Can't afford school fees

[Theemptyvase]

I've just found out that my DC is no longer entitled to a free place at her private school.

She's 6 years old and has now completed two years of school and, having found it very hard the first year, she has now settled down and is getting on very well indeed.

There's a possibility that a place will once again become available in a year or two, so we are deciding whether to try to pay the fees ourselves in the hope that:
A) a free place once again becomes available, or
B) in a year or two she'll have the confidence to move school with less trauma

She's made so much progress at her school and become so much more comfortable in her own skin that I'm loathe to move her (despite the alternative school being absolutely fine). We can pay the fees ourself but it will be with quite some sacrifice - we'll be able to afford the mortgage, insurance, food albeit with being much more careful at the supermarket etc, but we'll have no savings and the luxuries will have to go.

I'm strongly inclined to believe that a really positive school experience is worth these sacrifices, but I know I'm biased on these matters. Please could anyone with experience of fee problems and/or shy/sensitive children please offer their advice?

For voting; YANBU to pay school fees. YABU - man up and send her to the other school.

Thanks

@Theemptyvase

I am still here, but aside from a few helpful posters the conversation has largely moved on from the original question.

To clarify, it's not at all the matter of private vs state that's bothering me, it's moving my child out of a class where she is settled and happy and putting her in another one which might go well or might not.

You still haven't said if you have been to talk to the Head on this. That's something I've repeatedly asked, as a former teacher myself in a private school.

Have you talked to them and explained your finances? Have they worked within employment law?

As an educational professional you ought to know your own child best and how she could cope with a new school if that is what you choose.

Sorry but these are not decisions for people on the internet.

Have I missed something with your posts?

Because term has ended now in private schools.
State schools have a week or two left.

Are you saying that you will make this decision over the summer without

1 Viewing local state schools and seeing if they have a place?

2 Talking to the head of the private school?

3 Preparing your daughter for the fact she may not go back to her current school in Sept, and hasn't had the chance to say goodbye to her friends?

It all sounds quite odd.

At 6 just move her. My kids used to go to a private international school - we moved back and they switched to a state primary. It's lovely and they're both fine. One of them was 6 when we moved

@Theemptyvase

I am still here, but aside from a few helpful posters the conversation has largely moved on from the original question.

To clarify, it's not at all the matter of private vs state that's bothering me, it's moving my child out of a class where she is settled and happy and putting her in another one which might go well or might not.

I think you need to consider whether you can afford the full fees until your DD’s at an age where she’d be leaving the school. And take into account likely annual fee rises while you’re doing that.

I’d assume that free fees are gone for good. They’ve moved from full fees to you paying 100%. If they’re not even willing to offer discounted fees at this stage, then I can’t see totally free fees - or even significantly discounted fees - returning in the foreseeable future.
Although having said that, comments pp have made about talking to the head about your finances, and talking to other staff affected, are worth following up. It may be possible for you to negotiate a discount.

But ultimately, if you’re not going to be able to afford the fees until your DD ages out of the school, I think it would be easier on your DD to move her when she’s younger.

The over 10 years old car wasn’t a dig at state school parents, if anything it was the fact that we don’t have the same sorts of car as other parents in the school.

After 10 years, the car does start to have more reoccurring issues and wear, especially with amount of use it gets!

What sort of school offers something free then removes it ? This isn't a healthy environment nor a compassionate place

@happycroydondadof4

What sort of school offers something free then removes it ? This isn't a healthy environment nor a compassionate place

The sort of school that is on its knees and just cannot afford for 10+% of the students to be there for free??

Too not offer any discount level following the withdrawal of a free place is wreckless, you do need to find a new job .

Part of your terms and conditions have altered with no date of resinstament , the school must be in serious financial difficulties your future job seems uncertain too! Move her and find a new job .

Have you sat down and made a proper budget to see exactly how much you'd have to cut corners to afford private school "for a year or two"?

And then consider what if the washing machine or boiler breaks or you need dental work or a complex new prescription for glasses? It's likely you'll have some unexpected expenses in the next year or two so how would you fund them? Look up the Micawber Principle. Unfortunately, it sounds like you might be sixpence short if you try to fund school fees. Which could make the decision for you.

What sort of school offers something free then removes it ?

One that can’t afford it?

Shouldn't have been offered in the first place it's unsustainable, most offer 30% and 40% to more senior staff. I would suspect it's a small school with no idea of what is market rate.

What ever the case they have poor planning and you need to be careful, stay an extra term until the council find you a school and start looking for another job you can do without the uncertainty.

I wouldn't want to be some where that gives staff things and takes them back, I would rather them honour the arrangement and reduce staff headcount to show face. They are playing around with your child's future lucky for you she isn't at GCSE or A level stage !

If a schools survival depends on the teachers paying fees I would be very worried. You might want to invest this

@justasking111

If a schools survival depends on the teachers paying fees I would be very worried. You might want to invest this

It's not the teachers having to pay the fees per se ... It's the parents of those children who are attending the school that are having to pay the fees.

And clearly the school is financially screwed. A d it's no surprise with over 10% of the cohort not paying fees... That's possibly an entire year group not paying fees ...

@Theemptyvase

I am still here, but aside from a few helpful posters the conversation has largely moved on from the original question.

To clarify, it's not at all the matter of private vs state that's bothering me, it's moving my child out of a class where she is settled and happy and putting her in another one which might go well or might not.

OP, if you haven’t yet decided whether or not to take your daughter out, how can the school hope to fill the places with other few-paying pupils by September?

Also, why won’t you engage with people giving you advice about how to challenge this, which would remove your dilemma altogether? Are all your colleagues just rolling over too?

Are you in a union, or do you have access to legal advice? The fact that the school has not been charging fees for the children of staff is ample evidence that it's an agreed benefit for employees which they can't just withdraw at will, especially at such short notice.

So, OP goes to the union and "wins".
Hooray, free places for everyone.

Fast forward two years>>>School is closed, she had no job and DD has no school... Great, everyone's a winner 🏆

@00100001

So, OP goes to the union and "wins". Hooray, free places for everyone.

Fast forward two years>>>School is closed, she had no job and DD has no school... Great, everyone's a winner 🏆

Goodness, not necessarily. That's an incredibly one sided simplistic view. Having a staff child there does not actually cost that much money.

Often parents stay with the schools for the teachers. If the teachers can't work to the best of their ability due to logistics or unhappiness, they will leave and parents follow.

Therefore, offering staff places for their children retains staff loyalty, which in turn presents a steady and secure team, retaining the loyalty of their families.

It's not complicated.

The OP said 10% are staff kids.. that's not taking into account any bursaries etc.

They could easily be the equivalent of an entire year group not paying.
It's not like it's the odd child. Which yes, wouldn't make much difference. But if the school has 400 kids, and 45 aren't paying, then it's going to be close cut with money...

I

@00100001

The OP said 10% are staff kids.. that's not taking into account any bursaries etc.

They could easily be the equivalent of an entire year group not paying.
It's not like it's the odd child. Which yes, wouldn't make much difference. But if the school has 400 kids, and 45 aren't paying, then it's going to be close cut with money...

I

You are making up your own scenarios to suit your narrative.

I have worked in three private schools, (inc a massive one with 200 staff members) and it is always part of the business plan.

There is always a way.

But you carry on...

If the school has 2000 then sure, economies of scale might kick in.

Bit I'm going to presume that the school hasn't taken the decision lightly,so would imply its smaller school

Fast forward two years>>>School is closed, she had no job and DD has no school... Great, everyone's a winner

If the school is going to collapse due to losing the fees for one child, it's going to collapse anyway.

And if OP has to withdraw her child because of what the school has done, it is no better off as it has an empty place, and potentially has to incur the cost of recruiting a replacement staff member if OP buggers off. It simply makes no sense economically.

@Terhou

Fast forward two years>>>School is closed, she had no job and DD has no school... Great, everyone's a winner

If the school is going to collapse due to losing the fees for one child, it's going to collapse anyway.

And if OP has to withdraw her child because of what the school has done, it is no better off as it has an empty place, and potentially has to incur the cost of recruiting a replacement staff member if OP buggers off. It simply makes no sense economically.

But it's not one child.

It all the staff kids, which OP says is 10%
They can't give OP a free place and bit everyone else, surely?

Is it worth speaking to the school with your concerns and ask if they could still partially fund? Offer to pay the difference if/when they offer full funding again? They may be willing to do that rather than make her leave. It's a difficult decision OP. I moved my DD when my first choice state school came available- ofsted outstanding school, great rep - standards have changed a lot in schools since I was at school though and I wish I'd have kept her in the private one. That's more as I feel she's been left to coast. Having said that, kids are resilient and they've all had to deal with alot of change this year. How has she found that?

It is quite a large school - 600 children - so the burden of staff children is quite high. It is (was) the only school in the area offering free places for staff children so I think too many of us teachers joined with exactly that in mind. I certainly did.

And yes, for those that asked, we were told about 4 days before the end of the school year. Not a nice way to finish up the year! My daughter still has no idea about this issue as I didn't want to spring it on her unresolved. I thought that at least being able to present a complete decision with positivity would reassure her.

We're speaking to the management team at the moment and it looks like they are willing to compromise at around 30 percent discount at least for another year, which will make it more manageable for us. At the same time, I recognise the advice of many PPs and wonder if it's not better to get her out and resettled elsewhere now rather than prolonging the agony.

I'm not sure what you should do about your DD, but the very late notice does suggest a school on its uppers financially - if they lose a lot of staff this way, they're saved a bit on free places only to incur loads of recruitment costs and potentially also reduced the attractiveness of the school if the numbers fall and key staff are missing (e.g. if the specialist art or.languages teacher goes). Next thing will be they leave TPS, if they haven't already. I'd play hardball as a group if I were you. Get the accounts from Companies' House and have a look. Tell them you need a term's notice of such a significant change. You need to know more.about their finances to make a judgement if they'll still be trading in September...