Is racism against the English acceptable?

[BabyBearRus]

We are currently on holiday in Wales and have just heard an altercation outside our holiday accommodation blasting the "bastard English who come to stay here". I'm shocked. I am half Welsh and half Irish, and spent much time in both countries. But also spent half my life in England. There has always been a jovial criticism of the English, e.g. during rugby internationals etc, but in recent years the tone has become more racist. I also find this resentful attitude towards the English amongst my Irish and Scottish friends. The English seem to be an acceptable people to hate. Surely this should be classed as racism? And, I'm saying this from a predominantly Welsh and Irish heritage. Yes, I am aware of the history of these isles, but when are we going to get over this? Truly baffled.

This is just the type of bigotry OP is talking about. Ignorant, toxic, sweeping and offensive statements that are allowed to go unchellenegd. If anyone says that's not okay the whatabouters dive in.

It's not okay about any group of peolle but social media sanctions this crap

@JaniieJones

'Yep. I think the English need to take a long, hard look at why they are pretty much universally disliked across the world.'

They aren't.

I've worked and lived abroad and people don't hate or even dislike the English.

You're a xenophobe. I'd be embarrassed to spout such hate if I were you.

Nope. My partner is English, my kids are half-English, I've chosen to live in England for the last 20 years. I love the place.

But there is something very wrong with the way, over a period of centuries, England has engaged with the rest of the world, including its neighbours in the UK.

Name calling gets you nowhere.

No it's not acceptable.

I spent a summer working abroad. Me - English. Welsh girl, Scottish for, and Scottish boy. The 2 Scots were from "opposite sides" (iyswim).

I was bullied horrifically by the male Scot. Everything was negative "because you're English". I couldn't join in "because you're English". He even said comments about them all being Celts and I was worthless because I wasn't. Also that he was only being nice to the Scots girl because compared to someone English she wasn't that bad.

It was horrible. But back then I was late teens and unaware of just how this broke so many laws within the workplace. Nowadays I'd be straight to complaining because his treatment of me was based purely on the fact I was English and he would tell me so 4-5 times a day.

He truely felt justified in this opinions and actions too - which is scary.

Dancing Bear what you are saying is as clear example of bigotry as any I have seen.

Racism is rooted in power. The English have subjugated the Welsh and Scottish so it would be prejudice not racism.

What I find really odd about each of the UK nations dislike for each other is England is pretty much a mix up of the other 3 nations. Thr majority of people I know who are English actually have a parent or grandparent or great grandparent who I'd Scottish Irish or Welsh. My family is totally mixed between them all through history.

So when people direct hate at England what are those hatng, the integration or their ancestors who have left to settle in England or what?

I've spent time in all 4 countries as we love exploring close to home and have to say I've never been subjected to anything but pleasant behaviour other than a bit of abuse from a few drunken yobs in Glasgow. I love our nations similarities and differences and find it exciting that languages are back flourishing, why wouldn't I.

As for the government at least Scotland, Wales and Ireland all have their own national government, England doesn't.

'Maybe there’s an English stereotype that people don’t like, but considering most people don’t live up to that it seems a bit silly.'

Yes. I mean every country has stereotypes. We don't say we don't like the Scottish because they're all raving flagwaving nats do we, many aren't.

You can't change xenophobes sadly no matter how much you try to educate them. I'm just a bit surprised so many on here are so very proud of their bigotry .

@znaika

Dancing Bear what you are saying is as clear example of bigotry as any I have seen.

Nah. Your 'bigotry' is me calling out imperialist privilege.

People hate being challenged on their privilege.

'I was bullied horrifically by the male Scot. Everything was negative "because you're English". I couldn't join in "because you're English". He even said comments about them all being Celts and I was worthless because I wasn't. Also that he was only being nice to the Scots girl because compared to someone English she wasn't that bad.'

It's just staggering isn't it that people who have purported to be marginalised seem to take such pleasure in doing it to others? Why?!

It's a shame @thedancingbear but yeah. Most English I met are nice and of course, I wouldn't be here if I didn't like them. Odd at times, but nice 😁
But what people show abroad is fucking disgraceful. And the "we saved you in ww2" is very eybrow raising argument and plain weird. Britains First did this anti immigrant "Our grandfathers didn't fight for this" while using photo of Czechoslovakian RAF squadron (so ha. Czechoslovakians and every other nation saved French too🤷🏻).
I wonder if Welsh have similar feeling because of the holiday behaviour, since many English go on holidays. The tops off with every pint🙄, the loudness, mess and inability to use bins, compalining that there were no chicken nuggets on dinner menu so kids starved (seriously seen it...), and the superiority.
Of course many are not like that, but these really are the most visible.
People were fuming about English stags coming to where I grew up and ruining it for everyone😐
Shame.

'Nah. Your 'bigotry' is me calling out imperialist privilege.'

Jesus.

You want to maybe do something about that humongous chip on your shoulder.

@fairynick

Racist towards English people 😂😂😂 fucking hell, not really comparable to ACTUAL racism where people of colour you know .. die because of the colour of their skin???

Die. Are far more likely to be stopped and searched by police than a white person, despite decades long efforts to stamp out institutional racism in the force. Are routinely racially 'profiled' in their workplaces. Are now targeted because efforts are being made to put a stop to it and some white people are deeply uncomfortable with talking about and examining racism and their own possible biases. Live in a system of systemic racism in which institutions privilege the hegemonic race. Receive covert passive aggressions on a daily basis; i.e 'no, where do you REALLY come from?' Where footballers and people in the public eye are routinely abused because they're black.

No, surely a Welsh woman chuntering and grumbling about the 'bastard English' is not in any way comparable.

@JaniieJones

'Yep. I think the English need to take a long, hard look at why they are pretty much universally disliked across the world.'

They aren't.

I've worked and lived abroad and people don't hate or even dislike the English.

You're a xenophobe. I'd be embarrassed to spout such hate if I were you.

I was going to say similar. If something bad is linked to the UK - it is always the English to blame (it has become an appelation for the dregs of a people) Re imperialism - was not just the English - the Scottish and other nations were involved. The English have given a lot to the world in terms of culture, music, literature and scientific advances - I am proud of that culture that still underpins my life. If such a broad statement was made by thedancingbear about any other ethnic group (which is what we are) - there would be uproar and accusations of racism, xenophobia.

'since many English go on holidays. The tops off with every pint🙄, the loudness, mess and inability to use bins, compalining that there were no chicken nuggets on dinner menu so kids starved (seriously seen it...), and the superiority.Of course many are not like that'

No, many are 'not like that'. Just like all Muslims aren't extremists. Your stereotyping and wild generalisations make you look silly and a xenophobe tbh.

There is good and bad in every nation.

Im not English. And yes you're a bigot. I already pointed out that class is the indicator of privilege in the UK not nationality. Scots were highly active in alace owning but blame some fuy whose ancestors were down mines and shoved in workhouses for being guilty.

"blasted English" is not okay, but if you switch it for "blasted tourist" then you will begin to understand that things are starting to boil over in North Wales right now and we are only on week 2 of the summer holidays.

Locals are picking up a an average of 7 bin bags of litter at the local beauty/ swimming spot daily. The village shops are empty and not everyone has a car or time for a 30 minute round trip to the nearest supermarket for a pint of milk. The hospitals are full and ambulances are taking many hours to reach patients, this is affecting both locals and tourists but local residents don't feel it's fair on them that they are now recieving extremely substandard health care in life threatening situations because of the influx of tourists, mostly from England. Tourists are blocking/ using people's driveways. Gwynedd council is shit and should have planned for the parking and litter situation, which is totally on them.

It's going to be a LONG summer!

I blame the Romans.

And the Vikings.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

The bullying like by that Scottish guy is unacceptable though. Like absolutely not ok. Must have been horrible

1. It was overwhelmingley welsh teachers beating welsh kids 2. Wtf has that got to do with any modern englander? 3. You want to compare that to the belgians 14 million dead in africa? Germany in namibia? France in indo china? They were horrific but are never, ever mentioned in the contextof colonial history. 4. The english/welsh relationship has been great compared to 99% of worldwide neighbourly relationships. Bigot picking out tiny non events centuries ago to try justify their embarrassing inferiority complex look like massive man child arses. Saw some truly pathetic stuff from supposed grown adults in the euros, including the Italian newspapers and captain being fucking rude and a terrible winner after just barely scraping a win. They wouldnt get away with it with other nations. No mention either of their support rammed full of actual proper saluting, self proclaimed fascists.

You must have been living under a rock in Wales not to notice the anti English sentiment from a small minority.

@thedancingbear

So you're imperialist if you're English then? I've always been quite shocked by just how ethnically homogenous even the big cities are in Ireland, Scotland and Wales so I'm not completely surprised you would make this leap but just FYI: you can be English and not white.

Agree that some Scottish people (the leavers) can be horribly prejudice towards the English. Even the children! Anti English sentiment is strong. Scotland used to be such a great place, obviously very beautiful, full of history with some great strong figures but now it feels like it’s full of grumpy angry people shivering in the rain. I honestly feel unwelcome there!

Of course it's racism, just as much as if anti-Welsh, Scottish, Irish, Italian, Spanish, or French sentiment is expressed. Prejudice against a group of people based on supposed national characteristics.

And no, it isn't acceptable.

@BabyBearRus

Just want to mention that I am married to a very patriotic Welshman, and a daughter of a very patriotic Welshman. And my sister is Plaid Cymru all the way...like all English should be out of Wales permanently 🤷 So, I really am between a rock and a hard place. But this prejudice towards an entire nation (or rather from a white English background) leaves a nasty taste in my mouth. My husband and Dad actually cheered for the other team in the Euro 20 final. Wtf 🤷

Yous sister seems to have misunderstood what Plaid Cymru is about.