To think that 'middle class' parents get away with murder

[catfunk]

I grew up in a beautiful but modest part of the north with a fair amount of poverty and unemployment. Lots of families were under social services' care (?) police called out a lot, etc.

I now live in a fairly expensive city in the south, a fairly left wing liberal place where people party, lots of mums are 'trendy' types and generational wealth is quite common.

It struck me the other day that if the parents in my home town behaved like the parents in my current home there'd be real repercussions.
Noisy house parties whilst kids are in bed upstairs, parents getting drunk and staying out all night, recreational drug taking and being too hungover to do the school run. But it's ok because they're drinking champagne and expensive gin instead of tenants, and expensive cannabis tinctures instead of smoking resin?

None of the kids seem unhappy or affected and they do have lovely family times together of course but AIBU To think this is not fair ?

Um the Mc Canns are very middle class and Northern.- I don't see this as North vs South at all.

I used to be a lawyer.
On the rare occasion MC parents faced proceedings regarding their kids, I’d generally manage to fight it successfully.
It’s just much easier to present exactly the same behaviours in a more acceptable way if parents are not WC.

@mbosnz

Thank you catfunk. I'm dealing with the fall out at the moment, and that really means a lot. I mean, if you tell your teacher, the coppers, the guidance counsellor, and they're more concerned about the effect on your parents, or just outright laugh at you, what the hell can you do?

That should never, ever have happened to you, @mbosnz . I'm so sorry and feel angry on your behalf . I hope you get peace x

I agree, i work in a school in a very deprived area. and dc go to a very different one just a couple of miles down the road with a high middle class population. When she started primary 1 she was the only child in her class on free school meals and only a couple more across the entire year group of about 80. What I notice is what's seen as cause for concern at my school is actively encouraged at DC's. Drinking around dc might be cause for concern for example- DC's school serve wine and locally brewed craft beer and cider at every school event (it's ok as long as it has craft in front - no strongbow or tennants obviousl). If dc come in grubby, unkempt and in worn, mismatched clothes it would also be a concern. There's a certain set of hipster parents who think this is awesome (but only if it's worn, stained boden. Not primary) it's eco friendly to do so you know. One boy used to come to pick up his sister in her old tights. That's all he ever wore, old tights, old t shirt, the same holey knitted jumper and ancient sandals. Hair looked like it had never seen a brush. Everyone thought he was so cool. I honestly think if that was a struggling mum on benefits bringing that child every day it would be investigated

I think class has always been a issue when it comes to things like this and I think there are a lot of kids being neglected and abused in middle class homes . It’s just assumed that people with money do not neglect their kids.

We live in a similar area, mainly middle classed rich families, I know many that drink and have parties (with drugs) whilst the kids are in the house, no one really bats an eye lid but if it happens in my road (council houses) the police are called and social services get involved.

Many children are not welcome in their own homes. In wealthy families this can be addressed by building a playroom and feeding the children separately to the adults, for poorer families, street corners and playgrounds become hangouts.

www.everyonesinvited.uk/ was enlightening, many private or highly selective boy's schools are informally paired their local girl's equivalent. Many comments were made about enthusiastic virtue-signalling by perpetrators and the unintended condemnation of brothers by girls stating that "all the boys at x are gropers" or worse caused a lot of middle-class angst.

I suspect many people are horrified by the behaviour of family or friends on occasion, but few would actively inform police or social services when the dust has settled.

I think it depends on the level of 'functioning' in appearance to the outside world. the story about mum laughing that dad took kids out all day because she was really hungover 'sick' according to childish minds.... well that's 'acceptable' isn't it. Not so much when you are a single mum and kids are cooking own tea, going hungry, unclesn and don't know basic hygeine or nearly killing themselves by burning house down due to misuse of the chip pan. ... although evenvthat isn't usually enough to get kids taken away by social services, sadly.

My aunt & uncle were firmly working class, she always had a hot meal on the table, everything home cooked, cupboards always full, house spotless, kids well dressed/brought up... read to the kids/ecouraged school, attended parents evenings, held down jobs... and would be functioning alcoholics.

And then they both would spend nights at the pub, kids had a packet of crisps and a seat outside or parked with grandparents.

it was seen as okay.. sadly my female cousin is a poisonus bitter b.... in part because of her somewhat neglectful upbringing combined with her mums guilt, which let my cousin get away with emotionally abusing everyone, including her own mother. My aunt is in her 80s (god knows how) and is still a functioning alcoholic (now retired though) my cousin in her 40s, also a functioning alcoholic, her dad died 10 years ago now.

I have to agree, OP. I know a v "middle class" woman who discovered she was pregnant at 30+ weeks, while on methadone, who had reported the father for domestic abuse in the past. Other than keeping her & her newborn in hospital for a day or two extra to check for any withdrawal signs, there was no further action taken at all by anyone. Now, I'd say she's a great parent, from everything I've seen, and her child is doing very well at school, no issues and she's been off any substances for years. But on paper she did look to be a potential risk.

But another pregnant woman I know, who def comes across much more "working class", was referred to social services after admitting she had used drugs recreationally years ago when a younger. They were very intrusive insisted on regular drug tests (always clear), visited her without notice at home, criticised stuff like a couple of unwashed cups left in the sink, strongly suggested they'd consider further action if she didn't do parenting classes etc. They left her alone in the end, but she'd never dare let her child run round with unbrushed hair in wellies and mud covered 2nd hand boden clothes like the stereotypical MN child, she'd worry someone would report her for being anything less than perfect now.

The only difference I could see was the additional "protective factor" of one mother having money and relatives who were solicitors.

@blameless

That's a good way of putting it "dc not welcome in their own homes".

And that can happen when there is no drugs or alcohol involved but its severely damaging.

It's so cruel and I cringe when people causally say on here about how they can't stand their dc running in and out due to cream carpets or mixing up toys
....

Love misc plenty of times when police and ss also arnt called when parents drinking or do drugs.

@mbosnz

I think you're absolutely right. It's one of the reasons why the abuse in my childhood was never, ever acknowledged, let alone addressed. Even when I literally cried out for fucking help.

This was the same for me I said outright on occasion and I was ignored. MC parents with a big house in a nice area…..

Yet when I did nothing wrong merely asking for help landed me in massive trouble (asking for assessment for ASD I got dragged into child protection proceedings as it was decided I had FII. I didn’t I was just asking for help) but I was living in LA housing g a single mum on benefits back then.

Simultaneously my v wealthy sibling was having breakdowns, drinking, regularly admitted with ‘overdoses’ and sent home each time to her big house and young dc with NO follow up except a HV popping round sometimes

@ButterflyCat2028

I think it depends on the level of 'functioning' in appearance to the outside world. the story about mum laughing that dad took kids out all day because she was really hungover 'sick' according to childish minds.... well that's 'acceptable' isn't it. Not so much when you are a single mum and kids are cooking own tea, going hungry, unclesn and don't know basic hygeine or nearly killing themselves by burning house down due to misuse of the chip pan. ... although evenvthat isn't usually enough to get kids taken away by social services, sadly.

My aunt & uncle were firmly working class, she always had a hot meal on the table, everything home cooked, cupboards always full, house spotless, kids well dressed/brought up... read to the kids/ecouraged school, attended parents evenings, held down jobs... and would be functioning alcoholics.

And then they both would spend nights at the pub, kids had a packet of crisps and a seat outside or parked with grandparents.

it was seen as okay.. sadly my female cousin is a poisonus bitter b.... in part because of her somewhat neglectful upbringing combined with her mums guilt, which let my cousin get away with emotionally abusing everyone, including her own mother. My aunt is in her 80s (god knows how) and is still a functioning alcoholic (now retired though) my cousin in her 40s, also a functioning alcoholic, her dad died 10 years ago now.

This reminds me, I rang my MiL on a Tuesday morning once (to arrange something we had talked about previously). She was in bed with a hangover. Her teenager was at school. Presumably she had driven him to school while still over the limit, then got home and got back into bed.

The other thing I've noticed the middle class semi rural set does a LOT of, drink driving. I think because the drinking happens in homes in the middle of the afternoon or whatever.

Growing up upper working class it would be absolutely unheard of for me to see a family member drunk, even at weddings and parties etc, I have no recollection of anybody every getting properly hammered. My dad would have a beer with his tea and a bottle of wine with Sunday lunch, but I saw him drunk once. DH has seen his family pissed countless times.

@roomba - I can't say there could be many middle class people on methadone, surely?

I know of some friends of friends of friends who take cocaine at weekends - I think they're scum bags to be honest and don't mix with them.

I'm fairly sure I don't know if any on heroin substitutes though.

Definitely true.
My upbringing was emotionally abusive and neglectful, but because we had money nobody did anything.
Also parents back in the day just sent their kids off to boarding schools at a young age and basically outsourced their parenting.

i do think professionals are more forgiving of middle class neglect or middle class crimes than working class, but id say there isnt exactly repurcusssions for working class people partying and taking drugs either, even if some people dont view it well

I’m actually finding this thread very validating. For a long time the discrepancy in treatment of my parents, me and relatives has driven me crazy but I’ve almost felt mad for thinking it but it’s really a thing isn’t it 😞

@Quickchangeartiste

I think the key point is the last one you made ‘ none of the kids seem unhappy or affected’ Presumably in your previous experience, something triggered Social Services or Police involvement. Plus of course, you don’t know the whole stories in either case, and to be honest it seems as if you have a chip on your shoulder. In no way am I condoning drug taking etc btw, but I doubt it’s as bad as you suggest.

Chip on shoulder is dead right!

I've rarely read such a snobbish, generalising opening post.

@Comedycook What really grinds me gears is how they look down on working class people getting smashed on cider on the street

I think a lot of people from every class would look down on people who are smashed on the street.

@NickyOy

And why Madeleine McCanns parents got away with leaving their kids in an apartment when they were out having a meal. If that was a working class family they would have had social services come down on them like a tonne of bricks

You beat me to it! I was going to say the same thing.

The McCanns really annoy me, for some reason.

Look at the Maccans when Madeline dissapeared I honestly think if they were rough and working class on benefits would of been absolutely crucified .

I have no doubt that there is a much, much lower bar for social services investigation for poorer families. Drug use, for example, will probably be waved away for a wealthy family that seems to be doing OK, but would be flagged as 'problematic' for someone poorer.

I suppose part of the problem is that the care system is so appalling that I suspect there's a feeling that even with problems, a well-off child is better with their family, but a poor child is seen as having fewer mitigating factors that make Care a worse option than being in the family home. If we had a less dysfunctional Care system, more kids would get the help they need regardless of background.

[quote HollowTalk]**@Comedycook* What really grinds me gears is how they look down on working class people getting smashed on cider on the street*

I think a lot of people from every class would look down on people who are smashed on the street.[/quote]
Yet smashed at home on decent wine is absolutely fine. I know a vair posh family...the mum is basically a functioning alcoholic but only drinks decent wine and whiskey so no one raises an eyebrow or judges her.

My father was regularly picked up by the emergency services passed out drunk and brought back home. Despite my sibling and I being under 18, they never ever referred us to SS. In fact they once gave us a lecture about keeping alcohol in the house. It was nothing to do us ffs! But we lived in a lovely house so everything was fine.

I even get this shit from my dh. He thinks because we weren't dirt poor I didn't have a hard childhood

I grew up in a middle class household too (though my dad pleaded poverty and wouldn’t allow us to have new clothes), we lived in a nice house in a nice area. I can’t really remember them doing much parenting, from the age of 8 we were allowed to pretty much do what we like as long as we were home before it got dark, both parents were busy working and we were just a inconvenience really. I used to love going to friends houses, most of them lived in tiny houses/flats but they had parents who were home and did things with them. My parents often had parties especially in the summer where a lot of alcohol was consumed, from the age of 10/11 we were allowed to drink with them.

True. Social workers say the only difference between MC bad parents and the other sort is that the MC have enough cash and relations to mop up the mess.

Placing my money on Brighton.