Was neighbour or myself BU?

[NeighbourWoes]

We live in a building of flats which have communal gardens front and back. The back is much bigger and more for recreational use and the front is more of a flower bed type garden but still a decent size. To get to the back garden we have to walk around a street and use a key so it's not very convenient. Myself, DH and DS (2) live on the third floor and since lockdown we got into the habit of watering the flowers in the front garden. This was initiated by the communal gardener who got DS a watering can etc.

We do it probably 4 or 5 times a week, for 10 minutes a time. DS likes to fill up the watering can from the hose pipe and it's a sedate activity where we enjoy looking at the flowers but by no means make much noise or anything like that.

The hosepipe is directly by one of the ground floor flats windows. This ground floor flat doesn't have direct access to the communal garden but their window from the kitchen/ living room looks out directly onto it. This flat is occupied by a single older lady in her late 70s and we have always had a bit of a chat and been very friendly and she chats about DS etc.

This morning DS and I were in the garden for approximately 10 minutes just after 8am. We thought no more of it. This evening as we were coming in the neighbour came out of her flat very angry and exasperated and said that this morning was ridiculous because she was trying to have her breakfast and look out of her window and we were "right there". (I did notice this morning that she shut her curtains as we came into the garden.) She asked us to stop playing in that part of the garden but from the off was quite aggressive. I said I didn't ever realise this was an issue at all and she barked "I'm telling you right now it is!" She said it was ridiculous that we were so close to her window.

The issue is that's where the hosepipe is for filling up the watering can plus all the plant pots. Previously she has always come out and thanked DS for watering her pots saying it saved her a job so I have no idea where this came from.

I said to her that I was sorry she was upset but it's a communal space and she was very agitated. DH then arrived home and asked what the problem was and she was shrieking a bit and he told her "it won't happen again", but I'm annoyed as it's not her right to tell her we can't use that part of the garden.

I walked away and got quite emotional because all during lockdown I've struggled living in a third floor flat with no private garden and this is one thing DS looks forward to each day and asks to do, and this previously friendly neighbour suddenly became hostile and has spoilt that for him.

Who is being unreasonable?

YANBU

I think a lot of the people on here just love to have a go at the OP regardless of what is asked. I can bet that if the reverse was posted (ie the elderly lady posting) that the same people would be telling her to wind her neck in and that it was a communal garden! AIBU is where the vipers love to hang out

[quote NeighbourWoes]@Fiddliestofsticks English isn't my first language sorry[/quote]
That is something you should never have to apologise for.

8am is problematic.

Can you fill the watering can in your flat so you aren't making noise right outside her window?

For people who keep saying she has dementia, I don't have dementia but if I got up in the morning with my nightie on, my hair a mess and no makeup, I would be less than appreciative to have people wandering past my windows and possibly looking in. I would be on tenterhooks every day, working myself up at the thought of people being outside my window. And even if you weren't looking in, I'd think you were going to. Not only would I say something to the op, but the gardener would be getting a flea in his ear as well. Would you like the window cleaners doing your windows every morning at 7 whilst you're wandering around getting ready?

8am is too early. Do it later. I think her complaint is about the time

Just want to add, I would be very annoyed but you sound like a lovely mum, who's trying to find something nice for your son to do. Is he noisy at 2? They can't always control the volume of their voice at 2. Sorry if I sounded a bit sharp in my last post but I'm not a morning person. Presumably like your neighbour.

Sorry but it is rude, it wouldn't be usual to be so close to someone else's window. I suspect she has been getting frustrated by it but this occasion she was having breakfast probably undressed and felt unable to relax or felt exposed or whatever. Why would you want to cause her distress whatever is right. How would you feel with two heads bobbing up and down near your window?

Can you not give her window a wide birth? And who do the pots belong to? Generally communal gardens don't have pots and opt for planted boarders. Most developments actually use planting to provide those living on the ground floor with a privacy strip thst people can not walk on.

Be considerate of others why not make more of an event of it and walk around to thr main garden to water things. If you don't have a pipe on thst side why not just bring a large bottle or water from your flat and fill your child's watering can from that and make more of an event of walking to the garden.

YANBU! You are a resident using a communal space for a few moments. You didn't wake her, you weren't hanging around playing a noisy game for an hour.
She has a ground floor that has a window overlooking a communal garden. She is BU!
If you were spending an hour there, I might say leave it a bit later in the morning, but she was already awake and it was a only a 10 minute activity.

And her reaction was disproportionate. She may well have stress going on in her life but that is no reason to take it out on others.
She owes you an apology.

YWBU. She clearly doesn't mind you doing it later in the day, so stick to the afternoons. It's really intrusive to be standing outside someone's window at that time of the morning.

YABU and inconsiderate. You shouldn’t have been there so early in the morning when she’s not likely fully awake, not properly dressed and just wants privacy.

When she moved to her ground floor flat she did so for that reason to have the garden but sorry she can't claim it for herself as its not hers

No, she probably moved to her ground-floor flat because she knew that eventually her mobility would worsen and she wouldn't be able to manage stairs!!

OP, I think she overreacted on the spur of the moment and could well be regretting her outburst - seeing you both at her window so early shocked her and she felt a bit besieged. I'd put a not through her door saying you had no intention of upsetting her and will, in future, keep your gardening trips to later in the day. You may get an apology back but I think it's unlikely as, rightly or wrongly, she feels hard done by.

YWBU @NeighbourWoes. Sorry. Not unreasonable in being in a communal area but unreasonable by pottering around someone's window with a chattering kid (and I doubt the two of you were deadly silent and didn't utter a word) at 8am. Even if you were quiet, it still would have felt like a bit of an invasion of privacy first thing in the morning. But you don't seem to be taking this on board, when numerous people have said this to you here.

Perhaps leave it till a little later in the day. At 8am, many folk just want a quiet sit down with a cup of tea, not someone right outside their window pottering away.

I understand that there is etiquette required in communal areas although technically we aren't doing anything wrong

So you really aren’t bothered about etiquette or the many opinions on here that say later in the day would be better?

Fair doos.

Yourself is being very unreasonable.

I understand that there is etiquette required in communal areas although technically we aren't doing anything wrong

Doesn't mean it's okay. If she started pottering about under your window at 6am I expect you would be irked even though she'd technically not be doing anything wrong either.
8am is too early. I used to live in a gff and I didn't own the only garden in the vicinity. It belonged to the man upstairs who had bought the flat in his retirement. He told us we could regularly use his garden which I was always grateful for with a very small toddling DD1. I never went in it before 9am though out of a sign of mutual respect.
YNBU for thinking she overreacted. YABU for going out that early I'm afraid.

I understand that there is etiquette required in communal areas although technically we aren't doing anything wrong. Plus she has uninterrupted enjoyment of the garden for probably 22 - 23 hours out of 24 (I am serious when I say we are there for 10 minutes) so is it any more unreasonable to ask her to close her curtains if she doesn't want to see people, than to ask people not to use the garden?

OP i was fairly sympathetic towards you until this. Just wind your neck in, apologise for disturbing her and don't do it so early again.
"can't she close her curtains" fuck that shit. it's summer. she lives alone and you're disturbing her. Not to mention that she's elderly and that adds a whole layer of other feelings on her part.

You'Re so determined that you can do what the heck you like, you're being mean.

Just wait a bit. It’s not a huge ask. Try after 10am.

@Saoirse82

I think a lot of the people on here just love to have a go at the OP regardless of what is asked. I can bet that if the reverse was posted (ie the elderly lady posting) that the same people would be telling her to wind her neck in and that it was a communal garden! AIBU is where the vipers love to hang out

No, if an old lady posted that I would say: I would hate that too, while you do have to accept sharing the garden it’s massively rude for them to be doing this outside your window regularly, especially if early or late. I’d tell them to speak to the people who were bothering her, to the gardener to ask them if they could build a flowerbed to keep people away, and to the management kf the building as there might be clauses at staying away from windows, or a way to make complaints about this.

I think it was the time of day that aggravated her op.some people are not morning people and can feel cranky,tired or slightly vulnerable when not fully awake.
Go a bit later.if she's still irritated then it's her problem,I'm sure she wouldn't have a go at the gardener for using the tap😀

Are you very chatty while you're out there, OP? Because if you are right outside my window chattering to your toddler throughout, at 8 am, I'd be frustrated too. It would almost be like you are in my living room. I'm sitting next to my patio door now, imagining someone on my patio with their child, chattering away to them and watering the pots there. It would feel invasive.

Again, I'd ask the gardener if it was possible to move the pots, or fill the can quickly and silently and water elsewhere.

OP Something that you may not have considered is the fact that the tap could be quite loud inside her flat, when it’s turned on.

We have a tap outside of our kitchen wall and it’s screechy and loud inside when in use. Luckily it’s only us who use it.

@StoneofDestiny

Just carry on but a tad later than 8.00 am. There must be gardeners going in to take care of the space surely?

Her age is irrelevant - it's communal space.

I think her age is potentially relevant. My FIL started a dispute with his neighbours in his 70s. He was the nicest man and we couldn’t understand why the neighbours suddenly couldn’t stand him. It eventually became apparent that he had dementia and had been going round nitpicking and harassing them over all sorts of very out off character stuff.

I can see both sides

Thank you to all who have replied.

@Mummyford thank you I feel like you understand my point of view. It's not a party or a gang of people, it's two people she knows using the communal space for a short time for a peaceful activity. Also against the background of over a year with a toddler in a tiny third floor flat with this being one of the nicest activities he enjoys - it feels so selfish of her to sour that. It hasn't been easy going up three flights of stairs every day etc with a baby.

And whoever said that the reason I am finding it difficult to acknowledge any wrongdoing is because of her approach that's exactly right. This wouldn't have upset me if she had said "I know the hosepipe is here but is there any way you could keep some distance from my window on a morning for x y x reasons?" We could have had a friendly conversation and it wouldn't have been a big deal. But to come out shouting and shrieking when we were very friendly blindsided me.

In one sense I don't feel comfortable being in the garden any more because of the atmosphere, but also DS loves it and I don't want her to have "bullied" us out of it. We both pay an equal amount for access to and maintenance of the garden.