To think most of MN don’t know what having no money means

[icecolddrinks]

And that admitting to having none is humiliating.

I see it here all the time. Someone has no money. Someone suggests something to make life easier. The person says again they have no money. MN suggest a cheaper version.

On the thread about dress up so many people were saying to tell the school.

I know debt and low incomes aren’t ideal but they aren’t uncommon either so why is it so hard to acknowledge that someone might have 3p in their bank account and no money?

I'm sorry @Comedycook - that kind of situation was exactly what I meant. We take for granted having a certain level of stability around us, even if it's not perfect. For some people it's about overcoming their background rather than being supported by it, which puts a person on the back foot to begin with.

For what it's worth I do believe it's possible to overcome circumstances, not for everyone, but possible - I hope that's the case for you if applicable.

For anyone who wants to see the poverty trap is highly recommend I, Daniel Blake. It perfectly illustrates how things can go wrong in the 'system' for a person and how poverty perpetuates itself, in the same way that wealth does in a positive way (e.g spending £500, recouping £350 on worn clothes)

Thanks for your understanding @Nayday

@Poptart4

There was a thread on here about savings before. One poster commented that "surely everyone has some savings to fall back on". It was the most shockingly of touch commented I've read on here.

Yes, this.

The other awful comment you often see is ‘if you couldn’t afford DC, you shouldn’t have had them’. It isn’t always a choice, or things might have changed drastically. It’s so callous.

@OlympicProcrastinator

I remember years ago being eligible for my kids to have FSM but I just couldn’t let the school know. I knew I’d be treated differently and so would my children. Also, when one of them was born I got repeated letters telling me to claim for free fruit and veg. But in order to do so, I’d have to go and tell my health visitor how poor I was and get her to sign something. Not something I felt I could do. So glad those days are over but it certainly shaped me as a person and taught me a lot about judging others without fully understanding circumstances.

I understand having no money but I don't understand this at all. IT basically says "I'm too proud to get my children what they needed and let them go without rather than get them what they were entitled to for free".

I understand having no money but I don't understand this at all. IT basically says "I'm too proud to get my children what they needed and let them go without rather than get them what they were entitled to for free

More likely what happened is the poster in this instance got her children what they needed, causing herself more financial hardship and probably going without herself.

More likely what happened is the poster in this instance got her children what they needed, causing herself more financial hardship and probably going without herself

she could have got what they were entitled to AND then had the money to spend on them as well. It amounts to the same thing, not just cutting off your nose to spite your face, but cutting off your kids noses.

I have a similar story. Came from a reasonably stable family, living in a mortgage free house. Both parents worked. I was doing ok at school. Then one of my parents died and the other didnt cope. I left school to Work and help missing my exams. I struggled through and eventually went to college on completing college i had my child who was born with disabilities and i had to give up work. Fast forward a few years i again studied through the open uni, got my degree and found a child care job. I am now working full time, earning just above minimum wage and still need to rely on tax credits. I love my job, am qualified. What would people really prefer, good qualified devoted experienced practitioners looking after their children while they go to their well paid high flying jobs or someone who is only in the job because they are waiting for something better to come along.

@Soberanne

I have a similar story. Came from a reasonably stable family, living in a mortgage free house. Both parents worked. I was doing ok at school. Then one of my parents died and the other didnt cope. I left school to Work and help missing my exams. I struggled through and eventually went to college on completing college i had my child who was born with disabilities and i had to give up work. Fast forward a few years i again studied through the open uni, got my degree and found a child care job. I am now working full time, earning just above minimum wage and still need to rely on tax credits. I love my job, am qualified. What would people really prefer, good qualified devoted experienced practitioners looking after their children while they go to their well paid high flying jobs or someone who is only in the job because they are waiting for something better to come along.

Oh wow, your life sounds so similar to mine! Well done for doing so well for yourself.

One of the problems within our society is The way we view certain jobs and the people who do them and thisis why so many people are stuck in the poverty trap. if we place little value to society of certain jobs then we can justify to ourselves the low wages. While people who are working hard, paying taxes etc continue to face searching down the sofa for money for milk or relying on food banks.

@claralara42 have you had to claim from a food bank? I haven't but I feel I can understand why some people would be reluctant to, stigma of associated poverty etc. Going without themselves to avoid it.

[quote Nayday]@claralara42 have you had to claim from a food bank? I haven't but I feel I can understand why some people would be reluctant to, stigma of associated poverty etc. Going without themselves to avoid it.[/quote]
Yes I have. And FSM, and free bloody butter vouchers. Because my pride is far far less important to me than my children...turning down free fruit and veg for them when you can't afford to provide it yourself is appalling selfish behavior.

@Comedycook thank you and be proud of yourself because somethings in life are out with our control and we are all just doing our best with what we have.

I had no money for the first 2 years I was a single parent, I mean no money, no savings, nothing, scraping down the back of the sofa, in old handbags & coat pockets to get enough money for one day's school dinner skint. I swore I would never be like that again & I haven't, I have savings now, all bills are paid on time.

If you had only followed the example of those MPs not too proud to claim expenses fo every KitKat, bus journey, poppy, partner/office assistant, duck house. That is were the poor go wrong in not leaping upon whatever benefit is available and choking every last gasp of life out of it. After all Eton is a charity you know.

@tomorrowalready well said.

@claralara42 I understand your point of view and i can also why people don't. Its just an all round tough situation, not sure it's down to selfishness exactly but that's just an opinion.

Everyone has had different experiences. I had no money for a while BUT I also knew that if push came to shove, I could call on family to help me out. I didn't because it would have been awkward and embarrassing. But it is one thing not to have money and another to have absolutely no chance of help at all. I think people offer advice in good faith generally though.

I posted once about a situation where I didn't get my £1 coin back out of a trolley, and got several replies telling me to get over it because it was "just a quid". Now losing that quid didn't affect me (other than being annoyed about the situation in which it happened) but for many people that quid would have bought a loaf of bread and a tin of beans, or a bag of pasta and a jar of sauce that they may have needed to feed their children that night. I work with children and their families in a deprived area and the level of poverty is disgusting to see. I do think many people don't realise that sometimes it does come down just "that quid".

Comedycook I completely identify with where you've come from, my own experience was very similar.

In my case I completely threw myself into education and work and while on paper I'm "successful" I had to make huge sacrifices. I'm having to accept that at 40 I'm unlikely to ever have a relationship or children, and my choice of career has been limited and continues to be limited.

I very much identify with the feeling of having so much wasted potential, albeit in a slightly different way.

You've done amazingly well. It makes me so angry to think of all the kids who could have grown up to be world famous musicians or heart surgeons if they'd only been given the tiniest bit of help. There's so much potential in the world that's not helped to grow.

Thank you for your comment @livingwitheds1984 I wish you all the best

@BoohBahs, I have definitely got the shop assistant to get my 1£ back in those circs. It represents 5% of my food budget. Have also been very pleased to get a coin someone else has left. I have never forgotten the lesson taught to me by being laughed at for handing in a found pound note (yeh last century). My Dad used to wonder how neighbours who earned more , had cars etc and smaller families got rate rebates (old CT) when he could not. I don't think it occurred to him they were lying about their income. Push, grab and hang on for dear life is what I see in the 'successful' classes of this (any ) country.

Yet many on here would say that saying no to magazines isn't true poverty because enough can afford to eat

Which is also part of the problem - why do people have to be at rock bottom before people decide they are "truly deserving" of help, and why do people have to justify every single penny of their expenditure in order to get any kind of help?

If you spend money on anything more than the literal basics of existing then there is judgement from people who waste more money on a daily basis than I have to spend in a month and gave never wanted for anything

It interesting you say that because I worked for some time, in what would be considered a deprived community, in a role where people told me about their lives, most were on tax credits or UC. They had plenty of justified issues, but lacking money wasn't really one of them. In a few occasions, people commented how generous the benefits were. Everyone, had cars, decent electronic appliances and roofs over thier heads. I actually think this is part of the Blue Wall thing that Labour don't get. I'm in the north, where housing costs are so much lower, I think that makes a huge difference.

@emmylousings, don't you think that level of satisfaction is more to do with low expectations? Basically most working class people are historically used to having just enough to get by and maybe some extra fun but the large scale, long term plans of the middle classes are beyond them. I know I actually do feel guilty at some level for having enough for a good diet , to keep warm, have hot water and heating, watch RV, use the Internet. Fortunately I don't smoke or drink but I don't have enough to visit my relatives, visit the cinema/theatre, eat out or take, contribute to any social group - many things that many here would consider essentials. Benefits are tightly calibrated to ensure survival nothing else hence the plan to remove the £20 UC uplift and pension triple lock - they can get by without it so they should get by without it.

@melj1213

Yet many on here would say that saying no to magazines isn't true poverty because enough can afford to eat

Which is also part of the problem - why do people have to be at rock bottom before people decide they are "truly deserving" of help, and why do people have to justify every single penny of their expenditure in order to get any kind of help?

If you spend money on anything more than the literal basics of existing then there is judgement from people who waste more money on a daily basis than I have to spend in a month and gave never wanted for anything

Exactly. That's what makes me sick about people going on about "oh she has her nails done and they have sky" without any understanding of how they've manipulated their finances to be able to afford those small luxuries