Neighbour has built a bar

[Julshk73]

My neighbour has spent the last three months building every night beyond 10pm. Sawing hammering, no use of my garden this year so far. Yesterday they unwrapped their new building.

It's a bar.

On a raised platform.

That looks right into my daughters bedroom.

She is terrified as a preteen as grown men were staring in all day yesterday.

Then the drinking began.

Until 3am we couldn't even hear our tv for the shouting screaming and chanting.

The council noise team aren't working due to covid. The police don't answer calls anymore on 101 (we tried several times on advice of the council).

What can I do?

My daughter is extremely distressed at losing her privacy and I cannot deal with parties that go on until 3am that are so loud we have no respite.

Help?

Op,, it is all very dramatic, with you sobbing, your daughter distressed, saying you can’t protect her.

I think jist shut the blinds till you can get some film, and report to planning, if it’s what you’ve said it is, it will not have planning permission, it must be very high indeed to see into first floor windows directly like that.

@BiscoffAddict

What's reasonable about being rowdy in the wee hours of the morning as OP has stated?

What's reasonable about a young girl having her privacy invaded?

Do you have a garden bar by any chance?

@Bluntness100

Op,, it is all very dramatic, with you sobbing, your daughter distressed, saying you can’t protect her.

I think jist shut the blinds till you can get some film, and report to planning, if it’s what you’ve said it is, it will not have planning permission, it must be very high indeed to see into first floor windows directly like that.

We don’t all want to sit behind closed blinds and closed windows in this weather.

I’m getting a picture of who the anti-social neighbours on this thread are.

It is probably a permitted development.
The rules on height state
'Outbuildings must be single storey with
a maximum eaves height of 2.5 metres and
maximum overall height of 4 metres with a dual pitched roof, or 3 metres in any other case.

If the outbuilding is within 2 metres of the
property boundary the whole building should not exceed 2.5 metres in height.'

I cant imagine they can see anything in your dds first floor room unless she stands right up at the window.
The noise is another issue! Totally unacceptable!
Also ignore the terrible advice to, have a cctv Camera trained on their garden!! You will be liable under GDPR if you do that!

I really think the bar is a bit of a red herring here - yes, it's compounded the issues, and has likely breached planning rules, etc.

But it sounds like the wider issue, OP, is the fact these people have already started a campaign of harassment against you with the dog shit and broken glass being thrown, etc.

IMO this complicates things massively because as CovidCorvid says, regardless of the outcome of a planning complaint, it sounds like it will just escalate their animosity towards you further.

If you mention the bedroom window issue to the council, it will be obvious that it was you who reported them, so I'd be very careful how you go about this - are there other neighbours who can see the structure? Will they know it was you if you don't mention the window at this point?

I'm not saying don't report it, obviously - I just think they're going to see it as whoever reported them spoiling their fun (they will absolutely not see it from your point of view, ever) and they're unlikely to accept responsibility for their behaviour or lack of seeking planning permission - they will just blame whoever reported them.

Also, they've obviously shown the bar to their friends and it will be humiliating for them to have to demolish it or to not be able to invite people round or to tell them to be quiet when the do come over, so again, they will blame whoever reported them for that, likely egged on by their drunken mates.

Plus, they've obviously spent a lot of money out on it, so it will again piss them off if they have to demolish it all. Completely their fault, but they will blame whoever reported them.

I'm not too familiar with retrospective planning permission, but presumably if they were forced down this road, the council would do a consultation and you'd still end up flagging the window issue - so your objections may well be the reason permission is refused anyway, and they would obviously find out you objected as part of the planning process.

I do sympathise as it's horrible living next to aggressive and hostile neighbours. I just don't know whether you're ever going to get to a point where you can happily coexist with people like that living in such close proximity to you.

@LonginesPrime
All good points

I think I'd have to move myself, is that a possibility OP?

Large summer house bought from B&Q or somewhere similar, it took them about a month to put it up and then furnish it.

But it is completely different putting together a flatpack summer house compared to designing andbuilding a bespoke structure

@User478

Do you own or rent?

Bad neighbours are awful, we gave up reporting and just moved.

Sadly I have to agree with this. We have had some fucking awful neighbours in the past, and as a pp said, even when confronted with their shitty behaviour (politely!) they don't change.

No-one likes being told what to do, and arrogant arseholes who are horrible neighbours aren't going to be all contrite and apologetic and humble when called out on anti social cunty behaviour. If anything, it's going to make them worse, because people like this think they can do whatever they want, and fuck anyone else, or the effect it has on them.

On the (two) occasions we had awful cunty neighbours, (noisy, loud music, generally anti-social,) we approached them politely and gently, and they both basically said they will do what the fuck they want in the OWN home.

So on both occasions, we had to move. We had been in one place 7 years, and one place 3 years. Fortunately, we have been here in our current home for 10 years, and had 3 sets of neighbours, and for the most part they have been OK.

I agree with a couple of posters that you can see who the anti-social, entitled individual are on THIS thread.

*individuals...

We don’t all want to sit behind closed blinds and closed windows in this weather

No of course not, unclench, but it protects her privacy until the op can put some film up and the council can step in. She doesn’t need to sit there in full view.

@osbertthesyrianhamster

There seem to be so many cunts like this neighbour around.

There are. We had some as neighbours for a few years. Cut down trees that were providing privacy screening between our rear gardens, then stood at the bottom of theirs, as close to the boundary as possible, staring directly into our main living area ( We had to put up fencing to stop that, and the week or two it took to wait for the supplies to arrive was a very long week of being stared at.) Then, they tried to vandalise the new fence, so had to be told to leave it alone.

They were absolute bar stewards in so many ways, including shouting abuse at the ASD kid a few doors away on a regular basis. I heard them do that a few times, and was livid at them. Police refused to do anything about that, either without witnesses to the incidents. "I heard that happen." Did you see it? Can you prove it was them?" I knew their voices by then, so knew it was them.

Really, really glad when they moved. There was dancing of jigs when the removal van turned up, and we realised they really were going.

I

wouldn't confront them either - especially if they're already as brazenly abusive as they are - no good can come of it, and if they're drunk too, it's a recipe for disaster to try to stop them partying in the moment yourself.

I've tried the reasonable approach with my dickhead neighbour when she has been sober. It didn't work. There's that many of these cunty neighbours around because the local authorities don't want the area being brought into disrepute so sit thumb twiddling instead of being proactive a lot of the time. For instance. Despite our housing manager being more proactive this time around I've still not had no contact from the police regarding dickhead neighbours latest threats to smash my cctv up when I'm out one day. Probably wandering down a conspiracy theory rabbit hole myself but I'm sure the fact a number of lovely expensive homes being built a stones throwaway from here could be factoring into their decisions. I also have my own theory that they'll often be proactive in an asbo area of them themselves are having to live amongst it.

If the OP is on her own I'd think twice about confronting them too. Dickhead neighbours and all her visitors were pissed up and coked up this week. I honestly don't think some realise how intimidating it is living next to these sort of dickheads and why they often think twice about getting the police out at the time knowing they'll be repercussions after once the police have attented and told them to stfu, also if they're too busy with other incidents they won't attend anyway.

OP I have a vulnerable DC too and I totally get the anxiety. We walk to open air spaces with the DCs walking there and spending an hour or so in open space is quite reassuring in Covid times when you still have to be careful. Is that doable for you just to break the day up a bit?

@a8mint

Large summer house bought from B&Q or somewhere similar, it took them about a month to put it up and then furnish it.

But it is completely different putting together a flatpack summer house compared to designing andbuilding a bespoke structure

Did you miss the part where I said my neighbours have one very similar to the one the OP has posted and theirs was put up in about a week? It’s not a ‘bespoke structure at all’ you can buy out buildings like that from IKEA!

We don’t all want to sit behind closed blinds and closed windows in this weather. yes but OP is concerned about protecting her daughter from weird creepy men standing around watching her. This is a practical step OP can take while waiting for a longer term solution.

And why the fuck should the OP put frosted film on the daughter's window so the men can't see in

One way privacy film? Because it’s common sense and a better option than having people look in. Or maybe not and just wave arms about and keep complaining. The OP can go down numerous routes here and likely should but as an immediate solution to one of the issues it makes sense.

For the record I'm not trying to minimise anything, I'm just really confused as to why, if a group of men have been "staring all day" at OP's teenage girl to the point it has "terrified" her, OP apparently did nothing about it other than to post on MN.

It just seems...odd. So I'm not really buying the whole story, something doesn't make sense and I think OP mat be overreacting about what actually happened.

I mean by allowing such sinister behaviour of staring and terrifying your child it actually doesn't cast the best light on OP, if that is indeed true at all.

or are you just another Mumsnetter that doesn’t like their neighbours enjoying their garden?

The nice side to me has very young and very screechy DCs who are always out in their garden. It doesn't bother me one bit although it does bother both DCs who are on the spectrum who find that level of noise painful. Dickhead neighbour also has screechy DCs who play out in their garden all day. Again it doesn't bother me. What does fuck me off though is entitled dickheads partying and coked up until 3am and saying they're allowed to do it "in mah own ome!". I couldn't give a shit if you was running a brothel next door to me just have some consideration for your surrounding neighbours who have work and school and errands in the morning just because you can sleep your partying off. It's not asking you to tiptoe around your house it's asking for a bit of basic decency to others who have to live amongst you.

Clean the windows inside and out with a splash of fabric conditioner in water- use a cloth then buff dry. For some reason it makes them clean and streak free but gives them more of a mirror finish which shows reflection - might give additional privacy

Cctv might be beneficial to you - I had to install one and I got a Ring stick up camera which can be used outdoors and was £59 on amazon on offer from £89 and often comes on an offer to pay in 5 installments if you have Prime. I can monitor from my phone app and on an echo show. One thing I will advise is that if you do buy the stick up camera and the camera is activated a lot through movement, make sure you place it in easy reach to be able to take the battery out to charge it.

I'm sorry you're having to go through this and hope you get the problem sorted.

So it's a single story structure. How does it overlook your bedrooms?

Speak to the Police. You can log it on the 101 website if you cant get through on the phone.

Those suggesting cameras, you cant have a camera that looks into her neighbours garden. Massive breach of GDPR there.

The police don't answer calls anymore on 101 (we tried several times on advice of the council).

Don't be silly, of course they answer calls, it can just take a very long time. I was held in a queue recently for 40 minutes.

But I'm sure you know you can report online anyway.

You can't appeal to peoples' better natures when they don't have them. FIght it officially through the council - it's the only way.