Landlord wants full notice even though selling property.

[gnomeathome]

Our landlord is selling the house we live in, he has given us until 31st August to move out. We have seen countless properties, put offers in etc but most are listed as 'available immediately' . We have lost out on 5 properties so far because we can't move immediately as we have a months notice to give. I have asked him if we can move within 2 weeks because of this issue and he said no, he wants the full months notice (or we would have to pay the difference in rent which we cannot afford to do).
We have had to have potential buyers looking at the house whilst we are still here and the landlord had the gall to say that we were making the house look small by being there whilst buyers and agents were coming around (we are a family). So could we 'pop out' during all viewings!

AIBU to think that not letting us leave early is just plain greedy? At this rate we wont find anywhere to move to that lines up perfectly to the eng of August. Do we legally have to give a months notice if they are the ones who have given us notice?

@jellybeansforbreakfast’e post is the best here

If he has not served you notice then you can stay put and he’ll have to serve you notice and it starts from there

If you don’t leave, he’ll have to evict you through the courts, a process that will take months and months minimum

It won’t even come to that

He can’t deduct unpaid rent from the deposit

You don’t need to let another living soul into your home for you don’t want to

If I were you, I’d do my homework with Shelter, and they will confirm all this.

Then I’d get a letter written to him that explains exactly what the rights here are, that there will be no further viewings of any kind until you leave

He hasn’t served notice properly so would have to do this

His ONLY chance here is for him to stop being a dick and hope that you find somewhere quickly and he lets you go as soon as you need to

Because it’s going to really fuck up his life if he has to force you to go.

The couple of weeks rent he’d ‘lose’ to you would pale into insignificance when it comes to legal fees etc.

You have all the powers here

Flex a little!

Landlord sounds really unreasonable. Check contract before refusing viewings though - ours states that we have to allow them a month before contract end

OP, do all your homework find out exactly what your rights are and work out the best strategy for you.
Do not tell the landlord that you have done all your homework or you know exactly what he's done wrong, let him find out the hard way.

Don't just flex a little OP
flex a lot

@Egeegogxmv

I'm not a landlord or a tenant, but the obvious way someone can become a landlord unintentionally is if they are willed a house with tenants in situ You are exactly right and thank you for pointing this out to me, it seems to me that this circumstance completely warrants the term accidental landlord.

No worries 😊 Apologies for the "obvious" too. I'm really trying to stop using that word!

I work for an EA and once the LL gives notice to the tenant, they are usually happy for the tenant to go asap, so that the house is vacant.

Up to 31 May they had to give you 6 months notice and from 1 June it is 4 months notice, so depending on what date they advised you, they should not be asking you to leave before then.

If they want you to go, then there should be some agreement that you can leave when you have found another property. It would be daft of him to insist that you give 1 months notice when they have asked you to leave.

I would contact Shelter and CAB for accurate advice.

SlimFast like he hasn't done it properly if he's just sent e mails.
Is there an agent ? If not I'd be on to Shelter or similar.

'When you rent you accept that at some point the property may be needed and the tenancy will end as a result. It’s shit, obviously, but that’s life. It’s one of the downsides of renting.'

But by exactly the same token, when a LL lets out a property, they accept that the tenants may choose to exercise their rights, which may mean no viewings when they are in situ and therefore periods of vacancy. It's shit, obviously, but that's life. It's one of the downsides of being a LL.

Why can you think the former is fine, but somehow feel the latter is unacceptable? Why it is, in your world, only tenants that need to accept incovenience and loss, but not LLs?

*sounds like (not SlimFast ) 🙄

@Maggiesfarm

It's unusual to only have a month's notice. Even in non covid times the notice period on either side is usually three months. However, landlords and tenants can and do negotiate that.

It is a pity your landlord will not release you from the full month but it really is not that long and hardly unreasonable. Of course your place will be easier to view unoccupied, it's highly likely your landlord will not get a tenant until you have gone and doesn't want to lose a month's rent.

If you only have to give a month's notice, I don't really understand what the problem is. Can you not cover this out of your deposit?

You say you have children, it seems a somewhat precarious existence for a family. A single or a couple without children can pick up and move far more easily and quickly.

I wish you good luck in finding somewhere suitable.

No, its normal for a month if its an AST and now a rolling tenancy which is essentially what ours is. Its 2 , maybe 3 months on LL side and 1 on the tenants. A month is not long, but it is proving to be too long for potential landlords to take us on. We keep losing out on properties because other people appear to be able to move in sooner (this is what EA and some private LL have told me) .

Yes it is precarious renting as a family. (This has happened to us before a year after moving in and I am tired of it). But we don't have another option.

[quote Librariesmakeshhhhappen]@Lucifersladylove

My mum inherited a house with tenants. Just because their landlord died and left his estate to my mum. She became their landlord. She couldnt just kick them out because that would be horrible and evicting someone isnt easy. She kept it on but said to them they could leave anytime, with no notice, or they could buy the property if they wanted. They ended up buying in another City and my mum then sold the property.[/quote]
But, once again, she could have sold it with tenants in situ as an investment property.

She'd have got less than the market value with vacant possession, but if she really didn't want the responsibility, at least she'd only have had it for a short while.

The landlord isn’t acting out of spite, he is just insisting on what the law says he is entitled to expect. Most decent tenants would accept this and not obstruct viewings etc as petty revenge for the landlord insisting on the full notice that was set out in the tenancy agreement that they both signed

Ahh, so landlords acting within the law are perfectly reasonable, but tenants who do the same are petty and spiteful 😂

The only thing that matters here is the law and the contract. There is no issue of ‘playing nice’ or having an easy ride for one side, but that both LL and tenant must meet their obligations about vacating the property.

Essentially, the LL needs legally to issue a S21 and give legal notice. Until that happens, a date for the tenant moving out isn’t set. Emails saying the property is being sold or asking them to go is invalid. The tenant is perfectly legally entitled to stay. Legal procedures must be followed.

At the point the legal notice is up, most tenants have vacated. Some don’t and at that point a LL can start legal proceedings to evict. Again, there are legal processes to go through.

No-one should be renting a property out without grasp if these laws and sticking to the timeframes. To not do so is like being an employer without a knowledge of employment law and employing people illegally.

So Op, you need to email your LL to point out you haven’t received a formal tenancy end notice S21. Simply tell him that if he wants the property vacated, he must go through the legal channels and abide by the terms of your contract. If you want to suggest an informal route, you might suggest you’d be willing to vacate sooner than this if he is willing to accept he won’t receive 4 weeks notice. If he wants 4 weeks notice, he will have to work to the timeframe you choose to give notice, not a non-official date he chooses to give without formal notice.

It sounds like you are trying to find alternative accommodation. That is fine. Keep doing that if you want to. Alternatively, accept you have a right to be there until formal notice is given and expires and enjoy your home.

the landlord had the gall to say that we were making the house look small by being there whilst buyers and agents were coming around (we are a family). So could we 'pop out' during all viewings!

Cheeky fucker.
Demand a Section 21 or you're not moving anywhere.

Incidentally, why come on this thread and comment on the OP renting rather than owning?

england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/eviction/eviction_notices_from_private_landlords

If he hasn't given you a proper eviction notice, then he is in trouble. Please get advice from Shelter or CAB, he needs to issue the relevant notice, which would start from the new date.

Get professional advice, then go back to him with that information, and state that you can of course move earlier than 4 months from now, if you don't have to give a months notice, in order to help him out. Make it sound like you are doing him a favour rather than threatening him.

[quote gnomeathome]@looptheloopinahulahoop Yes there is a deposit held in a deposit scheme. He said that any weeks short of the months notice would be taken out of the deposit. This is why I want to try and do it the right way.
I am just unsure about the legalities of if we have to give notice if he has given us notice. I will have a look on shelter and MSE. Everyone has been very helpful, thanks.[/quote]
It is very clear that the deposit cannot be used in lieu of unpaid rent, so he will not be able to do this.

We sent out tenants a case of good wine when we sold the house they were living in (our old home). We made it clear we would do everything we could to make things easier for them.

He is a Knob

Thanks, op. That is interesting information.

I'm so sorry you are in this predicament.

I said YABU because he’s well within his rights to stick to the one month’s notice. It’s short anyway, I have two months. However it seems you say he hasn’t hive you any notice? Give him notice, stop accommodating viewings and accept a few days of over lap between the tenancies. I’ve always found it helpful as could move and clean over a couple of days and not everything in one day.

In an ideal world everyone would find properties exactly when they need them, so no one lost any money. And councils/HA would be able to help people without them having to go through formal eviction, which is no good for tenants or landlords. Unfortunately that doesn't happen. The ultimate loser of not helping the tenant is the landlord. They can behave like a twat, but a clued up tenant will make them pay for it and it can be very expensive! Be warned caffeinated, the time will come when you want to sell and the law will protect your tenant since it cannot rely on you to not be a dick.
Also you aren't an accidental LL because you chose to move in with your boyfriend and rent out your house.

OP he can't just keep your deposit and deduct rent. That's why independent deposit schemes exist. He has to apply to do that and you get to appeal.

[quote gnomeathome]@looptheloopinahulahoop Yes there is a deposit held in a deposit scheme. He said that any weeks short of the months notice would be taken out of the deposit. This is why I want to try and do it the right way.
I am just unsure about the legalities of if we have to give notice if he has given us notice. I will have a look on shelter and MSE. Everyone has been very helpful, thanks.[/quote]
Ahahahahahahahahaha...

*he hasn't actually given you notice in the correct manner - therefore has not given you notice at all.

• He cannot withhold rent from the deposit.

You really hold all the cards here. In your shoes, I'd find somewhere, move, pay him his months notice in reasonable installments (and send him a letter stating that you will do so, so should he attempt small claims court they will tell him he is an idiot as he has a reasonable offer to pay already).

Alternatively, say nowt, stay put til you have saved the necessary funds to move/pay his notice period... and then give notice when you have that in place.

His date of 31st August is meaningless as he hasn't given you proper notice to leave, so you don't have to, and he can't make you.

I was under the impression that landlords had the right to access a property if they have 24 hours notice. I’ve always given my tenants 24 hours notice when I wish to enter a property. But you certainly don’t have to leave the property when they are doing viewings.

@DrinkFeckArseGirls

I said YABU because he’s well within his rights to stick to the one month’s notice. It’s short anyway, I have two months. However it seems you say he hasn’t hive you any notice? Give him notice, stop accommodating viewings and accept a few days of over lap between the tenancies. I’ve always found it helpful as could move and clean over a couple of days and not everything in one day.

Why would I give him notice when I don't have a property to live in yet!

I'm not certain that LL do have a right to enter the property with 24 hours notice - i think that might be the case for needing to do maintenance work but if it was too frequent that would be harassment and denying the tenant quiet enjoyment. Certainly the LL wouldn't have the right to do that for viewings.

I’d not allow any viewings, this is your legal right.