AIBU to think Biden is wrong to pull out of Afghanistan

[bluewanda]

Biden says he doesn't regret the decision to withdraw US troops from Afghanistan. Really?!!

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9883367/Taliban-going-door-door-forcibly-marrying-girls-young-TWELVE.html

I know the Americans can't be expected to sort out every problem on the world stage, but how can we just turn our backs and leave those poor girls in the hands of these monsters There isn't any alternative IMO but to keep the troops there.

@Panickingpavlova

I can't understand some of of these posts.

Right now there is a targeted assault on the women and children going on.

I think that should be stopped.

I don't think it's soley down to the Americans to stop it.

But I think it should be stopped.

Yes but how? Serious question, I just don't think there is a solution here. And it is absolutely horrendous, but military interventions from western countries seem to only have a (limited) effect when there are actually troops on the ground. For the situation of Afghan women and girls to improve then the change has to come from the Afghan men who abuse them and deny them education.

@samyeagar thank you for what you and others did. Sorry i didn’t word it well. Can imagine it must be hard to see developments if you have got to know the country and the people

Only the people of Afghanistan can sort Afghanistan out.

No one else can.

Chardonnay but why would the men ever want to change anything? They want women and power and they have what they want.
Via the use of a twisted ideology and violence.

Does anyone think more troops should have flooded the country?

[quote Thatsjustwhatithink]@Panickingpavlova

That's actually not the case. Young boys are raped way more often. Before the Taliban it was common Afghan culture because girls and women don't often go outside the home. The Taliban originally gained strength in the south due to a Taliban commander standing up against a northern alliance commander who was raping little boys.

The Afghan army continue this and it was well known that what's they did to junior soldiers on a Thursday night. The british army used to appoint 'guardian angels" to protect the pretty young British soldiers from the 'advances' of Afghan soldiers. There's nothing more confusing for a young bloke from Western culture being transplanted into that world.

Translated from pashtun as common afghan phrase it "boys are for fun, girls are for marriage"

Google "the dancing boys of Afghanistan" or read any of the books on the origins of the Taliban Vs the northern alliance early on and why the population sides with the Taliban in the early days.

It's a brutal country with a deeply patriarchal culture that the armed forces (both US and UK) cannot change. There's so much division and cultural difference that you cannot just put western culture in and think it's going to stick. If the afghans or tribal groups want to change- they've got to do it.[/quote]
Bloody hell, hadn't read anything about this at all! Thanks for giving an insight into what actually goes on in Afghanistan, the media seem to not cover any of this at all

Are the people of Afghanistan men only? Who raises these men?

What are troops going to achieve? Win the hearts and mind and change their lives? How long will they need to stay?

Does anyone think more troops should have flooded the country?

The US had 100,000 soldiers in Afghanistan at one point. That's more troops than the number of regulars in the British Army.

www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2016/07/06/a-timeline-of-u-s-troop-levels-in-afghanistan-since-2001/

Chardonnay I can't see how uneducated women can raise enlightened respectful men.

Wow miss usa
That's a hell of a lot..

They'll be free to spread hatred and raise captured boys as Taliban fighters.

It does seem like we pulled out quickly. Was there a transition plan? It seems like a house of cards.

The reason the U.S.A and allies went in their was pretty lame. "Let's invade a while country to find one man and his terrorist organisation"
It's sad that all the money wasted attacking the citizens of this country could not have been out to better use. Instead millions of pounds of bombs have been used to destroy mud huts, villages, childhoods and families.
And let's not forget the man and women sent to fight there in our government's name, those who lost their lives, who's lived and bodies changed forever and who's families suffer their losses.
Let hope it's not all in vain but sadly I have my doubts and this country will revert to a nation oppressed by religious fanatics.

Broz tito, I started to watch that documentary it looks really interesting if a upsetting thank you.

The small clip I saw we see an older afghan man saying natter of factly "if they don't fuck the boys, who are they supposed to fuck? Their grandmothers?" and the American saying sadly how hard it is to try to have to work with peadophiles

Another clip in a sort of prison, sand bags and a hut, they said they had no power to detain people but they tried to teach the afghan how to detain and said they tried to encourage them to give prisoners water.

They did this to the Yazidis while the coalition occupied, look where that ended up?
Boots on the ground, especially western ones can't solve a medieval problem especially with a solution that many of the citizens find more offensive than Taliban actions.

Such a hard watch knowing the lives and money completely wasted and the horrors just roll on.

Yeah its crazy Panicking, they find a couple of guys locked up in a tiny space by the afghan army and they just vanish in the night, then another scene where the police and army are all off their tits on heroin. The scene you're talking about is after 3 young boys who were being raped on afghan army base tried to escape and were killed.

They have something callled bacha bazi (i think) which openly refers to sex slavery of boys there. Often wondered how it ties in with islamic beliefs. inthiscarload.wordpress.com/2013/04/05/bacha-bazi-child-sex-slaves-and-naked-pedophilia-in-afghanistan/

My ex did three tours there (plus just about every other war zone in the last 30 years) it isn't Islam as we understand it.
According to ex the Thursday night boy love was as blatant and regular as any drill, it was accepted and condoned as a lesser evil.
The boys would be rounded up at bus stations and abducted openly.
By Friday it's all over and done ready for piousness at jumma.
There is also a practise for younger boys (and the odd girl if they can grab one) so they don't "break" them while they are too young to physically rape.
This is also considered a kindness or lesser evil. (Daren't name of and risk deletion)

It's a fucked up mindset.

The queef, where is the morality and sanctity of life.
We fuck up time and time and time again in the west, all of us are animals at the end of the day but we try.
We have a yard stick of what good behavior is.
We recognise that each of us, has a right to be free and we have the rights of the child charter.

What on the earth can be done when people think like this?

I'm see troops are going back in to help evacuation and esp for the afghan families who helped the us troops whilst there

There is a charity trying to help them, they said three us gov administration has failed to fully secure these peoples lives in the face of the talibn.

The small clip I saw we see an older afghan man saying natter of factly "if they don't fuck the boys, who are they supposed to fuck? Their grandmothers?" and the American saying sadly how hard it is to try to have to work with peadophiles.
That is absolutely horrendous those poor boys, another wondering how such acts tie in with their beliefs.

Just read 130000 soldiers for Afghanistan.

With modern US artillery v 80000 taliban with out dated guns.

It's the unrelenting terror they wreek that goes for them, shooting anyone on the uther side

@Panickingpavlova

Just read 130000 soldiers for Afghanistan.

With modern US artillery v 80000 taliban with out dated guns.

It's the unrelenting terror they wreek that goes for them, shooting anyone on the uther side

Not really sure what you mean by that in the context of current events..

Anyhow whilst it seems popular to give the generic west a kicking here it might be time for to consider how much of the current horror is also down to the behavior and influence of a country very adjacent to Afghanistan, to it’s east.

Not

I meant supposedly trained up afghan soldiers, their own soldier's.

Rory Stewart has it right IMO:

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-9892183/RORY-STEWART-Allies-retreat-Afghanistan-monstrous-act-self-harm.html

I also think we and the USA should open our borders to any woman and child who wants to come. It’s the least we can do.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9891953/A-mothers-eyes-gouged-young-girls-kidnapped-sex-slaves-SHUKRIA-BARAKZAI.html

Agree blue Wanda,

Everyone should be opening their gates however it doesn't seem like France or Germany, Czech, Poland etc want anything to do with this.

I've said on the uther thread at the very least why can't the military support kabul to help get people who worked for the Americans out.