18 months, particularly Britain. ( weekly phone calls) They did Zero Covid well because they could on size of population and location.

However, what they needed to do was buy vaccine going forward or even make one themsleves, because you can not exist in the global world without travel anymore. NZ has little manufacturing industry and so goods and people will always travel.

What ever we want to say about Bojo and Jonathan Van Tam - they bought a promise of a vaccine and bought large and bought fridges to store it in. On this they did better than anyone else.

Oz and NZ have done little / nothing to contribute to the global effort on the fight against COVID in the past 18 months. The rest of the worlds medical and biotech has collaborated worked their socks off and come up with something that works - not perfectly but then nothing in this world is 100%.

Cindy - locked down brilliantly and then developed a name and shame way of track and trace. The public naming and shaming of individuals - eg, the tradesman form Coromandel who ahs not left the country etc etc. It is a blame game still, you got it, you went here, you spread it to 20-30 others etc. What they have not learned is no one gets it deliberately yet they are making their citizens pariahs.

Cindy did not look forward at a world where COVID existed but we got on with life. She bought 750000 doses of a vaccine, ie enough for 325000 ina population of 4 million, spread fear about the Oxford/ Astrazeneca and did not work and allowed vaccine snobbery to develop. ( I listen to the rellies - about vaccines, the mis information is ridiculous) But then she studied politics for years with Corbyn!

Yes NZ is in shock - the solution is in their hands - get out vaccinate the majority of people and lock down for about a month. You can do it and accept any vaccine going.

Oh and Cindy be honest with your country - supply issues are because you did not buy enough, refused Astrazeneca and did not plan ahead.

It is sad listening to the rellies at the moment -they are scared, very scared and it was avoidable. Cindy you have had 8 months ( since December) to start vaccinating your population and you failed.

So I feel a mixture of sadness for my family in NZ right now as they experience what the rest of the world has in the last 19 months. Anger at the politicians who refused to learn from the rest of the world and resignation that they are still spouting vaccine rubbish and not upping the programme. FFS you have an outbreak and shut the vaccine centres........

No one won or lost in this war - we are still fighting it.

From a GB based Kiwi who wants to go home and see family but can not get a quarantine slot and has/is trying. Who is getting more bitter and twisted as celebrities get slots and yet NZs own citizens are treated like second class citizens.

I thought even Kiwis would know how to spell SYDNEY. Took me ages to work out you weren’t hassling some poor woman named Cindy.

But it’s not Sydney who’s fucked up Australia, it’s Scotty from marketing.

She is hassling a poor woman called Cindy, it’s derogatory nickname for Jacinda.

I suppose a strictly legalistic interpretation should be expected from a lawyer!

But I think most people understand that the letter of the law is the lowest standard of behaviour permissible in a civil society and live at a higher standard out of respect for themselves and others.

On the whole I actually agree but I think the VAST majority of people stayed put, and those who did a dash to move probably had good reasons for it. The fact that the virus has been confined to Auckland - apart from cases which clearly travelled pre lockdown announcement e.g. in Wgtn - suggests that any instances of Auckland refugees was vanishingly low.

@TheFrogsAreDying the op is referring to Jacinda Ardern, the NZ pm.

The fact that the virus has been confined to Auckland - apart from cases which clearly travelled pre lockdown announcement e.g. in Wgtn - suggests that any instances of Auckland refugees was vanishingly low.

Weellllll... I'm not sure you can quite draw that conclusion. Given there are only 500-something cases at the moment and a lot of that is within-household spread I think the strongest claim that can be made is that of the Aucklanders who legged it to their baches, none of them appear to have taken the virus with them. And when you compare the communities we now know virus is currently widespread in with the communities who have the luxury of a second home, this is perhaps not all that surprising.

Can’t understand all these threads sneering at New Zealand. Seems to stem from a lot of misery.

It’s not like our media isn’t starting to question the current approach, for all UK-based outlets are just reporting on what’s currently happening.

Janet Wilson

Luke Malpass

You know how the government are painting the young as reluctant to vaccinate and therefore to blame if they get ill?

The uptake of vaccine in the UK of the young is low because there is very little benefit to them to have the vaccine. The young are fit and well and are unlikely to have any problems recovering from covid emily France and others are now using a stick by insisting that only the vaccinated being able to dine in restaurants/gain entrance to clubs/bars etc. The UK are reluctant to use this kind of force. It is a matter for each country how they get the vaccine into people, so some kind of quality life can continue.

The UK are now at 97.7% of all adults have covid antibodies, by any measure that is a phenomenal achievement, hard won, and indeed we have one of the freest countries in the world.

And yet we clocked up 32,000 infections yesterday. Admittedly the hospital admission rates are still low, which is the only measure now worth looking at and the vaccine is 'holding out' for now, but lets be honest we are living with lots of infection, we are living with lots of on going booster shots on the horizon.

It looks to me like every country is going to have to make a stark choice:

Life in lockdown and low levels of covid

Life outside of lockdown with medium levels of covid and some death/long covid.

UK are not offering the vaccine to 12-15 year olds at the moment even though it has been approved and is safe.

@disco123

UK are not offering the vaccine to 12-15 year olds at the moment even though it has been approved and is safe.

We're rolling it out to the 1st block of kids in September when school goes back.

www.ft.com/content/2203a5ff-c157-42c6-9b05-d4adf4226ba8

Age 6-11 Pfizer and Moderna is expected to receive FDA approval around then also so hopefully the UK will quickly follow suit and that will be most of the school kids though we really need ages 3 to 5 as well to cover state nursery, reception, and Y1.

The biggest critics of the Aus and NZ strategies seem to me to be expat Aussies and Kiwis presumably as they want to visit home some point this decade.
There was a fuss in NZ about an article by a “British” journalist in the Telegraph called Matthew Leah. Turns out he is an Aussie.
Most of the world is not interested in watching Aus or NZ at all as they have their own problems.
I’m interested as I have kiwi relatives and spent a happy year in Sydney and I am generally interested in Covid strategies and the Aus / NZ strategy is an outlier compared to most of the world.

Matthew Lesh not leah

@PicsInRed can't see that as it's behind a paywall but is that a very new development? As articles I saw yesterday said only vulnerable kids were eligible and no decision had been taken on the rest. If so that's great news and o hope they can get them done ASAP. Schools are already back in some parts of the UK.

France have been vaccinating 12 to 15 year olds for weeks. I can't get behind the FT paywall. So has a definite decision to offer vaccination to our 12 to 15s in September been made?

PicsInRedcan't see that as it's behind a paywall but is that a very new development?

Sort of, the government had approved it and made plans to administer, but were on standby mode as their experts behind the scenes hemmed and hawed over benefit vs risk and ethic considerations around vaccinating the young. Thankfully, the outcome is that we will!

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58338481