AIBU to think affairs are more common than we think

[YukiCarrot]

Just reading about Matt Hancock in the news, was pretty shocked.

This, coupled with some affairs I know of IRL has really rattled me, my trust in men is at an all time low. (i know women have affairs to!)

Has your DP/DH had an affair? Do you know of people who have?

To be honest, even remaining monogamous during the child-rearing years is a big ask for a lot of couples. Particularly because having children is the fastest way to kill off a sex life.

I feel like we would be better substituting a financial contract for marriage.

Couldn't we get to a place where there were a contract which obliged a certain degree of financial support for a childrearing parent (usually the woman), combined with an obligation for some childcare support and collaboration, but removing the stipulation of sexual fidelity and cohabitation?

It seems absolutely medieval to me that so many people's financial security is contingent on who they do or don't have sex with.

Well according to Google their net worth is pretty equal even now, but in 1997 Victoria was an international superstar in the most successful female band of all time. They were the biggest selling artist of the 1990s, bigger than Oasis.

David was an inarticulate emerging footballer with a hot head and had never played for England seniors.

@CBeebiess

She was having an affair too? She was also married.

Yeah this! They're both as bad as eachother.

@gillysSong

Sadly, very acceptable today, because there's no stigma or moral outrage there's always someone who will accept previously unfaithful partners.

You might argue that the pendulum has swung too far the other way but I have zero interest in living in a society mired in stigma and moral outrage, thanks all the same. Irish society went for that in a big way from the 1950s to 1980s in particular and it was a cold and difficult place to live for all sorts of people in all sorts of ways. You can't really seperate out one thing - infidelity - and decide this is a moral outrage without other things also coming under the telescope

There might be so much less stress, heartache and expense if people expected to have, for example, starter relationships in their 20s, a family-raising relationship in their 30s and 40s, then the freedom and flexibility in later life to date or have other long term relationships

What start all that crap again in my 40s? No chance! And find THREE OR MORE people to partner up long term with in my life? Who could be arsed? Also how would it work with homes and finance? Sounds expensive. Did enough shagging around in my late teens and early 20s then settled down. Enjoyed it at the time but have absolutely no desire whatsoever to relive my twenties in my 40s or run around after men, or have them running around after me ever again.

@HarebrightCedarmoon

What start all that crap again in my 40s? No chance! And find THREE OR MORE people to partner up long term with in my life? Who could be arsed? Also how would it work with homes and finance?

Quite. All the more reason never to combine finances with someone just because you happen to be shagging them.

Yes, my experiences of men have made me very cynical.
I bet the wife the man I was in a relationship with for 3 years (he worked away, I didn’t know he was married) has no idea her husband could do such a thing.

TheLeadbetterLife

"A societal expectation of total fidelity and co-parenting during the child-raising years, with the freedom to pursue other relationships before and after, might give both men and women more fulfilled lives"

Nice idea but this ignores the much more nuanced reality of most relationships - namely that it is the day to day way a couple show up for each other (or not) which counts, not being able to prove that during "child raising years" (what would that be? would it be ok for a woman to have children with one man in her late teens leaving that relationship in her mid 30s to start again on a second family providing she was not unfaithful during either relationships? And lets face it men can (and often do) father children way into old age just because they can) - you were faithful.

And the invidious likely situation that the children grow up knowing that mum and dad stayed together "because of them". Dysfunctional of itself.

Hormones are a far stronger driver of human behaviour than morals, greed or power. One the revelations of getting older is that you see that pretty much most of your earlier behaviour is hormone driven, in very subtle ways. Yes I think it's rare that someone would turn down a physical relationship with someone they are "in lust" with even if they love their spouse. Lust convinces you of things which your sane self knows not to be true, e.g. the grass is not greener, no-one will find out, those CCTV cameras do not record what they see, my parter is a lovely person and not a narcissist, etc. Lust distorts your vision hugely. I believe my dh and I are faithful to each other but we were in our early 50's when we married, so it's much, much easier.

Can understand we’re all human and can make mistakes, but cheaters seldom do the decent thing and end the relationship properly, theres usually a lot of gas lighting and manipulation that accompanies it, so it’s not just a case of a decent person making a one off bad decision.

Sometimes the cheater doesn't actually want to end the relationship, just to have their cake and eat it for as long as they can get away with it.

It seems absolutely medieval to me that so many people's financial security is contingent on who they do or don't have sex with.
Agree. Society is moving away from it though as both women and men get wise.

I was just like you OP, I always assumed affairs were rare until my friends and colleagues started getting married of course. I come from quite a religious, conservative Asian community but people still cheat!

Some of my partners friends met at medical school and now have just started to get married. That means meeting someone when you're 18, probably not had many others partners and then spending the rest of your life with them. I'm sure lots of long term relationships that start like that last but I'm also not surprised when people cheat.

because there are almost always, always innocents involved and not only innocents but innocents in their formative evolving years who cannot provide their own role models / protection / resources they need to grow up.
In other words - children.

Exactly.

I do not have the time nor the inclination to go searching for someone new to shag, but even if I did I wouldn't go there because my kids would be devastated.

Affairs are going on all the time. They are as old as time.

Those who have mentioned not being bothered 'searching for a new partner'..surely the ideal would be that you wouldn't have to.

I look at my life now as my children become independent and a man is only a small part of it! I have a career, friends, hobbies, parental responsibilities etc. I find the idea of actually 'not looking' very appealing and a fwb would work for me much better. All the benefits, none of the 'wife work', sounds ok to me!

Long, happy marriages can happen. We've been together nearly 50 years. We're fortunate that we met the right person at the right time in our lives.

@PicsInRed

The problem isn't lack of monogamy, the problem is that so many of these people don't seek out others the same, they want a faithful spouse at home and to shag away on the side.

Often the thrill of the "trick", getting one over on the faithful spouse, is part of the fun for the cheater. That's why we name it "cheating", that's was makes it wrong, and that's what causes a feeling of hmbetral and "heartbreak" in the faithful partner and damages their ability to trust again.

The cheater has deliberately defrauded a faithful person and they really aren't a decent person, can't be. If they were decent, they would leave first to release their spouse to find someone more compatible and/or they would date only those also shagging others.

Completely agree with this. The unfaithful part is the lying, the deception etc. If the Hancocks have an "arrangement" of some kind that is fully openly agreed to by both parties then fine. No issue.

But that's NOT what many (most?) affairs are.

I'm cautious about labelling anyone "good" or "bad". We are all flawed and can make mistakes. Some people are capable of acknowledging a mistake and making amends. Others continue to deceive or minimise or blame others. It's not about being a "good" or a "bad" person, it's about being a respectful, compassionate, honest person. Or not.

I don't see marriage in an idealistic light at all. My father was unfaithful to my mother when she was in her fifties (very common pattern), and there may have been other occasions for all I know. They stayed together, were churchgoers and there is no way my mum would have entertained the 'disgrace' of divorce. Infidelity is common and always have been, it's perhaps that now we are more prepared to out the adulterer/end the marriage.

@Mountainpika

Long, happy marriages can happen. We've been together nearly 50 years. We're fortunate that we met the right person at the right time in our lives.

That's great for you, but you have to understand a) that that's fairly unusual and isn't a realistic expectation of everyone and b) sexual attraction (or romance if you want to call it that) is a pretty slippery basis for the creation of the fundamental financial unit of society.

There has to be a way of structuring society which doesn't depend on people committing to only having sex with one person throughout their entire lives.

@PicsInRed

The problem isn't lack of monogamy, the problem is that so many of these people don't seek out others the same, they want a faithful spouse at home and to shag away on the side.

Often the thrill of the "trick", getting one over on the faithful spouse, is part of the fun for the cheater. That's why we name it "cheating", that's was makes it wrong, and that's what causes a feeling of betrayal and "heartbreak" in the faithful partner and damages their ability to trust again.

The cheater has deliberately defrauded a faithful person and they really aren't a decent person, can't be. If they were decent, they would leave first to release their spouse to find someone more compatible and/or they would date only those also shagging others.

Agree with all this. ^ You will also find people who do this don't like it when it's done to them either. I knew a man some years ago, who was always fucking different women (from work and his 'hobby' groups, he must have had 10 affairs in 20-25 years!)

His poor wife stayed with him, as she didn't have the confidence to leave, and they had 2 kids. When they had been married 27 years, she had an affair with a neighbour, and he was fuming, angry, furious, and INCENSED that she had an affair, because just how DARE she?!

He demanded she end it, and said if she doesn't he is leaving. She picked the neighbour. Packed up everything she had and moved in with him. 10 years later, she and the neighbour are still together.

I think affairs are very common. It's certainly not just men (three of my female friends are having affairs 😩) and often both parties are married as in Matt Hancock - so that would mean both a man and a woman having an affair.

@grapewine

Do people think they're uncommon?

No, that's the thing. I would press on YABU because people don't think they're uncommon, but OP would take that as my thinking they are common, I suppose, so I can't vote.

"Often the thrill of the "trick", getting one over on the faithful spouse, is part of the fun for the cheater."

Esther Perel says illicit affairs happen even in open/polyamorous relationships.

Affairs are very common and actually highest in workplaces. I think the gym is meant to be a common place too. I know quite a few people at work who've had affairs with other colleagues, and my ex did with his coworker.

@TheWitchCirce

I think affairs are very common. It's certainly not just men (three of my female friends are having affairs 😩) and often both parties are married as in Matt Hancock - so that would mean both a man and a woman having an affair.

I do wonder if it's easier to have an affair with an already taken person, there's no worry that they'll make demands as in most cases they have a lot to lose also 🤷🏻‍♀️