How strict are you with your kids?

[SheABitSpicyToday]

I think I need to be stricter with my daughter, who is just turning seven. She’s become a brat and is becoming difficult to live with. I just feel like we’re constantly arguing and it’s making everyone in the house miserable.
We argue about food, chores, what we’re doing today, going to school, what she’s doing with her clothes and it’s exhausting. She literally wakes me up to start an argument and it just sets me I to a bad mood everyday and my partner too when he’s got to go to work.

She’s being so difficult and I don’t want her to feel miserable but at the same time we’re all miserable atm!

Aibu to ask how strict you are and how you manage things in the home between everyone?

Read the "how to talk ..." book
Will give some ideas

If her pyjamas or underwear is tucked up why does it matter? Who is seeing it? Surely no one else?

If she wants to wear jeans in hot weather why does it bother you?
Let it go.

Hope it all settles but talk to hv and gp or school if you think she needs some outside support

@SheABitSpicyToday

Wtf do you expect me to do then when I’m vomiting for an hour in the morning? Sorry daughter, you’ll just have to starve for the mean time while I sort my shit out so that you can sit and eat with an audience. No. She’s hungry, she wants to eat and is more than happy to go and get herself a bowl of cereal or make some toast.

Previously you said you were getting more sleep while she was sorting her breakfast.

I bet she’s getting worried knowing that you’re ill like that on a daily basis!

You’re basically coming across as a bit stubborn - you expect your six year old to bend to you, when the reality is, it’s not an equal partnership. Sometimes you do have to suck up shit for your kids.

It sounds like you were the centre of each other’s universes and then your partner came along and now there’s a baby on the way. Somewhere in that mix you’ve started treating her almost as an equal, as someone who doesn’t so much need looking after as who can look after herself while you get on with your own stuff. And that’s fine but it’s hardly surprising that she acts wilful and independent when she’s expected to be pretty independent. When your baby comes along you’ll be treating her even more like a co-adult with you and will doubtless hit her with the “you’re older and should know better” stick if she acts out. Your younger child will be babied longer and you won’t even notice it but your daughter will. Recognise that she’s a small kid and needs things like putting to bed etc - not because she doesn’t know where the light switch is, but because a kiss and someone turning out the light shows they care.

She's only 6/7! Not a mini adult, not a pre teen, not going through puberty or hormonal.

I don't even think she's particularly naughty, more doing silly things and being annoying. If you think she won't pick up that you don't like her much at the moment, especially if you're arguing all day, you're kidding yourself.

Also your examples seem to change when you're challenged by others. Sleep becomes sickness, small shorts become pyjamas. Why would that be an issue and worry about who sees?

She apologised and tried being nice, and you couldn't just let it go, you had to remind her how "naughty " she was. Even behaving nicely and appropriately comes with an admonishment.

From the majority of your posts it seems that her independence is about what is convenient for you, as do the rules and discipline.

You need to break this toxic cycle, and it's not about being stricter, but listening, loving her, parenting her, being clear in your message/expectations/actions. Setting boundaries that are appropriate for her .. is she emotionally ready for harry potter, is she emotionally ready to make a project about what happens to the body when you die etc?

Depends what it is - car seat safety and teeth cleaning I'm super strict. The rest, we deal with via natural consequences for the most part. They get given food, it's a varied and nutritious diet and there's always something they like. They get the choice to eat or not. Food is provided at specific intervals so there is never that long to wait and fruit and veg is freely available if they are hungry. We only allow water to drink, mainly to reduce issues when it spills. Clothes, I buy them, they choose what to wear. If it's inappropriate for the activity or weather I explain but don't force a change, I do however take a suitable outfit out with us. If they get cold, so what? They're hardly going to get hypothermia and the more you force, cajole, plead the more they dig in. I ignore and then we discuss the issue as it arises, I use it as an example in future incidences. We are kind, but that doesn't mean being a push over or not averting out feelings and recognising that everyone's needs are equal. Chores it's "do you want to tidy your toys or put away your clothes. A choice, but a limited one. If DC says "neither" then they don't do anything, they sit on the floor, no TV, music, books or toys.

Sounds like you're doing too much reasoning. Parent the age/ stage she is at, not the attitude she's displaying. Her behaviour may be like teenager but her mental development is not, you cannot parent her as though she is.

... so in answer to your question I don’t think it’s about being stricter OR less strict, more putting in some more of the parenting “furniture” in her day, and seeing if that makes a difference. At the moment she may feel she’s bringing herself up (she won’t see all the work you out in) and wonder why she should listen to you. At the same time she’s clearly panicking that you’ll die and she will be left alone in the world. So she’s insecure and needs - not more time with you, but more time when you’re there in charge, parenting, not leaving her to it because you fancy a lie down.

@Jellycatspyjamas

Again, her choice to have breakfast alone because she doesn’t want to wait for me to sort myself out.

She’s 6 years old, doesn’t have the capacity yet to think about waiting for you to sort yourself out. It’s for you to adjust to accommodate her needs, not the other way around. It’s for your partner to support you in your pregnancy and accommodate that, not her. She’s not a mini adult, she’s a child with a child’s understanding and a child’s capacity to process stuff, you really need to consider that when you say she’s making choices to get her own breakfast, put herself to bed, not go to sports camp - some of those decisions aren’t here to make just yet. No wonder she’s confused about what she can and can’t decide.

She might say she doesn't want a story, and this and that ... but she doesn't necessarily know the full picture of what she wants, and even if she didn't it wouldn't necessarily be right for her.

There are behaviour problems so something clearly is not working for her. She is trying to communicate with you - in the very immature way which is all she knows - and you are totally impervious to any curiosity about it. You're all wrapped up in your own misery about how unfair it all is and how little you like her.

I had HG myself and I remember how awful it is. I suspect you, or a child part of in you, very much would like someone to be a parent to you, to help you manage.

What your DD feels is probably mirrored by what YOU feel - upset and full of anxiety about having to manage something that feels overwhelming and that you are not in the least bit ready for (having to parent while being so sick and anxiety about whether you can manage a second child and all the rest of it). Having to be a parent while feeling so totally sh*t.

People on here are telling you to parent your child and that is right - that IS what is needed. It sounds like a "parent" is absent - you take your 7 year old at face value and treat her like she is able to make choices and decisions. She doesn't need strictness - she needs to be thought about by a parental figure. Which could well include firmness and boundaries. But strictness without containment will just lead to a very angry and very anxious child.

But people telling you this, in a strict way, are not going to help you. Just as you treating your DD strictly are not going to help her - unless it also comes with support and compassion. I think you and your DD are very much in the same sort of place.

Before you can properly think about and help your DD as her parent, you need some support for the part of you that feels that way too much is being expected of you. I had HG myself with both of mine and it truly is grim.

I wish you the best.

@ObviousNameChage

She's only 6/7! Not a mini adult, not a pre teen, not going through puberty or hormonal.

I don't even think she's particularly naughty, more doing silly things and being annoying. If you think she won't pick up that you don't like her much at the moment, especially if you're arguing all day, you're kidding yourself.

Also your examples seem to change when you're challenged by others. Sleep becomes sickness, small shorts become pyjamas. Why would that be an issue and worry about who sees?

She apologised and tried being nice, and you couldn't just let it go, you had to remind her how "naughty " she was. Even behaving nicely and appropriately comes with an admonishment.

From the majority of your posts it seems that her independence is about what is convenient for you, as do the rules and discipline.

You need to break this toxic cycle, and it's not about being stricter, but listening, loving her, parenting her, being clear in your message/expectations/actions. Setting boundaries that are appropriate for her .. is she emotionally ready for harry potter, is she emotionally ready to make a project about what happens to the body when you die etc?

Actually having read the rest of your posts, I agree with this.

Just one more thought - one of my school friends had a similar dynamic with her mum. In retrospect her mum was depressed and thought having kids had ruined her life. Could you be depressed?

Yes I’m extremely depressed. I can’t take my meds until I’ve had the baby. Things will be better then and I’ve explained this to her.

I'm quite strict with my 3 year old but in the sense she knows right from wrong, what the dangers are, that she needs to eat her vegetables and that she only gets an hour of screen time a day.. I'm a lone parent and I regularly say to her I'm mummy and not best friend all the time.
When it comes to discipline, we just have calm down cushion in the corner of the living room. I got quite some assistance from my daughters health visitor about discipline and not to make it punitive.. She does respond quite well to it. However saying that, your daughter is older than mine. I would be giving your daughter just one option and if she doesn't follow that one option then there are consequences.

Ok that makes sense and must make everything seem much harder. When did your partner appear on the scene? I’m wondering if for example you’ve become more aware of her behaviour because it now happens “in front of” someone else.

Can I also just say, as someone who spent decades with their mum complaining that I used to be such a sweet little girl and was now a nightmare etc (I wasn’t) - please don’t do this to her. Yes very small children are often sweet and then change but that’s development, not a fault.

@SheABitSpicyToday

Yes I’m extremely depressed. I can’t take my meds until I’ve had the baby. Things will be better then and I’ve explained this to her.

I’m sorry to hear this. But be careful with the messaging.

All of these things explain why she’s behaving as she is.

My mum suffered from severe mental illness and I knew something was wrong. I couldn’t help internalise that, I didn’t know how to process it and kept trying to make it better but also played out for attention.

Remember, your daughter is not doing anything with the same sort of intent that an adult would.

My daughter is almost 8. She is generally pretty good, with some normal kid boundary pushing. Things that I do:

• I tell her what I expect from her in terms of behaviour. So if we're going out somewhere I tell her that I expect her not to run off, to say please and thank you, not to nag me to buy her tat, etc
• I follow through on consequences for certain behaviours - having her Nintendo put away, trips being cancelled, etc. They have to know you mean it!
• I acknowledge and praise good behaviour and tell her when I am proud of her, often
• I get cross rarely but when I do she really knows she's done something wrong
• the rest of the time, I try and connect with her when she is playing up - I will say to her in a gentle tone, "this isn't nice behaviour, is there something that you are worried or angry about that I can help with?" This often elicits information about her state of mind that I wouldn't have learned about otherwise
• certain behaviours are off limits - stealing, hitting, bullying. There are serious consequences for those and she knows it

I'm not saying any of this would work for anyone else, but just sharing in case it is useful. I don't claim to be a child psychology expert but we have built a close, trusting relationship where generally she doesn't want to disappoint me. I can be quite stern but also very loving. It can be tempting to just introduce stricter and stricter punishments but I think often when a kid is playing up it is a cry for help. Clear boundaries and lots of love can do wonders.

I’ve never done that to her. He’s been in her life since she was 3, he’s as much her dad as anyone else could ever be. She is still incredibly sweet, it’s just these random outbursts that I can’t cope with.

I think given all that you’ve said then you probably just need to wait it out. Will you give anything suggested here a go?

I think her going from such a perfect text book child has been such a jarring experience too. She was abnormally obedient up until 6 months ago. I’m glad she’s got some fire in her but I’m just not in the right place to handle it atm but I’m trying my best.

We’ve always been very open about feelings with eachother. I’ve always made sure of it, because due to my bipolar I can be unpredictable and I’ve always made sure she knows it’s not her fault, nothing she’s done wrong and not to worry, mums ok just this is the nature of the illness.

She’s truly the best kid I could ask for and I know I’ve come accords as defensive because I am defensive. I’m doing the best I can and she’s turned out really great considering. There’s just these few issues that I want to get a handle on before the baby is born so life is easier for all of us.

Yes there are a few things I’m going to try. And also discuss with my husband.

But what if things can’t be sorted before baby arrives? She’s constantly growing and changing - I wouldn’t expect constant behaviour. My 11 year old is very different to what he was a year ago, let alone 4-5 years ago!

Focus slightly on the positives. She reads to the bump which is absolutely lovely. She is perfectly old enough to get her own breakfast.

Some things, such as cutting the bedding etc are impulsive behaviours probably for attention. Just don't react. "Oh well, now your bedding is cut. You have to live with that." My 6yo emptied the toothpaste into the toothbrush pot the other day. Sometimes it's just what children do. It made me furious, but I didn't even acknowledge it because part of it is him exploring and part is him wanting a drama.

If she tries to argue, just don't engage. I always fine a forced monotone voice bores them out of answering back and arguing. This is what's for tea. If you know she likes it but won't eat then fine, that's on her. You don't need to discuss it with her, she is old enough to realise. Maybe ask her at the start of the week if she has any requests for the week so then she has some choice and control but you are managing that? Same with her clothes, if she's cold then that's on her too. I would also ignore the shorts up her bum, that's probably just to get a raise out of you. Ignore.

OK. You are ill. Mentally and physically.

She will know that.

She is too young to cope with it, so she acts up as a way of trying to explain that she's overwhelmed.

She's got loads of life changes to cope with.

You just need to focus on the day to day and doing what you can to make life better and not worrying too much about the overall .

1. Stop reasoning and comprising. If you want something to happen she does it. Tough.

1. Try and get as much of a rest as you can. Ask your partner, friends etc to help.

1. Stick to a strict bedtime routine.

1. Don't engage in arguments.

Ok so you’re worrying about being overwhelmed when the baby comes, so you feel you need to snap your daughter back into ultra goodness before then. The reality is, that may not happen. She’s changing, not deviating from perfection. She’ll change again you know this. If the real worry is that she’ll change for the worse and you won’t be able to cope, speak to your psych team (do you have pregnancy support from the NHS?) and try to work on those worries. If it feels like you’re biting off more than you can chew because you got pregnant on the understand ing that you’ll have a newborn and a good and self sufficient child I can understand your worries. But trying to sort the changed situation out by cracking down on your daughter so the situation is ok when the new baby arrives isn’t ok.

The single biggest parenting challenge is realising that life is never going to be static. That as soon as one issue or stage is complete it's onto the next one.

You can't resolve her. The issues will continually evolve

@SheABitSpicyToday

Yes I’m extremely depressed. I can’t take my meds until I’ve had the baby. Things will be better then and I’ve explained this to her.

Why on earth have you explained this to a six year old?

Why wouldn’t I? If I had a physical illness no one bat an eye to me explaining it to her. But a mental one? It’s important for kids to know about these things.