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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Think the way people use the term 'trans widow' is insensitive to actual widows?

350 replies

justmaybenot · 27/06/2021 11:33

The wives of men who have transitioned often use the term 'trans widow' and some of the responses to this letter from an actual widow have expressed some envy for someone whose husband has died rather than transitioned. AIBU to think it's overblown and deeply insensitive to liken the experience of your dh transitioning to the position of someone whose dh has actually died? This is the letter rachelemoss.com/2021/06/24/a-letter-to-trans-widows-from-an-actual-widow/

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
FourTeaFallOut · 27/06/2021 11:47

The person they married no longer exists

To even speak their name would be dead naming. I wonder if dead people get offended by that term?

AnneLovesGilbert · 27/06/2021 11:47

Again? Hmm

Jog on.

Sensateria · 27/06/2021 11:48

Do you think trans people using the term “dead name” or “dead naming” is also overblown and deeply insensitive?

CreepyPasta · 27/06/2021 11:48

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

WarriorN · 27/06/2021 11:49

@FourTeaFallOut

It's funny how people get so het up about this. I've been on MN for near twelve years and can't remember one thread stating about how inappropriate the notion of a golfing widow or a cycling widow was and that's just losing the DH for a weekend.

Yeah funny that. 🤔

It's almost as if someone doesn't want people to know about trans widows or something?

However, it's a term that's been referred to within parliament discussions around the EA.

committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/36734/pdf/

FrankButchersDickieBow · 27/06/2021 11:49

But the transitioners use the word 'deadnaming'' for their previous selves, so if the old them is 'dead', then widow would be the correct name for the person they left.

Dahlietta · 27/06/2021 11:49

The term 'widow' is like the term 'nazi' now isn't it? As others have said, you get cycling widows (which nobody seems to be offended by) like you get 'grammar nazis'. Whether it's right or wrong, it's certainly not limited in its use to 'trans widows'

Erikrie · 27/06/2021 11:50

I think the emotional turmoil from being a trans widow is very similar to being widowed. You only have to read some of the accounts of their experiences. Utterly dreadful. The term trans widow is accurate and helps trans widows find each other for peer to peer support. Please don't get het up on behalf of other people. It's not welcome or required. From an actual widow.

WarriorN · 27/06/2021 11:50

Where's my list of the rules of misogyny

BorisKilledMyHusband · 27/06/2021 11:51

I’m a widow. It doesn’t bother me.

SpindleWhorl · 27/06/2021 11:51

It's a metapor.

HTH

Mibbiesaye · 27/06/2021 11:51

@justmaybenot Are you a widow or trans widow? Not that you have to be either to have an opinion, of course.

Erikrie · 27/06/2021 11:52

I think the push to remove the word is a push to stop trans widows from finding eachother for support. Is that what you want op? And if so, why?

PegasusReturns · 27/06/2021 11:52

I think they just identify as widows…..

WarriorN · 27/06/2021 11:52

Is it 3 perhaps?

3rd rule of misogyny: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

Or 8?

8th rule of misogyny: Men are whatever men say they are and women are whatever men say they are.

Or 14?

14th rule of misogyny: Women have all the rights they need: The right to remain silent.

WoolOfBat · 27/06/2021 11:53

www.transwidowsvoices.org/

Just posting this here in case anyone wants to understand trans widows better. Many of them seem to have gone through a lot

Ninkanink · 27/06/2021 11:53

It’s not insensitive AT ALL to co-opt your spouse’s rightful descriptor words like ‘woman/wife/mother/mummy and demand that your wife now call you a woman, herself a lesbian and further to expect your children to happily shift their whole understanding of the world and everything they know to be true and factual so that you can feel good. No...that’s not insensitive at all.

TiltTopTable · 27/06/2021 11:54

You think a woman calling herself a transwidow is insensitive to actual widows, so do you also think someone calling themselves a trans woman is insensitive to actual women?

Cornettoninja · 27/06/2021 11:54

I don’t see why it’s offensive tbh, people using that term are clearly separating themselves from widows by adding ‘trans-‘.

I’m not sure I’m comfortable with trying to ring fence a word that’s being used by distressed people to communicate their situation and emotions. They’ve been told person they formed a loving bond with doesn’t exist and likely never really did. Grief is an appropriate emotional state to identify with in that situation imho.

LindaEllen · 27/06/2021 11:54

Grief is not competitive. The man they married is no longer there - hence they feel that they've been widowed.

I would be absolutely gutted if my DP decided he wanted to live as a woman. I don't think I could stay, yet I love him so much. It would feel the same to me as it would if he'd died, because for all intents and purposes, you're mourning the man you loved.

Armadollo · 27/06/2021 11:55

The word "widow" has been inappropriately affixed to other words for as long as I can remember - golf widow, football widow, black widow spider (racist as well as insulting to widows), Scottish Widows insurance company (clearly not run by/for bereaved Caledonian women) etc so I am pleased you are bringing this to our attention.

Some may question your motivation or timing but you do you, hun. You're just speaking out for widows after all. I'm sure you've been doing it all your life.

MiladyBerserko · 27/06/2021 11:56

This is an attempt to bully a group of women who have managed to to form a support group when there was no support for them at all.

There are no depths to the ways that TRAs vilify, hate and seek to punish women who say no to them.

Flowers to Transwidows

Waitwhat23 · 27/06/2021 11:59

As I mentioned on the other thread, here are all the uses of ....widow mentioned right here on Mumsnet over the years -

Model Railway widow
Call of Duty Widow
I phone widow
Football widow
Euros widow
Computer widow
Golf widow
Cycling widow
Sports widow
Fitness widow
Weekend widow
PlayStation widow
Cycling widow
Superbowl widow
Rugby widow
Cricket widow
Retail widow
Xbox live widow
Warhammer widow

I assume you have challenged these uses too?

TheQueef · 27/06/2021 11:59

Do you just want to deliver an edict?
Are you coming back to the thread @justmaybenot?

WarriorN · 27/06/2021 11:59

*It was soul crushing to me to realise that the organisations set up
to help women would think that women in my circumstances, who were
being gaslit and subject to coercive control in their relationship
with a man, should have their needs and their own lived experience
considered secondary. Not only that, but their despair should be
regarded as a form of “bigotry”.

This is not helped by such things as the “memorandum of
understanding" adopted by professional bodies for therapists that
require practitioners to only ever affirm the declared gender of
clients without deeper investigation lest it be considered
“conversion therapy", and the training received by practitioners
from organisations that re-enforce a narrative that paints a
negative picture of the partners of people who declare a trans
identity and who are anything less than 100% “on board" regardless
of the impact on their own or their children’s lives or sense of
themselves as “phobic".

So in a nutshell, there is no specialist support.

There are no
specialist training programmes outwith those that are focused on how
to support the trans partner. It is unlikely that such specialist
support will be developed given the current “memorandum of
understanding" and the policy positions that have been developed by
women’s support projects in conjunction with trans support
organisations that (understandably) present an entirely one-sided
perspective.*

From parliamentary submission.

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