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Original poster

Nine years for starving a baby to death

999 replies

PropertyFlipper · 06/08/2021 15:07

I’m struggling to see the justice here. This sorry specimen will be out in five years no doubt. Devastating.
Teen mother, 19, bursts into tears as she is jailed for nine years

OP posts:
abcdeg · 07/08/2021 11:56

We don't know that at all. She may have been at a party, but she could have been there as an exploited sex slave (or she could have been there entirely of her own free will). I wonder who was paying for all this travel and partying...

But this is just nonsense though. We know what happened, people were with her. We don't need to suggest scenarios when we actually know.

Can you explain why a sex slave held against her will, who had no control over leaving her child:

-was captured on CCTV leaving and returning without calling anyone
-told people her mum had her baby

  • was on YouTube and Twitter, making videos and applying for PLT modelling
eeyore228 · 07/08/2021 11:56

@ Soubriquet I think they believed that the baby had learnt crying wouldn't bring anyone to help and therefore didn't cry out. No one allegedly heard her during this time crying and I would like to believe that had they heard, they would help.

Lockheart · 07/08/2021 11:57

We know what happened

No, we don't know what happened. The legal professionals involved and the jury do.

Posters on MN don't.

OhWhyNot · 07/08/2021 11:57

Such a tragically sad story

Why was she believed that she had taken her baby with her when it was known she had left her on many other occasions

Poor little girl should not have been left with her mum who obviously was not capable of looking after her

ElephantOfRisk · 07/08/2021 11:58

Whilst it appears that no-one other than the mother was aware that the child was alone and she also (I understand) concealed the truth by telling people the baby was with her/her mother, given the history here it might have been prudent to have some checks in place to verify or to see her with the child every day at least once.

Those actions would have added up to it being premeditated as she knew it was wrong to leave her otherwise why cover it up?

abcdeg · 07/08/2021 12:00

@Lockheart

We know what happened

No, we don't know what happened. The legal professionals involved and the jury do.

Posters on MN don't.

We know enough. Nobody's saying she wasn't abused and damaged. But posters making up nonsense about sex slavery and she thought the baby would be fine... is this really the hill you want to die on?

The evidence we have shows she wasn't held against her will. She left willingly and returned alone. She may have been failed but the fanciful scenarios are just ridiculous and disrespectful to the little girl who died.

ElephantOfRisk · 07/08/2021 12:01

And lots of things can be true at the same time. She can be both a poor teenager let down by the system AND someone who knew that her daughter would come to harm if she left her. The staff or supervision of her could have been completely up to the standard they were getting paid for AND still not good enough or no-one thinking out the box.

And many many more.

Dongdingdong · 07/08/2021 12:04

I'm not suggesting that's what actually happened.

I'm trying to explain why someone might be convicted of manslaughter and not murder.

“Someone”? If you’re only referring to a non-specific person, then why do all your excuses hypothetical scenarios refer to her circumstances in particular? Confused

Again, not so great with the reading comprehension.

That’s a bit rich, considering you completely ignored the last part of my previous post.

MichelleScarn · 07/08/2021 12:05

@Panickingpavlova lm struggling to understand his this girl is fully responsible for her actions when she was taken from her parents,classed as vulnerable, placed in care
Who 'took' her? Those who are being said to 'groom' her, or are you judging SS for removing her if it was them?

ExpressDelivery · 07/08/2021 12:05

Lots of groomed children are apparently acting of their own free will. I'm not saying that's what happened here, I'm saying we don't know. She could have been allowed to move about freely because they knew they had absolute control over her. Or they might not.

Mostly what I'm saying is that longer prison sentences may seem appropriate, but ultimately they're not going to stop this sort of thing happening. For that we need better care, better support and earlier intervention. Which costs money and supporting these kinds of women is never going to win votes.

Dongdingdong · 07/08/2021 12:06

She may have been failed but the fanciful scenarios are just ridiculous and disrespectful to the little girl who died.

This.

Panickingpavlova · 07/08/2021 12:09

Michelle I'm judging our "care" system.

She was tarn from her parents and placed into care and ended up abused and trapped in a County lines drugs gang and is now in prison.

Our care system doesn't seem to be able to to keep children safe and indeed seems to be an additional source of abuse for them.

What happened at home I'm guessing must have been pretty awful for all the dc to be removed. It's where they were removed too and what happened next is where its on us all, as society that this happened.

bluewanda · 07/08/2021 12:10

Mostly what I'm saying is that longer prison sentences may seem appropriate, but ultimately they're not going to stop this sort of thing happening.

And as I said before, they won’t stop it happening in the first place but they would ensure this woman would be prevented from having any more children in future. Perhaps we need a double whammy of longer sentences AND earlier intervention.

quizqueen · 07/08/2021 12:12

They keep reporting the story as a baby but the child was a toddler as she was walking. That's beside the point though. People who harm their own children should be sterilised so they can't produce any more.

MichelleScarn · 07/08/2021 12:13

pavlova I'm maybe being pedantic but it's the use of the word 'taken' which I'm struggling with, as lm then assuming you mean forcibly removed from her family against their and her will?

enoughforme · 07/08/2021 12:14

@quizqueen

They keep reporting the story as a baby but the child was a toddler as she was walking. That's beside the point though. People who harm their own children should be sterilised so they can't produce any more.
Agree
ElephantOfRisk · 07/08/2021 12:15

I don't think there is any evidence that she was being groomed or exploited at the point this happened. Nothing to say that she wasn't when she was younger and/or when she conceived her child. I'm not saying that doesn't damage someone but it still doesn't mean that you are warped enough to think that a child will survive for 6 days. She had opportunities to come clean while she was away and chose not to.

Conkergame · 07/08/2021 12:15

I think the system needs much more money and I would be very happy to pay higher taxes to provide that money but would also expect it to come from places like the nuclear weapons fund. It could also eventually come from a decreased prison budget as we wouldn’t need to lock so many people up if issues in their childhood/teens were dealt with properly.

More money would mean more social workers could be employed so they wouldn’t be so overworked, meaning SWs could take the time to provide better support and make better decisions. They could also pay SWs a higher salary which would attract more people and allow more competition for jobs so only the best people made it through.

Finally there could also be a massive push to gain more foster carers, with some of the extra SWs providing support to make it a more realistic journey for most people. Agree that care should be provided until 21, even on a lesser scale than up to 18.

Care homes are clearly not fit for purpose and should be shut down. So much abuse happens there, it’s horrific. I don’t have an answer as to what should happen to children in them but maybe earlier removal from parents would lead more to be adopted? I also feel the kids would be better off in a full time birding school, which would at least be properly inspected.

Conkergame · 07/08/2021 12:17

*boarding

And yes I know boarding schools get a bad rep on here but that’s mostly from what they were like in the past. They definitely have a lot more oversight and support in place than care homes, which seem to let kids do whatever the hell they like

Pebbledashery · 07/08/2021 12:18

She should've been sentenced like this.

redpontipine · 07/08/2021 12:20

Not read the full thread.
I was reading more about this on another board and this was linked from her sister. She states that the mother was a troubled teenager but she had support and quite a lot of it especially for the baby.

The stories this week have been heartbreaking 😔

redpontipine · 07/08/2021 12:21

I haven't watched the whole video myself.

bluewanda · 07/08/2021 12:25

I would support all of that, @Conkergame.

HarrisMcCoo · 07/08/2021 12:32

@Dongdingdong

She may have been failed but the fanciful scenarios are just ridiculous and disrespectful to the little girl who died.

This.

With bells on.
HarrisMcCoo · 07/08/2021 12:41

@Theluggage15

She WAS out partying when the child died! There is plenty of evidence, why on earth would a serious case review be more detailed than a trial? Stop excusing what this individual did. She was trying to get a modelling job not long after her child’s death ffs.
Exactly. She knew what she was doing. Child out of the way, time to get on with modelling career....