So embarrassed to be English today

[UpSlyDown]

Usually I am slightly defensive of the criticism the English get but today I feel like I have nothing left to defend. Riots, defacing murals of wonderful role models for our children, racism, violence. Horrendous behaviour from a considerable number of English fans. We are just playing up to the thuggish, drunk, stupid stereotypes. That along with the decision to just open everything up which has been highly criticised for being bonkers, the never-ending shame of Brexit. For the first time I feel embarrassed to be English and associated with any of this. Having said that, I personally don't know a single person who behaved badly post match or spewed vile racism online (thank god). I also mainly socialise/spend time with left wing remainers it seems.

Does anyone feel the same? Are there any redeeming features of the English or are we doomed to be the laughing stock of the world? I was so proud of our football team (still am) and the unity and excitement everyone felt. Part of me thinks this would have been so different if we won but why should it be?! We should be able to respond to a disappointment like rational adults instead of abusive idiots.

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

Today, Marsha, I am addressing it by calling out the minimising and denial on this thread. On other days I have called it out in real life, at some personal cost to myself. And I will continue to do so.

And how will you be addressing it? Or perhaps you don't think you need to?

What do you want people to do twist themselves in knots proving how not racist they are? That's not really addressing racism is it?

Maybe try being proud of the masses who have being disgusted at the trolling and have supported Rashford, Sancho and Saka.

Absolutely. They are a stalwart example of actively standing up against racism, rather than denying the problem exists or proclaiming that they personally are not racist. And we've come a long way, given overt racism is now actively frowned upon. The problem is that it's often the covert variety that is the more insidious and holds people back more. If you're part of the hegemonic race this kind of thing often passes you by until something gives you a lightbulb moment.

This isn't about 'all English individuals are shameful racists'. It's about recognising that our whole society is institutionally structured with a racial bias and acknowledging and addressing that with a hopeful move toward a fairer society in the future.

Trying to claim we don't have problems in this country with racism, or that other places have it worse, really isn't helpful.

On what I’m doing I prefer to lift up and focus on the good. Trolls and online abusers prosper because what they are primarily after is attention.

I much prefer to talk about the brilliance of the football team, they show better who we will be than the negative attention seeking in the world.

Or put another way, Marsha, you ignore the problem.

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

Or put another way, Marsha, you ignore the problem.

Yell me what did you do re the Instagram abuse exactly?

Tell

Apart from come on a site with majority women who had nothing to do with it and say you should be ashamed

What do you want people to do twist themselves in knots proving how not racist they are?
That's not really addressing racism is it?

Not what I said at all, is it?
I don't require anyone to prove anything. I do expect us all to play our part in challenging racism rather than pretending its nothing to do with us.

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

Or put another way, Marsha, you ignore the problem.

Whilst you are just arguing with people on a mumsnet thread who happen to disagree with you this is not tackling racism

@MarshaBradyo

Apart from come on a site with majority women who had nothing to do with it and say you should be ashamed

Yes that's exactly what I did isn't it...seek out a group of women online and tell them "they" should be ashamed.

You are resorting to twisting my words now, just go back and read my posts if you are at all confused.

We should all be ashamed of racism in our society. It is our problem, not someone else's.

I’m asking a direct question

What did you do re Instagram posts?

I do play my part and I do tackle racism
And whilst I'm disgusted by racist fans
What exactly have I got to be ashamed of, I don't spout racist slurs all over social media neither do I start fights at Wembley stadium

Weird question Marsha! I am not on Instagram.
What is the correct course of action? What did you do?

' I can feel comforted (i) that most of us accept that the problem of racism is something that we (English) should be ashamed of, (ii) that the conduct of the English fans evidences that problem, (iii) that the problem is not limited to the conduct of English football fans, and (iv) that we are all responsible for addressing it.'

Erm, exactly? If you rtft you will see that everyone is ashamed of the conduct of racism people. We are also proud of the many that stand up to it and the massive public support of Rashford, Saka and Sancho.

The problem is the general hating English sentiment expressed by many on this thread. It's racist you see. Ironic, but true.

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

Weird question Marsha! I am not on Instagram. What is the correct course of action? What did you do?

Why weird

You are upset about racism m, have you completely missed what started this discussion?

Abuse on social media - Instagram primarily and probably Twitter

You can join and address it if so inclined

We are an easier audience. Of course everyone on this thread is against racism (although some are fine with xenophobia)

But all the talk of addressing it and it’s easy to post as some have, virtue signalling really, but the reality is very few would venture to engage with racist abuse on Instagram

@MarshaBradyo

On what I’m doing I prefer to lift up and focus on the good. Trolls and online abusers prosper because what they are primarily after is attention.

I much prefer to talk about the brilliance of the football team, they show better who we will be than the negative attention seeking in the world.

Exactly.

The widespread public support and Rashford's comments are inspiring 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿.

I think you are saying Marsha that you saw racist abuse on Instagram but did not engage with it.
I just asked my 21 year old, she said that she and her friends had spent some time reporting posts. Perhaps that is something we could both do?

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

I think you are saying Marsha that you saw racist abuse on Instagram but did not engage with it. I just asked my 21 year old, she said that she and her friends had spent some time reporting posts. Perhaps that is something we could both do?

I saw it on here actually. But no I would never engage with trolls in that way. I would tell my dc to never respond also.

I’m hoping police will trace back and deal with it. Which they can do if the comments don’t disappear.

The problem is the general hating English sentiment expressed by many on this thread. It's racist you see. Ironic, but true

no doubt those who say they hate the English have a view of a white man in their head which is also racist. As we know, we have very many non-white English people in the population - evidenced by the England football team and from next week the Team GB Olympic team. People who say they hate the English should have a look at their own prejudices which no doubt won't be confined to racism but also sex, class, size and accent.

Agree, @igelkott2021 . Some on this thread are extremely classist - in fact just simple snobs.

I think they should just admit that they don’t like common people.

Far more proud of the likes of Marcus Rushford representing what is good about England than I am of plenty of knuckle dragging idiots who represent all that is bad.

@VerticalHorizon

Far more proud of the likes of Marcus Rushford representing what is good about England than I am of plenty of knuckle dragging idiots who represent all that is bad.

Abuse on social media - Instagram primarily and probably Twitter

The English premiership recently did research on this, they found that 7 out of 10 racially abusive tweets/sm comments were from abroad. India was by far the highest for racially abusing premiership players, also the middle east was high

The problem is foreign social media accounts can be hard to prosecute.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/jul/13/manchester-shows-support-for-marcus-rashford-its-evolved-into-something-special

This is lovely though