To think most of MN don’t know what having no money means

[icecolddrinks]

And that admitting to having none is humiliating.

I see it here all the time. Someone has no money. Someone suggests something to make life easier. The person says again they have no money. MN suggest a cheaper version.

On the thread about dress up so many people were saying to tell the school.

I know debt and low incomes aren’t ideal but they aren’t uncommon either so why is it so hard to acknowledge that someone might have 3p in their bank account and no money?

You are on a bloody wind up you just wanted to tell everyone you shop at Boden!

I have a mixed view on PP. on the one hand it’s a good thing that money is spent trying to narrow the gap if you like, but I’m not convinced the gap is purely monetary and it therefore can’t be solved by it.

@Bluntness100

There was a thread on here where so many folks were posting about having no money, so you’re unreasonable to think that’s mumsnet is some form of wealthy crowd. It’s a mix across the spectrum

No, there are poor people, but the average is much richer than the average in the population. It's not representative of the population as a whole.

Pupil premium isnt allocated to individual children though is it? My understanding was that it's given to the school who then decide what to do with it for the benefit of all the children

Perhaps at primary the teacher would need to know because of their close relationship with the child but certainly at senior school all the teachers don't need to know.

@icecolddrinks

But they are singled out.

They are identified as pupil premium students and different schools spend this money differently but it always involves singling out.

They are not singled out at all.

Yes it is @wedswench, PP money shouldn’t be used generally. It should be used specifically to raise outcomes for those children. Which is why it is hard to spend in a way that doesn’t single those children out.

If you teach a PP child you should know who that child is.

'It annoys me when people say stuff like 'can't you get an overdraft' or 'get a 0% credit card'. I feel. Like screaming don't you think they would already have done I if they could'

Tbf it is just advice, if people post on a public forum saying they are skint what can they do others will offer advice.

What do you suggest, just lots of 'Sorry to hear that op' replies?!

Of course they are @OneDayIWillBeOrganised

If you are invited to attend a revision session that is being singled out.

If you are given a free hoodie you are being singled out.

If you are given money to go on a school trip that is being singled out.

Positive singling out is still being singled out.

@TwinsandTrifle i am so glad your experience of being on benefits was a good one and that you are now an accountant. That in itself is a success story but surely you must appreciate that this is not the case for everyone. Benefits for most are hard to come buy, come with some real stringent rules and sanctions, never mind the many who feel ashamed (which they shouldnt) and what that does that do to their mental health. Insinuating that because people who are skint They are bad with money really isnt constructive or a sign that you have any concept of living in the real world.

@icecolddrinks

Yes it is *@wedswench*, PP money shouldn’t be used generally. It should be used specifically to raise outcomes for those children. Which is why it is hard to spend in a way that doesn’t single those children out.

If you teach a PP child you should know who that child is.

No that's not right

www.gov.uk/guidance/pupil-premium-effective-use-and-accountability

@icecolddrinks

Of course they are *@OneDayIWillBeOrganised*

If you are invited to attend a revision session that is being singled out.

If you are given a free hoodie you are being singled out.

If you are given money to go on a school trip that is being singled out.

Positive singling out is still being singled out.

In a good school these things would be done in a way that is not obvious. Who knows whether you paid for the hoodie, school trip etc other than the school and parent? Being skint is no fun for anyone but there is help out there that can be provided sensitively if people want it.

I am often amazed at the huge disparity in wealth on here. There was a post the other day from someone who was 'struggling' to find a home for £900k and other from someone who was taking a pay cut to £125k a year. I do think its great that we have such a wide mix of members, but the rich ones (even though they don't think they are rich) should try and think about what really been poor is.

Pupil premium children are not identified on the register or seating plan at the school i work in. Not in the entire 15 years i have done this job, have i seen that happen.
The pupil premium status is mostly used for data purposes.

When i was at school back in the dim and distant past, free school meal kids had a special pass that they showed at the till in the canteen. THAT was singling out!
Maybe because i have always lived and worked in ares with a lot of economic deprivation, i haven't experienced what you are saying.

@icecolddrinks

most of their teachers don’t know

In which case that PP money is being badly spent.

Teachers absolutely should know who is PP in their class.

In secondary schools where they teach hundreds of children? Unlikely.

We can use PP to pay for books, trips etc. It's done through parent pay. So when the teachers have a list of who's paid for a book my dcs names are on it (if we've ordered one). If they know it was paid for via PP they've never let on.
My friend who is a secondary teacher doesn't know who is and isn't PP. He knows who has paid via Parent pay for things. He hands those things out.

@TwinsandTrifle

You have no idea what it's like today, not a single clue.

I have. I'm an accountant with quite a bit of experience in advising in this area.

And did a calc to see what UC I'd qualify for. 1 adult. 3 kids.

I would get all my rent paid. All bar £8.40 a month council tax paid. And £1373 in UC and child benefit. After bills and food, that leaves me circa £500 per month for non essentials.

I'd get if it left me £50. But £500? And for those who want to claim well that's loads, you've got 3DC. Let me just clarify that the amount drops by about £250 for having one DC instead. So you are actually better off the fewer DC you have.

The claimant has to pay rent out of the £1373, it's not a separate payment any more.

@LemonRoses

No reasonable teacher, no reasonable human, would expect a present off a child who was living in a grim bed and breakfast place without access to cooking facilities.

We live in a really nice basement flat with sole use of the garden, in an extortionate area of London, DH has lived here since 1972, we're on WTC, we just about survive. If anyone suggests we move, we wouldn't get anywhere as the waiting lists are so long. We're not what the council deems overcrowded, as we're 4 people in a 2 bedroom flat, even though the DC are opposite sexes and the older is 13.

I’ve been on both sides and it is really tough being truly skint. I was a single mum on benefits for a few years. I didn’t get any money from the ex, no family help etc. There were no food banks then either. I’d get paid on a Monday, buy electric and gas for the meters, buy food for the week and then be left with literally a couple of quid for milk and bread later in the week. I did get council tax relief so didn’t have to pay that but honestly I didn’t pay for water in that time. I just didn’t have that extra money (and there was no Netflix, mobile phones etc then so I wasn’t spending on that!).

I’m not “rich” now, but I feel rich. I can pay my bills, buy the food I want, replace something if it breaks etc. Compared to many on MN I might still be classed as poor! In comparison to them I probably am. But I remember being truly poor and the way I live now isn’t it.

I teach secondary. I know who the pp children are who I teach and so should everyone.

My MIL was telling me how skint my SIL and BIL were. Their skint was using all their money to build another house in their garden that they were going to move into then sell the house they were in. No mortgage involved!

@JaniieJones

'It annoys me when people say stuff like 'can't you get an overdraft' or 'get a 0% credit card'. I feel. Like screaming don't you think they would already have done I if they could'

Tbf it is just advice, if people post on a public forum saying they are skint what can they do others will offer advice.

What do you suggest, just lots of 'Sorry to hear that op' replies?!

Tbf - that's a PRIME example.

When you've got less than £5 in your account, your bank DOESN'T offer/extend your OD - and the creditcard companies are offering you a competitive 39%APR (if you're lucky!) - not 0%.

THAT is why people who are desperate USE payday lender types - because the 1.5% loans are only for people with plenty of cash.

@icecolddrinks

I teach secondary. I know who the pp children are who I teach and so should everyone.

Do you single them out so others are aware of who they are? Knowing this information and using it to single out a child are two different things.

'using family allowance for baby milk and nappies skint. '

Isn't that what child benefit is for?

@JaniieJones yes, of course, but £12.50 a week didn't cover both either. I had to go back to work when DS was 3 months old because mat leave wasn't that generous 21 years ago. We were both working but nursery fees were ridiculously high, the mortgage needed paying and we genuinely had no money - not just down to our last £20. Often we had pennies left in the third week of the month, the CSA didn't always pay the maintenance to DH even though they collected it from his ex wife, they were bloody useless. It was a difficult time. He used to walk to work because we couldn't afford the bus fare for both of us, and I had to take DS to nursery so I had the bus pass. Gas and electric were on a key and there were times we had to choose between topping up one or the other with £5 (electric won as it was more useful).

@TwinsandTrifle

Your rent would have to be paid out of the universal credit. There is no separate housing benefit payment. Or do you mean you'd have £1,373 left after you'd paid the rent?

After I'd paid the rent.

And OP how dare you insult me that I'm some "wind up" because I'm a qualified accountant who has seen enough bad money management and people making excuses that I know it is predominantly not the benefits that are the problem.

You dont like thats the fact of the matter, not my issue. Thank you.

What about the benefit cap? You're either only paying £300 rent, or you're in London with low for London rent.

Agree. I had another account I forgot the password to but I needed a pregnancy test and had absolutely no money. People were telling me to go buy a home bargain one for £1. When I didn’t have anything, I still can’t magic up £1

No of course not.

But someone has said children on FSM aren’t singled out. They are.

Positive singling out is still being singled out. That’s really humiliating for some people. And even just being known as someone claiming FSM is for some people.

OP why don't you go to college and do something positive that will benefit you not only financially but also for your mental well-being?

Your energy is very wow is me/negative when it could be so much better and positive.

I did - and it changed my world.

And don't think for one moment I don't know what real poverty is - I do and probably a lot more than you do/are living. I have been on both sides.

And yes a lot of my wardrobe is Boden now.