AIBU to ask Mumsnet to reconsider a decision

[Mummyoflittledragon]

… to relegate certain threads from the AIBU board.

I imagine AIBU is probably the most active board on Mumsnet and therefore reaches the highest audience. Now when someone creates a thread about children’s boundaries being crossed by certain people and women being scared into silence and being attacked by certain groups, the thread quickly disappears out of AIBU and onto another board.

Once off AIBU, the thread receives far less exposure thus radically reduces the possibility to offer information to the widest possible audience. Information, which could be used to help people and particularly women make safety and / or safeguarding decisions about themselves and their children.

Mumsnet to me is like the BBC (in its hey day) of parenting sites. And as Mumsnet is renowned for being such an esteemed hub for information, AIBU to ask Mumsnet to not give in to outside pressure from certain groups and to stop relegating important informational threads without looking at the wider implications.

YABU to make it all about trans threads but YANBU to campaign about this for threads overall.

Sometimes I post in AIBU because I really genuinely need help with something but your right as soon as thread gets moved there's nothing.

I don't understand why this is because I thought threads in all topics came up on peoples Home Screen but whatever the reason is why they don't, Mumsnet should make a way to get this to happen.

@Lifeinthelastlane of course I know why, ‘but they’re really men and that’s not fair, they’re stronger than us but we’re equal and it’s our space…’

A minority of trans athletes, of all levels. I’m 5’1” and always found running harder than some of my long legged friends..it’s just different fgs. Not like make athletes are queuing up to get gender reassigned so they can have a marginally easier run.

How does it threaten you, personally? And actually why is it a problem if others don’t share your view?

Surely the debate isn't about whether this man was trans or not, but the impact of legislation that allows men to access women's spaces under the guise of being trans which is the pertinent issue. You can both be GC and not want AIBU filled with the same crap.

I suspect your post may be deleted Treehaus - that word you used after "under the _" is on the banned list iirc.

I completely agree. Before I understood the issue, I used to roll my eyes and what I perceived to be some crazy transphobes. Live and let live I felt. And then I started doing a bit of research and realised that most of these “transphobes” are simply looking out for women’s rights.
Most ordinary women have absolutely no idea how close we came in this country to allowing biological men self identify (keeping beard and penis intact) and thus access things like women’s shower rooms and changing spaces or women’s prisons.
Or maybe I’m wrong, maybe “most women” do know and are fine with it. I’d direct those women to terfisaslur.com. And also hope their daughters never end up in prison with a trans women, 40% of whom are in prison for sex offences. Who could be sharing a cell with your daughter.
And the icing on the cake, their crimes are being recorded and reported in the media as those committed by women.
I think these issues deserve as wide an audience as possible.

@Treehaus

Surely the debate isn't about whether this man was trans or not, but the impact of legislation that allows men to access women's spaces under the guise of being trans which is the pertinent issue. You can both be GC and not want AIBU filled with the same crap.

One informs the other.

There are still a lot of people about that don’t realise that most transwomen don’t undergo any surgery on their genitalia.

Similarly, the difficulty in establishing whether the person exposing their penis in the spa was a man or a transwoman, illustrates the difficulties being raised.

Hello Quaggers. I see you’ve arrived.

Erm, yes if you read my posts I said I use AIBU and Chat for light relief and see there's a thread about a thread (must be a new MN rule where those are allowed now?) that there's an identical thread to the other one.
It's like Groundhog Day.
Hello to you too (love how you single out, instead of actually engaging with what I put, bit bizarre but whatever, used to it now )

@RickiTarr there's an entire board to discuss it. Again, it reads as though those silly women who read AIBU need to be told as no way are they aware anyway.

@Helleofabore

beastlyslumber

yes.... the re-education of the 6 year old is the solution. Obviously.

Yep. And the rest of the women in the hot tub should be thrown in prison for transphobia. How dare they call a stunning display of diversity a sex crime.

@HeyDemonsItsYaGirl

Oh, that’s wonderful! I didn’t realise (I avoid it like the plague for obvious reasons). When did this happen? Really pleased to hear this from MN. Nice one MNHQ

A few weeks ago. It's brilliant - I can actually read interesting feminism threads now!

Thanks for the heads up. I might stray over there. I don’t envy MNHQ’s job in trying to keep relevant content within the two boards but I think a lot of posters will be pleased and find it a more welcoming space. I felt actively repulsed by feminism chat on MN as it was before.

Ok, so it seems to have been someone with an exposed penis next to a little girl (same age as my daughter). I wouldn’t like that at all. Then this person may or may not have been trans.

Would the people here who are saying that other people are transphobic be ok with exposed penises in the jacuzzi next to their underaged daughters?

Or do are they not ok with it but don’t want to discuss is or having others discussing it?

Again, it reads as though those silly women who read AIBU need to be told as no way are they aware anyway.

Yes, especially as OP said is surprised at voting split and thinks it's probably because people think they're voting for Covid or Brexit instead.
When if anyone actually reads the thread it's perfectly clear it's not about those.

Quaggers
I’m specifically not wanting this thread to a bunfight #nocomment.

Unfortunately relatively few people are having a huge influence over social media

Journalists are being hounded, social media the attempt is to silence, anyone one who has a following of Twitter the attempt is to silence

Woman are being silenced

[quote Treehaus]@RickiTarr there's an entire board to discuss it. Again, it reads as though those silly women who read AIBU need to be told as no way are they aware anyway.[/quote]
I don’t think so.

Firstly, the spa story is current affairs so could reasonably go anywhere.

Secondly, there’s nothing “silly women” about hearing something new for the first time. We all had to hear this and understand it for the first time at some point. Most people stay under the misapprehension that transition still equals reassignment surgery until they read something specific to disabuse them.

@Quaggars

Again, it reads as though those silly women who read AIBU need to be told as no way are they aware anyway.

Yes, especially as OP said is surprised at voting split and thinks it's probably because people think they're voting for Covid or Brexit instead.
When if anyone actually reads the thread it's perfectly clear it's not about those.

It’s a convenient way to try and justify why the poll isn’t coming out how OP expected it to without losing face. Clever really, if a little transparent!

And yet, the majority has said it is not unreasonable for Mummyoflittledragon to ask to have it reinstated.

It is quite interesting that @JustineMumsnet (Tue 15-Jun-21 17:21:23) told everyone that the threads could still be posted on other areas of the site.

That they were not going to be scorched earth about it.

This has proven to be not be the case at all. They have indeed been 'scorched earth' about it.

I don’t know what the story is between the two of you, @Mummyoflittledragon and @Quaggars, but OP you can’t post a comment saying

Hello Quaggers. I see you’ve arrived

And claim you don’t want a bunfight. You could easily have ignored them. Or engaged with what they said. But you chose to post that. So disingenuous.

@RickiTarr but you're assuming that's the case for people on AIBU when there is zero basis for that. And yes it could, but that's not what any threads have been about it is, therefore they should go on the right board. Its like when covid threads kept taking over the boards, an important issue yes, people who didn't want to see them all of the time weren't ignorant, they just didn't want the boards infested by them.

I’m so disgusted by the women who don’t care about the complete erasure of women’s and girls rights. Why do you think it doesn’t impact you?! Ffs.

@Bluntness100

You are missing the point, if people wanted to read these threads they’d head over to those boards. The fact they do not tells you something. It’s not because they don’t know they are there.

Trans stopped being a debate on here a long time ago, it became an echo chamber. Many people now don’t want to read those threads. Whic is why so many hide them. Forcing people to see it by putting them in aibu isn’t the answer. Informed debate is. Then your audience will increase.

Don’t think that’s true, I have AIBU bookmarked but like to see threads from other boards trending.

Exactly lol
I comment on other trans threads and usually go against the echo chamber with my posts.
That's literally the history.
That gets you a weird hello singling out, and anyone else read it in a James Bond villain type voice "Hello, we meet again..." wonder if OP was stroking a white cat as they said it

[quote Treehaus]@RickiTarr but you're assuming that's the case for people on AIBU when there is zero basis for that. And yes it could, but that's not what any threads have been about it is, therefore they should go on the right board. Its like when covid threads kept taking over the boards, an important issue yes, people who didn't want to see them all of the time weren't ignorant, they just didn't want the boards infested by them.[/quote]
I’m assuming that some people who are already up to speed on the ideology might want to discuss the spa story on the main boards (I do, I like the feminist boards but sometimes I am interested in a wider take).

I’m also assuming that some other people won’t be up to speed yet anyway.

I accept that others feel differently, but it’s not unanimous is it? Hence the split vote.

@Mummyoflittledragon

I’ve had a response. The thread is staying in AIBU.

I’m surprised at the voting split. I think some people are voting against Covid threads and Brexit threads by the sound of some posts?

As for the discussion around the sex and gender debate board, a lot of us are unhappy with the naming. When a thread on safeguarding gets relegated to a topic, which is classed as a debate’, it rather illustrates why we aren’t happy, doesn’t it?

This thread or is the original being brought back?

@Quaggars

Exactly lol I comment on other trans threads and usually go against the echo chamber with my posts. That's literally the history. That gets you a weird hello singling out, and anyone else read it in a James Bond villain type voice "Hello, we meet again..." wonder if OP was stroking a white cat as they said it

I’m impressed you have the energy to bother, but that’s the problem with echo chambers. It becomes futile to engage so people don’t and the chamber continues to echo.... it’s a very positive thing the rest of MN is largely shielded from it though. Not that it’s for altruistic reasons, it’s because it’s damaging MN’s reputation and business opportunities. Nearly everyone I’ve spoken to where MN has come up in conversation recognises it as a hotbed of transphobia. Not a good look for MN as a business, which is what they are.