Punished at school for saying ‘flipping heck’

[porkincider]

At pick up yesterday the teacher asked me to wait behind for a minute as my 8yo Ds had been put on red (they have a traffic light system- start on green, if really good go to silver and then gold, if naughty go to orange and then red. Get on red twice in a term and you have to go to the headmaster’s office). Ds has always been really good, he’s incredibly shy, hates drawing attention to himself and normally just bobs along on green every week.

He looked mortified when he came out and the teacher told me he’d had to go straight onto red for bad language during PE. Ds tried to say “I only said” but teacher interrupted and said “please don’t say it again, you’ll only get yourself into more trouble”. Anyway, he apologised, we walked home and that was that.

I asked him what he’d said and why when we got home and he told me he missed a goal in PE and said “oh, flipping heck”. I asked him if he was sure that was what he’d said, that he hadn’t said the F word but he was adamant he hadn’t and was in tears of frustration at this point as he kept trying to tell the teacher what he’d said but she just kept telling her not to repeat it.

I messaged the teacher on the school app and said “Ds is very sorry for upsetting you today. He’s adamant that he only said ‘flipping heck’ though and wanted me just tell you that he would never say anything ruder than that either at school or at home”. Teacher immediately messaged back to say that she was aware that was what he’d said, it was more the tone that he’d said it in that she was disappointed about (which wasn’t what she’d told me at pick up) and that I needed to ensure that he was aware that language of that type is not acceptable at school.

Is ‘flipping heck’ rude? I say it all the time and I’m certain that is where he’s picked it up from but I’ve never told him not to say it. I thought it was just a nonsense exclamation.

Maybe they screamed it and seemed to be directing anger at the goalie or something?

I would put ‘flipping heck’ as similar to ‘for goodness sake’ or ‘oh my goodness’

Intent to swear is just as bad!! You must be having a laugh. An intent to swear (if at yourself not aimed at someone) just means you have an intent to verbally express your frustration. Verbally expressing your emotions should be encouraged. The little boy expressed his frustration without swearing...he should be getting praised not punished!

@Foxhasbigsocks

I have intent to swear every day

This where an intensifier has best effect as in... "I have intent to swear every f*cking day"

I’m a teacher, and wouldn’t raise it as an issue if one of my class said it, however, I don’t encourage my own children to say it. Flipping heck is an example of a minced oath, which means words that are said to represent swear words. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minced_oath Therefore many people don’t see it as polite

The child was annoyed with himself for missing a goal. flipping heck was a mild term when I was growing up in 1960's rural Worcestershire used by children and adults alike. In no way was it ever conflated with swearing. The teacher was being ridiculous.

lincolnshireyellowbelly what do you encourage your children to say as an exclamation of frustration? Genuinely everything I can think of other than “oh no” is a minced oath.

It's definitely bad language, although of course it could have been worse. I wouldn't say it myself in front of kids and I would expect my kids to be reprimanded for saying it at school.

Essebtially they're saying that kids can't verbally vent their frustration at all which is ridiculous. If you miss a goal you're going to be annoyed and it's appropriate to use mild language to express it. It would be different if he shouted it aggressively in someone's face.

You're clearly not in Yorkshire.... this wouldn't even register where I live.

My mother and grandmother were saying 'Flippin 'eck' in Lancashire in the 1950s. I had no idea it was a 'minced oath' representing fucking hell. I thought it was a mild expression of frustration. I think the teacher was very heavy handed but perhaps saw the use of language differently than OP and her child. Perhaps a bit of cultural difference. I would probably leave it now but I think she could have just told him that it's something not to say in school. I'm sorry he's upset, clearly he didn't think it was unacceptable behaviour. I might send another email saying that you don't want to make an issue of it but your son was upset as it isn't something he knew was unacceptable and you would have preferred that it had been made clear before he was punished.

She's being over the top, a friend of mine had the same issue. Teachers saying they were using it in place of something when that wasn't the case. I'd ask to speak to the head if you feel unhappy about it. Flipping Hell is certainly not swearing. Is the school religious or is the teacher religious, maybe she takes offence at the hell bit? Hope you're ok, never nice getting collared.

Heck not Hell.

I just told Ds that everyone finds different things rude and his teacher found that rude for whatever reason. I still don’t know what I’m supposed to tell him is an acceptable exclamation though. None of the people who are saying flipping heck is rude will tell me what is deemed polite.

Think she's a bit ott, maybe a warning would've been better and to explain it's not something he should be saying at school.

It’s a CofE school, hence me ensuring that I don’t say “oh God” or “Jesus Christ” or “Peter, Paul and all the fucking apostles” as my dad would often say. I thought “flipping heck” was an acceptable substitute but clearly not.

Whoops, my 7 year old says this. I got into the habit of replacing 'for fuck sake' with 'flipping heck' around her and so naturally she picked up on it and now says it herself sometimes. I've never corrected her as I don't consider it a bad term, just a term you would use in frustration. I must be a terrible mother

Teacher is totally overreacting OP and I hope you tell them that on Monday! Hope your wee boy is okay. Might be worth teaching him that some words are okay for the house, but not at school/in public? There's been a few times where I've hissed at my daughter 'don't say that/don't use that word in public!' At home it's totally fine because I really don't give a fuck, worse things than a swear word. Again, I'm a terrible mother.

@porkincider

It’s a CofE school, hence me ensuring that I don’t say “oh God” or “Jesus Christ” or “Peter, Paul and all the fucking apostles” as my dad would often say. I thought “flipping heck” was an acceptable substitute but clearly not.

Maybe he could try the "aw man!", works for us geordies haha

They have gone too far though, poor bairn. Hope he's ok.

She's a berk

Fucking hell. I really thought I'd heard it all! Wtf am I reading? It's absolutely and utterly crackers. Saying 'oh bother' instead? We're not living in a famous five book.

It makes me very sad that photos of children are being moved from green to red. How humiliating for the children. I wish schools would realise behaviour policies like this are not ok.

@DysmalRadius

Intent to swear is just as bad. A lot of teachers know and can tell (by tone, circumstances, facial expressions etc) when a child's intent is to swear. Just because flipping heck comes out of their mouth doesn't mean it should be ignored.

So if a child gets angry and does their best to moderate their language and avoid swearing, you punish them anyway if you suspect that they actually wanted to swear? How on earth is that enshrined in the school behaviour policy?

What a ridiculous idea that the teacher can punish a child for the intent to swear! There used to be a song, 'You can't go to jail for what you're thinking', but in this school it seems you can, or at least be punished. I recall teaching abroad where the teaching was done in English but most of the pupils were bi-lingual and would chat in their language. On more than one occasion I said Do not use langauge like that in my classroom! leaving them worried that I actually understood their language when in reality I was going off their tone and mannerisms.

I remember being told off at 8 for swearing and I hadn't got a clue what the dinner lady was going on about. I'd only said to my friend "do you remember when I hurt this finger" stuck middle finger up and hadn't said anything vaguely resembling a swear word. Well done to the dinner lady for teaching me thst you could actually swear with your hands

Totally OTT to go straight for a red card. A verbal comment about choice of language would have been more than sufficient.

In secondary, unless it was swearing at someone and therefore being abusive, it was far more productive to just ask students to rephrase themselves with an alternative expression and laugh at some twee versions rather than getting all offended and down the discipline route.

My mother and grandmother were saying 'Flippin 'eck' in Lancashire in the 1950s. I had no idea it was a 'minced oath' representing fucking hell.

In Lancashire in the 1950s how often did anyone hear fucking hell? I never heard the word fuck until,Kenneth Tynan said it on TV in the early 1960s and even then I only read about his outburst.

I recall teaching abroad where the teaching was done in English but most of the pupils were bi-lingual and would chat in their language. On more than one occasion I said Do not use langauge like that in my classroom! leaving them worried that I actually understood their language when in reality I was going off their tone and mannerisms.

I once earned the respect of one pupil for being outraged at his rudeness when he asked if I had a punani. He was very impressed that I knew how rude he was being
My teenage years watching Goodness Gracious Me came in handy that day

@porkincider

I think the teacher probably misheard, assumed he said “fucking hell” but then decided to dig her heels in when I messaged her. I hate making a fuss at school but poor Ds was absolutely gutted about it and I feel like crap for letting him say it.

I agree. I dont think its problematic or warranted the punishment. You could cause a fuss but that could just make it worse. I would just make sure my child knew I believed them, that different people have different words they dont like, and that small injustices like this sometimes arent worth picking a battle over but we can let frustration out in a different way and at least you and he know the situation.