To say DH’s brother can’t stay.

[Martz]

Please excuse grammar and formatting, I’m on a mobile phone.

Am I being unreasonable to say that DH’s brother can’t stay at our house? BIL (27) is on the autistic spectrum, although he’s very much independent, holds down a job and takes himself off to music festivals/to other cities as/when he wants to go. PIL bought a house for him and he stays there sometimes, and other times stays with them. PIL are going away for the night and it’s been decided that BIL will stay with us for the night (neither DH or I were asked, we were just told by PIL that’s what was happening).

We have a 3 bedroom house- one room is ours, the second bedroom DC’s room (although he doesn’t sleep in it yet but it has all his nursery furniture in already so no room for anybody to stay), and the smallest room is used as a dressing room. We therefore don’t have a spare bed for him or any room to really put a bed.

He’s openly admitted he’s jealous of DC since their birth, we tried to facilitate some bonding so BIL didn’t feel left out because of a new baby coming into the family, but all it did was make BIL think that he could do as he pleased with DC and this has now caused issues in him becoming quite confrontational and angry towards us when he can’t sit holding DC all the time. He often makes jokes about accidentally dropping DC on their head, or other references to DC sustaining an “accidental injury”- which I don’t find funny and sometimes wonder if there’s an actual spiteful undertone to his “joke” as he’s said it a few times now. He also seems to find it amusing to stick his fingers in DC’s mouth, despite being asked not to on several occasions. DC is 3 months old and therefore nowhere near being weaned yet, however, BIL will often offer food to DC and just last week attempted to feed them some curry- again he’s been asked not to do this and it has been explained to him why he shouldn’t. BIL is now never left unsupervised with DC.

As we don’t have a spare bedroom for him to sleep in, he’d therefore have to sleep on the sofa. He stays awake all night watching TV and then doesn’t get up until late-afternoon. He becomes nasty and will push people if he can’t get his own way, and doesn’t like being woken up. We have to walk through the living room to get to the kitchen, so he will be disturbed in the morning. We also have a dog which sleeps downstairs, however he’s been quite nasty to the dog in the past and on several occasions I’ve had to talk to him about how he treats the dog. He’s kicked the dog in the past, he shouts at it, and pushes it out of the way. We let the dog sit on our sofa, but he doesn’t like this so will often push it off the sofa and then shout in its face or make loud noises to scare it from getting back on the sofa- which is completely unacceptable and the poor dog doesn’t understand what’s happening. As I say, I’ve spoken with him about this in the past, but issues with his behaviour continue to repeat themselves. I’m therefore not comfortable leaving him unsupervised with the dog at any time, and especially not while we’re upstairs asleep. We can’t let the dog sleep upstairs with us as it’s an old dog now and struggles with stairs. It also likes to potter around at night which wakes us up. This is why it sleeps downstairs as it’s a lot happier doing it’s own thing, and we get some sleep.

BIL’s moods are very much up/down. In the past he has punched holes in walls, run away or thrown things in anger if he hasn’t liked something that someone has said/done. He hasn’t done this for a few months now however.

I realise it looks like I’m painting BIL in a bad light, but this is how he behaves. It can become quite draining having to monitor his behaviour and treading on eggshells so as not to say/do anything that would upset him and trigger outbursts. I’m happy having him over to visit as there’s a time limit to it and if we can see he’s getting agitated, my DH will take him for a drive to calm down before dropping him back home. Some times he can visit and be absolutely fine, and he can be a pleasure to be around. Despite the issues I’ve mentioned, we do get on with him and do enjoy his company when he’s having a settled day. However, when he’s unsettled he’s really difficult to manage. We already know he will be unsettled and angsty due to PIL being away- as he often is.

DH has another brother who lives nearby (older BIL), he doesn’t have much time for younger BIL and says he feels his behaviour issues mainly stem from PIL spoiling him and giving in to his demands. However, I feel he may be a more suitable option for younger BIL as he and his partner have a spare bedroom and don’t have pets or children. The other option is that DH stays with younger BIL out of our house at the younger BIL’s house or at PIL’s house.

WIBU if I say BIL cannot stay? or should I just get on with it as it’s only for one night?

Lol sorry but wtf.

He is an adult emotionally mature (even if younger for his exact age, he still has some adult emotional maturity, and mentally stable enough to

1. Live independently
2. Hold down a job
3. Go to strange/different loud environments and socially interact with strangers (concerts/festivals)

....
Yet people on here are infantilising him? Oh give over.

This guy sounds like a twat. Not because of his autism or due to it. Simply because, he is a twat. And an intimidating one at that.

As an autistic adult, I can control my meltdowns well enough to know not to hit people! If anything, autistics having meltdowns are far more likely to hurt themselves!. He has clearly happily got away with lashing out at others all these years and that is beyond pathetic. Yeah. Meltdowns don't go away as you get older, but he clearly has enough coping mechanisms to handle everyday life, why hasn't he attempted to handle meltdowns safely when near other people?

He sounds like a very manipulative whiny man. Autstic or not.

I'd tell him to jog on back home and not to come back until he has made some needed changes.

I've only read page 1 but YANBU whatsoever.

If he can go to festivals and travel independently I'm sure he's perfectly capable of spending a night alone in his own house, otherwise why would they buy one for him?!

Autism or not (and i have a son with ASD myself) his behaviour sounds dangerous and I wouldn't want him left alone with the dog or baby if I were you either.

Tell them no sorry, he can't.

Totally not unreasonable but you have to have OH on side or you will struggle to set a limit. I think the idea of DH going there was a good one.

"He is an adult emotionally mature (even if younger for his exact age, he still has some adult emotional maturity, and mentally stable enough to

1. Live independently
2. Hold down a job
3. Go to strange/different loud environments and socially interact with strangers (concerts/festivals)"

This is so full of assumptions. You don't know how well he does with any of this because we only know what the OP says. And also, he lives semi independent (hence needing care when PIL are away). And not every autistic person has sounds sensitivities. And you also know nothing about how well he interacts socially with others (my guess is not well).
Please educate yourself on autism spectrum disorder in adults.

Please educate yourself on autism spectrum disorder in adults

I actually am autistic and I couldn't disagree with you more.
Being autistic does not excuse you assaulting animals. Not if you've got functionality to the point where you can work and go to festivals.

Being autistic does not excuse you assaulting animals.

Absolutely.

My DS is only 3.5 and is severely autistic (I hate that term, but it is what it is) and even he knows not to hit or kick animals ffs.

Yanbu, he can't really be trusted in your home if he says things like that about a 3 month old and doing what he does to a poor dog, he should not be staying.

@unidentifed

I honestly cannot believe what I am reading here.

He has AUTISM. He isn't a potential sociopath. FGS. This is why our society is the way it is, because no one has any compassion.

Is your DH the only sibling your BIL has?

Do you know much about Autism?

Individuals with ASD (or autistics as some preferred to be called) struggle with social communication skills, and restricted interests and repetitive behaviours. The latter means that any changes in routine can cause immense distress and anxiety. So PIL going away is a HUGE change for him. A lack of social communication skills explain why he has no "filter" and why he struggles to self regulate (behaving the way he does when things don't go his way because he hasn't learned how to deal with disappointment).

Am I saying he should stay because of this? Absolutely not. Your baby's safety comes first. I may offer to just go in your position (to your parents).

Your BIL can be taught to self regulate and you can teach him appropriate versus inappropriate behaviours in your home. He may need this to be explained in a way that is more direct than you would typically tell a neurotypical person and you may need to have rules that are typically "unspoken".

Just to all the posters saying some really harsh things, this is a man who is likely emotionally 10 years old. Would you say the things you have about a 10 year old?

I can understand this comment if all he did was go to work and go home. Because then he might be masking for work. But he is capable of going out by himself - to places that are not the most calm and structured (festivals , next to nightclubs are probably some of the most chaotic places). He understand that behaving badly in these places has a consequence and makes the effort to control himself. He clearly doesn't bother when around 'family' because of PIL's enabling attitude.

I have ADHD, DP has autism and several autistic posters (the ND posters are normally quite vocal about disablist comments on this site) have commented to say that this is not normal.

Or, you the baby and the dog could stay at PILs vacant house and DH can cope with BIL on his own.

@unidentifed I love how you're telling actual autistic people to go and educate themselves lmaoooo carry on

@Motherissues2020

My BIL has Aspergers and sounds similar. Although I'm no expert, and as the saying goes, if you know one person with autism, you know... one person with autism.

I think the jokes about the baby are misjudged humour. He's not picking up on the social cues that you're uncomfortable and he's going too far. You have to be blunt, tell him you don't find it funny and ask him directly to stop.

My BIL also loved to hold my DC, a bit like they were a doll, it was fine when they were very little. He loves his nieces very much, but he doesn't really get how to interact with them. I had ground rules, he always held them sitting down on the sofa, me or DH in the room, and that was fine. He also appreciates a hard and fast rule, and my main one is that whatever I say to do with DC goes, no arguments. I'm quite firm, and after a couple of times where he tried to tell me what to do, that's been fine. He's more likely to argue with DH tbh. He can tell I mean it and won't take any shit.

It's very useful as now my oldest is 4, he likes to tease her, or tickle fight with her, and he doesn't always judge where the line between good fun and too far is that well. He doesn't know his own strength and isn't a great judge of personal space. I can just say that's enough stop now, and he will listen. DD will also tell him directly to stop and he will usually then as well. She gets it already that you need to tell him firmly, or get another adult involved.

He is also, a bit the same with our cats. He loves to stroke them, but he has no idea when they have had enough. I try and point out their flicking tails, head movements etc but it's hard for him to notice. And in his mind, that's what you do with cats, you stroke them, and they like it. I wonder if you BIL has some kind of rule in his head that dogs aren't allowed on sofas, and can't see the nuance, that it's your house, your dog and your sofa, so it's okay. Not that I want to excuse him treating animals poorly, but just trying to see where it might be coming from?

BIL can also get really anxious, and angry at himself, and has walked off, and shouted loudly in the past. He hasn't hit anyone or anything to my knowledge, but generally his family know to leave him to calm down/walk it off and don't physically intervene. It often stems from him having misjudged things socially. He's not able to realise in the moment what it is he's doing wrong and to alter his behaviour but he is very aware afterwards that people are annoyed and he gets very cross with himself about it.

I think in your shoes, I'd get DH or other BIL to stay with him elsewhere, as you don't have the space, plus are still adjusting to being a family of 3.

Longer term, I'd think about how you can manage BIL and DCs relationship. I try and plan a few things BIL can do safely with DC. For example, he takes older DD to feed the fish and fill up the bird feeders, that's "their job". He pulls faces to keep younger DD occupied while someone changes her nappy. He gets out bath toys and puts them away at bath time (but doesn't do any personal care or playing). He likes to push the pram if we go for a walk.

Basically, he loves them and wants to be involved but isn't always sure how. Clear instructions and jobs to involve him seem to work for my BIL.

Ableist. The OP is not describing traits which are typical of Asperger’s (eg threatening the child or dog). It is so unfair to try to paint this behaviour as representative.

@2bazookas

Or, you the baby and the dog could stay at PILs vacant house and DH can cope with BIL on his own.

Or dh goes to pils house and stays with his brother.

Why would the OP leave her home?!

He said he’s going to speak to PIL to ask them to make alternative arrangements for BIL
He needs to 'tell' them, not give them an opportunity to refuse.

"PIL bought a house for him and he stays there sometimes, and other times stays with them. PIL are going away for the night and it’s been decided that BIL will stay with us for the night (neither DH or I were asked, we were just told by PIL that’s what was happening)."

On the basis of being told not asked - that's a hard no. Doesn't matter what it is, you TELL me I'm doing something to make your life easier and I have no say in the matter - NO!

And I see no need for him to stay at yours. He has his own house which he stays alone in. BIL sounds like a nightmare and I wouldn't have him in my house to visit, never mind overnight.

He would not be setting foot in my house at all if he made sick jokes about dropping my tiny baby or was cruel to an animal

This is so full of assumptions. You don't know how well he does with any of this because we only know what the OP says. And also, he lives semi independent (hence needing care when PIL are away). And not every autistic person has sounds sensitivities. And you also know nothing about how well he interacts socially with others (my guess is not well).
Please educate yourself on autism spectrum disorder in adults.

@unidentified

I'm soooo very sorry you struggle with reading comprehension. Here's another list

1. I- AS IN MYSELF, AM AN AUTISTIC ADULT

2. He works! He holds down a freaking job! That would be impossible if he truly lacked social awareness/was that offensive/couldn't do things for himself.

3. he lives independently. Independently. Please use a dictionary to look up that word. K

4. he goes off to festivals. Festivals/concerts! Seriously. Cause as an autistic woman. I personally would not cope in those environments. He clearly has some very good coping mechanisms for such high sress environments he attends often.

Wonder why those coping mechanisms don't translate to family interactions

Please educate yourself. You are ableistic and it's wrong.

My good god this has nothing to do with his autism. People with autism can be nice people or nasty people just like anyone else. He sounds like the latter!

Him talking about injuries to the baby is chilling. Protect your family and don’t allow him in your home.

@Bettysnow

He would not be setting foot in my house at all if he made sick jokes about dropping my tiny baby or was cruel to an animal

That was my first thought. Hard no all the way.

@Martz

Please excuse grammar and formatting, I’m on a mobile phone.

Am I being unreasonable to say that DH’s brother can’t stay at our house? BIL (27) is on the autistic spectrum, although he’s very much independent, holds down a job and takes himself off to music festivals/to other cities as/when he wants to go. PIL bought a house for him and he stays there sometimes, and other times stays with them. PIL are going away for the night and it’s been decided that BIL will stay with us for the night (neither DH or I were asked, we were just told by PIL that’s what was happening).

We have a 3 bedroom house- one room is ours, the second bedroom DC’s room (although he doesn’t sleep in it yet but it has all his nursery furniture in already so no room for anybody to stay), and the smallest room is used as a dressing room. We therefore don’t have a spare bed for him or any room to really put a bed.

He’s openly admitted he’s jealous of DC since their birth, we tried to facilitate some bonding so BIL didn’t feel left out because of a new baby coming into the family, but all it did was make BIL think that he could do as he pleased with DC and this has now caused issues in him becoming quite confrontational and angry towards us when he can’t sit holding DC all the time. He often makes jokes about accidentally dropping DC on their head, or other references to DC sustaining an “accidental injury”- which I don’t find funny and sometimes wonder if there’s an actual spiteful undertone to his “joke” as he’s said it a few times now. He also seems to find it amusing to stick his fingers in DC’s mouth, despite being asked not to on several occasions. DC is 3 months old and therefore nowhere near being weaned yet, however, BIL will often offer food to DC and just last week attempted to feed them some curry- again he’s been asked not to do this and it has been explained to him why he shouldn’t. BIL is now never left unsupervised with DC.

As we don’t have a spare bedroom for him to sleep in, he’d therefore have to sleep on the sofa. He stays awake all night watching TV and then doesn’t get up until late-afternoon. He becomes nasty and will push people if he can’t get his own way, and doesn’t like being woken up. We have to walk through the living room to get to the kitchen, so he will be disturbed in the morning. We also have a dog which sleeps downstairs, however he’s been quite nasty to the dog in the past and on several occasions I’ve had to talk to him about how he treats the dog. He’s kicked the dog in the past, he shouts at it, and pushes it out of the way. We let the dog sit on our sofa, but he doesn’t like this so will often push it off the sofa and then shout in its face or make loud noises to scare it from getting back on the sofa- which is completely unacceptable and the poor dog doesn’t understand what’s happening. As I say, I’ve spoken with him about this in the past, but issues with his behaviour continue to repeat themselves. I’m therefore not comfortable leaving him unsupervised with the dog at any time, and especially not while we’re upstairs asleep. We can’t let the dog sleep upstairs with us as it’s an old dog now and struggles with stairs. It also likes to potter around at night which wakes us up. This is why it sleeps downstairs as it’s a lot happier doing it’s own thing, and we get some sleep.

BIL’s moods are very much up/down. In the past he has punched holes in walls, run away or thrown things in anger if he hasn’t liked something that someone has said/done. He hasn’t done this for a few months now however.

I realise it looks like I’m painting BIL in a bad light, but this is how he behaves. It can become quite draining having to monitor his behaviour and treading on eggshells so as not to say/do anything that would upset him and trigger outbursts. I’m happy having him over to visit as there’s a time limit to it and if we can see he’s getting agitated, my DH will take him for a drive to calm down before dropping him back home. Some times he can visit and be absolutely fine, and he can be a pleasure to be around. Despite the issues I’ve mentioned, we do get on with him and do enjoy his company when he’s having a settled day. However, when he’s unsettled he’s really difficult to manage. We already know he will be unsettled and angsty due to PIL being away- as he often is.

DH has another brother who lives nearby (older BIL), he doesn’t have much time for younger BIL and says he feels his behaviour issues mainly stem from PIL spoiling him and giving in to his demands. However, I feel he may be a more suitable option for younger BIL as he and his partner have a spare bedroom and don’t have pets or children. The other option is that DH stays with younger BIL out of our house at the younger BIL’s house or at PIL’s house.

WIBU if I say BIL cannot stay? or should I just get on with it as it’s only for one night?

Quite simply, no, you have a baby , that his actions prove, he cannot be sensible, and omg the poor dog, straight away huge red flags.

Besides you say one night, what if that one night a major incident happens ?

Nope. Not unreasonable!
I have an autistic adult son..who has just become an uncle.
DS2 is very autistic. But he was excited to be an uncle, we have gently introduced him to the baby...and 12 weeks later he can cuddle him to sleep, sings to him (sort of!), and has even changed a nappy under DD2's guidance!
He would never be mean to any animal either.. our dog is the love of his life. Autism isn't an excuse for frankly shitty behaviour, and I wouldn't let your BIL within shouting distance of your baby or dog at all.
If he can manage a job and has a house... he does not need babysitting!

@Martz well done both of you for clearly establishing boundaries. I know that PIL are undoubtedly exhausted caring for adult son, but telling you that he was staying at your place (regardless of his age or ability) is not okay. It’s YOUR house, and they should have asked you. Secondly, his behaviours are not safe for you, your baby or your dog. It’s irresponsible and continually minimising his aggression is undoubtedly one of the reasons why he hasn’t had the help he’s needed to learn to manage his behaviour in the first place.

@unidentifed

"He is an adult emotionally mature (even if younger for his exact age, he still has some adult emotional maturity, and mentally stable enough to 1) Live independently 2) Hold down a job 3) Go to strange/different loud environments and socially interact with strangers (concerts/festivals)"

This is so full of assumptions. You don't know how well he does with any of this because we only know what the OP says. And also, he lives semi independent (hence needing care when PIL are away). And not every autistic person has sounds sensitivities. And you also know nothing about how well he interacts socially with others (my guess is not well).
Please educate yourself on autism spectrum disorder in adults.

Are you actually listening to the people with autism that are disagreeing with you?

[quote CastawayQueen]@unidentifed I love how you're telling actual autistic people to go and educate themselves lmaoooo carry on[/quote]
Exactly. The sheer arrogance!

Nah he's an adult and not your problem. Just like how the other sibling won't entertain any of this, so shouldn't you and your dh. He sounds extremely unlikable and I would not be having him stay over whatsoever. In fact, I would keep visits to Pil home so they supervise him and its not your problem.