To be pissed off at mothers who take their kids to toddlers full of the cold!!!!!

[elliemac]

Have just been to toddlers where one of the mothers was moaning that her DS had been up all night coughing. He was stood there with green snot all down his face poor little mite. He should have been indoors. Now its going to be passed round all the kids

oh come on, a cold is a cold, not a plague

also I think that children who grow up on farms are supposed to be very healthy?

I'm with oliveoil. colds/snot are no big deal. More importantly is how well the child is in him/herself. My children go stir crazy at home if they are feeling well (even if they might have a cold). For those who say it is better for a child to stay home to recover, I personally feel my dcs prefer to be out and about as per normal.

I sympathise with parents of children who are more sensitive to infection or with suppressed immune system. The only time I grabbed my dd (she was 4 months' old) away from pre-schoolers with runny noses and hacking coughs in a shop was the day before she was scheduled to have open heart surgery and could not risk falling sick.

Otherwise, I threw her in with the pack.

Perhaps I can afford to be philosophical about it. After all, I commute to and from work in crowded commuter trains every weekday. When the seasons change, I get the usual bout of colds. Then it blows over.

You do see a distinct difference in the way adults react to sickness in themselves. There are those who feel they cannot venture out with a cough or sniffles and have to mooch around at home with a hotwater bottle. And those (like me) who just put on their coat and get on with it.

I am sure the first camp will accuse me of spreading infections (which were spread to me by other 'inconsiderate' commuters to begin with). I call it work ethic. And I don't want my dcs to be precious either.

The immune system won't develop though, if children are kept at home rather than being allowed to catch minor illnesses. A child with a cold is, on the whole, not really ill. A runny nose is an inconvenience that needs to be dealt with. Even a child who has been coughing all night can feel a lot better out and about during the day, getting some fresh air, than sat at home watching DVDs. By the time they get to the age of my DS2 (4) they aren't going to catch up with their sleep during the day so staying home to rest isn't going to work and they need to do something as they don't actually feel that bad.

We can't pack our children up in cotton wool as that doesn't help. They have to go out in the world and mix, encounter germs and build resistence. I know it is hard for those whose children are vulnerable and need special care but the rest of us can't keep out children in doors for months over the winter to avoid giving anything to those children, especially when you can pick up a cold from just going to the supermarket and sitting in a shopping trolley. They aren't going to be safe just by avoiding other children. Adults spread germs too and from what I have seen mothers are the worst for keeping going on with life even when ill!

Again, I am not talking about a child how is lifeless, has a temperature, or has a sore throat or sore ears. They should stay at home and rest but most of the time colds don't do this to children and they are fine.

Totally agree with Blueshoes - IME the people I've worked with who are routinely off with every sniffle seem to get far more poorly, more often than others - I am of the opinion that working through a cold makes it go away more quickly and there is evidence to support this somewhere but I haven't got time to find it (incidentally you can find 'evidence' to support nearly every view on everything I think! .

It is a good work ethic to keep going and a reflection on the way you were brought up, IMO an important thing to pass on to your children.

I appreciate what those of you who have immunosuppressed partners and children are saying but it is unrealistic IMO to expect the majority to stay in, when they want to be out because of a relatively small minority isn't it? Even more important than that is the fact that many illnesses are contagious before the symptoms appear anyway especially the more dangerous ones. That doesn't mean I don't sympathise with you all, it must be infuriating and very difficult but you can't expect the world to stop for a cold.

There are colds and colds. I have had colds where I am slightly under the weather, and real humdingers where I am out for the count.

Likewise there are kids' germs and kids' germs. No one objects to a bit of a sniffle, or even the post-cold green snot. BUT - time and time again I have seen children dragged into school who are clearly NOT WELL. I got a roasting on a thread I started about this once, with people bleating, "oh, poor working mothers, they can't keep their dcs off school". Well, they're not showing much solidarity with their fellow working parents, are they?

Dd's teacher turned away a child this morning. She said he had been sick twice in class yesterday, had a temperature, and today the father CARRIED him in! Mrs X was quite firm, and said that he was absolutely not to come into her classroom when he couldn't even stand up.

at that....

Sickness and dreaded D is a different matter entirely and obviously if someone is too ill to get themselves up and dressed then they are too poorly for school, what a bizarre parent and poor little boy

If my children have colds I will send them to school/creche as neither I nor dh can take time off work for every little sniffle. Obviously if they have a temperature and are definitely very unwell I will keep them off, maybe sending them to MIL if I have to work. Tummy bugs are different, obviously.
However today we did not visit my cousin because ds2 has a cold and cough. This is because her ds has SN, has had cardiac surgery has spent most of his life in hospital and exposure to ds3's germs could quickly put him back in there! This is entirely different from exposing generally healthy children who can fight it off.

blueshoes - I don't think the two positions are incompatible at all.

On the one hand in childhood you need to be exposed to germs, bacteria etc to develop a healthy immune system.

On the other you need to avoid getting ill.

So - you go out and about, mix in society and with other children. But at the earliest sign of illness you keep your child at home to fight off the infection in its early stages.

There is absolutely no benefit in getting iller than you need to when developing your immune system.

fircone, once ds1 came home from school and said that his friend X had been lying down ill at the back of the classroom because his Mammy would get fired if she didn't go to work! Not sure if it was true or what the circumstances were but it did strike a chord with me. MIL is back up for us if the boys are ill but some people don't seem to have that support.

sorry Anna but 'need to avoid getting ill'

IMHOand probably many others too,
The more children are exposed to all the cold and coughs/ other childhood illnesses then the healthier they will be as adults.

Wisteria - no, that's not true (read my earlier posts for the explanation) - but it's a recurrent myth.

I have read your earlier posts, but don't agree with you I'm afraid....

There was an interesting scientific study i recall made when the Berlin Wall came down and the country reunited.

They looked at the social, economic and health differences between the two countries to see what impact the split had.

What was poignant was the fact that the East had a longer life expectancy and generally suffered less from diseases. Some scientists were expecting the opposite of course as they were a lot poorer and lived in greater hardship than the West.

It turns out that the East side were exposed to a lot more bugs, dirt, interaction and less cleaning products than the West. The population had a chance to build up stronger immune systems because of those factors.

The only down side was the fact that the infant mortality rate was a lot higher - something which, of course, was a very bad leagcy of the ruling government.

Wisteria - OK, choose not to agree. But you will not be doing your babies/toddlers any favours at all .

EricL - well presumably all the weaklings had died in infancy in East Germany, so the adults that survived were healthier... it's another way of managing health, lots of primitive societies work that way

Yeah - that kind of thing still goes on all around the world i'm afraid.

We are lucky to live in a society where our children are unlikely to die from a simple disease - most things can get dealt with now.

In fact - why the hell are we getting ourselves in a tizz about colds?

Reality check!

Yes, but with much higher infant survival rates and longer life expectancy (and much better medical information) we also need to adjust our behaviours so that we lead our long lives as fit and healthily as possible.

Anna, I have already got 2 through to teenagers without any problems thank you very much (and I find your tone very patronising ), by sticking to my ethos (and my mother's). My brothers and I also fight off bugs and things very easily, by keeping going and getting plenty of fresh air.

My eldest has had 4 days off school since she started at 5 and my youngest a few more but no more than 10 and both fight infections by getting out and about. So I beg to differ using my own experience.

Incidentally, my youngest dd came down with a sore throat and cold, feeling generally grotty on Friday morning, carried on going as normal and she was better by Monday for school. Her friend who had the same bug has been off school for a week because of over protective parenting, and is IMHO missing precious schooling because of it.

Ahah, you are following your mother's parenting advice? I don't do that either .

No I don't 'follow' anyone's advice but use my own common sense as do many other parents all over the globe, however I know that the way we dealt with illness as a family, worked for us and I have naturally continued it on as it works......I have 2 rudely healthy children to prove it!

I am an "oh ffs get on with it" type

the people I work with go home with a headache

and moan that "they have been up since 6.30am, I am really tired"

try 6am for a year you muppet

wisteria, I like the term "rudely healthy"

anna, "adjusting behaviours" to live a long and healthy life is fine, so long as the adjustment does not get in the way of LIVING LIFE. Once you have more than one child or have to earn a crust in the big bad world, it is not practical to stay at home to fight off every hint of an infection. And I and my dcs are rudely healthy too and I hope will become good working stock.

I too observe in my crude unscientific way that the ones who are most precious about infections are the ones getting ill the most and staying ill the longest.

lol, olive oil :"try 6am for a year you muppet"

And for me, you can also add: waking up at least 5-6 times a night, co-sleeping and nursing all night long, and then commuting into work 5 days a week. Do I win?