that the idea of registration for cyclists is silly, unworkable and unenforceable

[KihoBebiluPute]

This idea was featured on Radio 4 on monday morning and is also in the telegraph - Nick Freeman (the motorists loophole lawyer) is trying to drum up support for a scheme to force cyclists to register and display a number plate type thing.

I get that there are plenty of selfish and sometimes dangerous cyclists out there, but the numbers of deaths and injuries caused by dangerous cycling is a minuscule fraction of the numbers caused by careless driving and the whole idea seems totally unrealistic to me.

(1) For number plates to work as a reasonably reliable registration method for cars, the manufacture of number plates has to be quite tightly controlled - criminals do clone plates but it's not easy for an ordinary member of the public to get a plate without proof of ownership, and plates are fixed to the correct car and generally stay put. Any kind of wearable registration plate for cyclists would necessarily be something portable and would therefore be so easy to lose or nick that it would be functionally useless as a means of identification because there couldn't be any means to verifiably ensure that each plate was only ever carried by the correctly registered individual associated with that number plate.

(2) cyclists don't come into the world as fully formed MAMILs - and the sight of a 6 year old wobbling along the pavement next to a parent is quite normal. There's no sharp divide between a kid just learning and a fully independent cyclist, no test to pass or license to grant. There's just a gradual build up of skills and road-sense and a gradual reduction in parental supervision. so there's no rational way to define when someone should start being registered (presumably no one thinks it should apply to kids who are just learning)

(3) its frankly stupid to put up any kind of additional barrier to make it more complicated to make a trip by bike rather than getting in the car. It's currently just about a reasonable balance for me for a lot of journeys - a tiny bit of extra hassle to find my helmet and D-lock, but the benefit of not having to find or pay for parking balances that enough that some fraction of the car-miles I might otherwise make, generating traffic congestion and pollution, gets turned into the green alternative of cycling. Upset this balance by making it a legal requirement to wear and carry this proposed registration plate and the net effect will be to drive up car traffic at a time when we should be doing everything we can to achieve the opposite.

[quote Umbra]**@DynamoKev

Umbra

I think it's a brilliant idea.

As a motorbike rider and car driver, I have to be accountable for my actions via my numberplate - why not cyclists too.

Because you haven't given a moment's thought to the practicalities. There's plenty of information about why this is a stupid, pointless and unworkable idea on this thread.

Nah mate. Impractical? You're reaching there...[/quote]
So why has every country that tried it (apart from N Korea apparently) given up because it was too expensive to be worthwhile? What do you know from behind your keyboard that the countries that actually tried it don't?

The DVLA cost £425 million last year. How much will your cycle scheme cost? And why is it a better use of money stopping cyclists being annoying than drivers being deadly?

@Doctroo

Although I am dead against this idea, and would DIE rather than have anything welded to my precious steeds, for the flailing stumblebums who 'think' (huh, like they do) that this is a good idea - here are some ways it could be implemented:

1. When you buy a bicycle, you are issued with a packet of 12 helium balloons upon each of which is emblazoned a registration number. And some string. Before you ride, you must attach one of the balloons to your handlebars. It will then float serenely above you as you cycle around, making it easy to identify you if you transgress. If the balloon bursts or get lost, attach another. And when the packet runs out, you must purchase another one.

1. Keeping with the aerial theme, homing pigeons could be trained to follow you. Each pigeon would be ringed with a unique identification number linked to your home address. Should you transgress, the pigeon would be trained to fly to the nearest police station to grass you up.

1. What with GPS and smartphones and shit, there MUST be some way of applying this technology to track miscreant cyclists. There must be. Must be! MUST BE. MUST.

1. Squads of helicopters could hover above our cities, and police officers equipped with binoculars could ceaselessly scan the streets below. Miscreant cyclists can then be taken out by high-velocity rifle.

1. All new bicycles could be equipped with a sharp spike sheathed within the seat tube. Should the cyclist break the law, the spike would spring upward, spearing them through the clackervalve and lancing through their guts, thus terminating their life, and ending their TRANSGRESSING forever.

1. My favourite. All cyclists should have their eyes put out. Therefore, they would be unable to cycle. They would have to walk, tap tap tapping away with their white sticks, and guide dogs, not being a menace to anyone anymore.

Simple, sensible solutions for a better, safer world.

Until recent years I'd have had a chuckle at your ideas, loving the biting satire. Under present circumstances I expect most of them to be serious government policies by the end of the week.

@Doctroo pmsl and have noted the word clacker valve which shall be used at all opportunities henceforth

Registration plates no. Compulsory fucking bell use, YES. Cycling silently up behind pedestrians on a footpath, barely missing them and then shouting rudely when asked to warn ahead - ever wondered,all you accusers of cycle- hating, whether that's really ok. And no, it's not a few bad apples, it's a majority IME

Until recent years I'd have had a chuckle at your ideas, loving the biting satire.
Under present circumstances I expect most of them to be serious government policies by the end of the week.

Satire is supposed to be funny.

@toconclude

Registration plates no. Compulsory fucking bell use, YES. Cycling silently up behind pedestrians on a footpath, barely missing them and then shouting rudely when asked to warn ahead - ever wondered,all you accusers of cycle- hating, whether that's really ok. And no, it's not a few bad apples, it's a majority IME

That's because they don't like being "belled" at themselves. I don't. It smacks of "get out of my way, plebian pedestrian".

A friendly good morning or excuse me does the job.

I use a bell if a group is blocking a path, if it's one person I just call out.

But actually I ride more and more in my garage and use the virtual cycle programme Zwift because there are no drivers and no pedestrians (you get runners but you can't run them down). Bliss.

@looptheloopinahulahoop

Hey, a warning of any kind would be nice. Personally I don't care if I'm 'belled at', as long as I know someone is coming up behind. And I don't believe this has anything to do with not liking bells, they just don't see why they should acknowledge that pedestrians exist.

Cyclists all need rounding up and QR codes stamping on their back (and possibly their foreheads too.) That way when they run amok we can simply take out our phones scan them with an app which immediately reports them to the higher authorities.

Basically the Highway Code isn't fit for purpose as there are no rules for shared cycle/pedestrian paths apart from a lame paragraph

"If you are sharing a path, take extra care and give plenty of room to children, the elderly and disabled people. You should always be riding at a speed that would allow you to slow down and stop if necessary."

No requirement for pedestrians to leave space for cycles to pass them, especially if they are incapable of being warned without taking offence from "belling" or "yelling".

@NotMeNoNo

Basically the Highway Code isn't fit for purpose as there are no rules for shared cycle/pedestrian paths apart from a lame paragraph

"If you are sharing a path, take extra care and give plenty of room to children, the elderly and disabled people. You should always be riding at a speed that would allow you to slow down and stop if necessary."

No requirement for pedestrians to leave space for cycles to pass them, especially if they are incapable of being warned without taking offence from "belling" or "yelling".

If that was aimed at me, I don't 'take offence' at being warned, I'm grateful. It's silent, 'oops nearly crashed into you even if there was plenty of space, what do you mean a bell would have been nice, you're a stupid cunt for daring to suggest it" that I object to.

It could be done using similar technology to the congestion charge but would only be workable in larger cities, which is fine. I do think cyclists need to be registered / licensed / pass some kind of test before driving in a major city

@toconclude only slightly in response to you, there have been many previous threads about "dinging", you feel damned if you do and damned if you don't.

I feel bad whenever I call out or ring my bell people jump a mile and scatter like rabbits as if the last thing they expected on a cycle path was a cyclist, even one as slow as me.

clearly after all these pages there's no answer anyway.

It could be done using similar technology to the congestion charge

🤣

@impostersong

I was hit by a cyclist go at a stupid speed (I was stationary). Nearly wrote off my car the damage was so bad. Where is their liability?! No insurance so not paying up despite fault being clear (police and ambulance attended scene). Still fuming about it now. I'm all for better regulation, insurance should be required.

I'm calling bullshit on this. Stationary Car vs bike at high speed. Dead or seriously injured cyclist, minor bodywork damage to car. Basic physics.

@DynamoKev

I acknowledge cars are where we are, and therefore likely where we'll stay, but they are definitely shit. I will never relinquish this standpoint

You don't need to use mass transit for IKEA shopping, they come in electric delivery vehicles of course, in my utopia. There are automated pods or scooters in villages to connect to the mass transit.

I acknowledge the pollution from other sources too, happy to run a parallel campaign against wood burners

All I'd like is for cyclists to make themselves visible. My drive home includes narrow, leafy lanes and I've often encountered cyclists dresses all in black with no lights. If I did that in a car, I'd be getting pulled by the police.

QuestionableMouse
I agree with you.
I also think there should be more visible public information campaigns with information on cycling, which would include things like that. I'd I'd like the campaign to be similar to the motorbike one years ago and remind drivers that they should do a safe overtake when passing cyclists, motorbikes and horses. The obsession some have about moaning that they had to go onto the opposite side of the road and overtake safely instead of squeezing past is worrying. Would the drivers who squeeze past cyclists whilst frothing that their very important trip was delayed a few minutes be willing to stand in front of the yellow line on a train platform? Probably not. Yet for some reason they think passing a cyclist with a foot to spare in their giant metal box is apparently acceptable

There are more cars on road than smaller modes of transport and whilst many motorcyclists, horse riders and cyclists will typically also be drivers, there's a lot of drivers out there who only drive. The more awareness that can be raised, the better.

@Ozanj

It could be done using similar technology to the congestion charge but would only be workable in larger cities, which is fine. I do think cyclists need to be registered / licensed / pass some kind of test before driving in a major city

You clearly have no idea what the congestion charge is for or how it works do you?

Yes to riders using day time lights.

the TREK Flare RT is a great little light that can be seen from 2km away on its highest setting, pairs to a Garmin, so you can monitor battery life too.

Oh dear, poor cyclists taking umbrage.

@Umbra

Oh dear, poor cyclists taking umbrage.

@Umbra

Un fuckin believable!
Not only hogging the road, jumping lights and hitting cars/killing ourselves.... now taking umbrage... whatever next?

I just wish clubs wouldn’t hog the country roads causing huge huge tailbacks of traffic. Aren’t slow moving vehicles holding up others meant to pull in and let them pass?

@Letsallscreamatthesistene

Im not an 'anti cyclist twat' but I agree that the minority should be held accountable for dangerous road use when they're cycling like a bellend. I also think they should pay road tax.

I'm sure cyclists will be happy to pay road tax on the same basis car drivers do.

That'll be £0 a year, because road tax isn't a thing and hasn't been for decades so no car drivers pay it. They pay vehicle excise duty based on emissions, a bike would pay £0 VED as they are zero emissions.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

I just wish clubs wouldn’t hog the country roads causing huge huge tailbacks of traffic. Aren’t slow moving vehicles holding up others meant to pull in and let them pass?

Well I wish cars wouldn't hog the roads causing traffic jams and tailbacks!

I cycle with a club. We don't pull over for cars. We're normally cycling at about 20mph which I appreciate is slower than a car. But we have as much right to be there as the car and it's the car's responsibility to wait until it's safe to pass and overtake. If we stopped for every single car behind us we'd have to stop every minute - totally impractical on a 4 hour ride!

The only time I will pull over is if the road is so narrow it's physically impossible for a car to pass and I know the road will be so narrow for a few miles....but that's very rare.

I'm as a keen a cyclist as you d ever meet but the attitude that we have every right to be there and cars just have to wait, is one that causes huge friction between cars and cyclists, even if in law, its correct.

Stopping to avoid long tailbacks and staying off busy roads (where possible) is reasonable.

We might do 20mph + on the flat but we don't on the hills.

Move to the flatlands - no hills round here!